302 replies to this topic

[CMClueless]

Redshift2k5, on 19 November 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

sorry to burst your bubble, but when I asked directly during Ask The Devs 47 they denied they would release any additional battlemechs.

So my concerns were completely valid then? Well this is awfully depressing, and yet I feel validated in my concerns, especially considering the derision I have received almost instantly from some members of the community.

No doubt I am going to receive yet more contradictory evidence and comments now, to further increase my confusion.

However, I must thank you for giving genuine links and quotes on this matter, rather than snarky remarks or derision. It is very much appreciated.

[Bront]

Joshytclegg, on 19 November 2013 - 11:32 AM, said:

Okay, I really hate to be 'that guy' but I am kind of put off by the Shadow Hawk being the mech of the month. Of course the Shadow Hawk needs to be released to everyone, and yes it should happen this month, because we got the locust last month.

However, I raise a bit of issue with the fact that, if this trend continues, people who bought the Phoenix package, are going to have a very bland time until February-ish time, even longer if you bought the Saber reinforcement pack. Now don't get me wrong, I love my phoenix mechs (though finding builds I like is a pain in the rear end), however I would also like to see new mechs each month as usual. You have to understand that if they just release Phoenix mechs month after month, that no new work is going into game content for them, since the assets for these mechs already exist. Heck players may get bored of it, even if they do not have the Phoenix package, since these mechs are pretty darn prolific as it is right now.

I feel that, if they do nothing but release the Phoenix mechs for the next few months they may end up harming the community and causing a lot of boredom for the players. Release the Phoenix mechs, sure. Do so each month and give access to them for the wider community, but do not cease production of new mechs. We shouldn't have to endure through months of no new content in the community simply because we bought the Phoenix Package, that is not what we wanted when we bought it.

I hope by the end of November that we will see a brand new mech, or at least before the release of the Saber Reinforcements next month.

They did mention there might be a month where they release 2 mechs a month (one phoenix, one new), but that could mean the hero mechs they've been releasing.

They are doing some skin fixing of the older mechs that need it too, and that takes some dev time, and they are supposedly working on Clan mechs (so maybe when the clans finally come out, they can release 8-12 mechs at once). At some point, new IS mechs were going to dry out, as it's hard to bring a lot new to the table given how hardpoints work, though it would be nice to get at least one more 30-40 ton non-chicken walker, a 95 ton mech, maybe a chicken walker assault, another light (could be the non-chicken walker mentioned earlier), another 40-45 ton medium (again, could be the non-chicken walker), and at least 1 more 70-75 ton heavy. Yes, I realise that's a fairly large list, but when phoenix is over, we'll have 0 95 tonners, and more than one of a particular tonnage only in the 35 (2), 50 (2), 55(4!), 60 (2), 65(3), 80(2) and 85(2) ton range. What's good for aiming folks towards the middle, and I'm fine with there only being 1 mech in the extremes ( 30 and below, and 90 and above), but there should be at least 2 for most models in between, and it's annoying in the 35-40 ton range all 3 are chicken walkers. But, if it doesn't happen because of clans, I guess I won't complain.

CapperDeluxe, on 19 November 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

I think you fail to understand they're still working on new mechs and are continuing to put out one new mech EVERY month, they even hinted at another light mech that hasn't been announced yet. I'm hoping for the Panther personally.

The only hint about a light mech I've heard outside of the Flee is the next light hero comes in spring of 2014, so either no jenner hero in January, or that's considered spring in Canada (or whoever said that was wrong).

[Tooooonpie]

BUDFORCE, on 19 November 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

To all Spider pilots:

hahahahahahahhahahahhaahahahahahahahhaahah!!!

....end

Couldn't put it better myself - Actually I could, capitals!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAH!!!!

[Lynx7725]

Victor Morson, on 19 November 2013 - 12:04 PM, said:

I was hoping this patch could have involved 5 minutes of editing the XML file to make LBX/10s, flamers or MGs not entirely worthless, but... effort. I do like the hit box changes, though. And finally getting rid of that infinite shake bug is an automatic +1. PS: The Orion's problem wasn't it's CT but it's "all front arc" shoulder hunch so...

LB-10X worthless? My good sir, I'd like to introduce you to my FB twin LB-10x build.. And even as skeptical as I am about the worth of MGs, I have to say they are annoyingly effective. Emphasis on annoying but still, effective.

Personally my take on the Orion is that if you even turn a wee bit sideways, your side torso is going to take all the hits and drop off rapidly. Expanding the side boxes might make me take non-XL in my Orions, thankfully my OINK is already having that IIRC.

[Victor Morson]

You know, I think they dole these things out as slow as possible so every time morale drops, they can go "We improved the LBX/10!" like it was something that took months of research to accomplish.

Lynx7725, on 19 November 2013 - 12:08 PM, said:

LB-10X worthless? My good sir, I'd like to introduce you to my FB twin LB-10x build.. And even as skeptical as I am about the worth of MGs, I have to say they are annoyingly effective. Emphasis on annoying but still, effective.

Nobody serious agrees.

Also nobody should be saying they don't need a buff, which is all I'm saying. I'm not saying you are a fool for liking them, I am saying that it's kind of ridiculous they can't dedicated less than 5 minutes to fixing some of this stuff and toying with small buffs and nerfs every single patch.

Again, this patch does seem to be a step in the right direction. But there is no excuse they couldn't have taken just a little bit more of a step there. Would it have killed them to give the LBX/10 a slightly faster refire or slightly more pellets or something? Would it have hurt them to change a LPL duration by a few miliseconds? It's one number. That's my point. That's why I'm saying "Why is this the third patch in a row we have no updates?"

I am starting to believe we are repeating the scenario from last year, where the only devs authorized to fix this stuff have all decided to take a vacation at the same time and/or just stop again. Maybe they're worried about UI2.0, if you're optimistic. But that is no reason they can't keep up the pace of the balance updates they had going just before launch, because that whole "We're going to make a super effort guys! LAUNCH WOO!" attempt really, really looks terrible in retrospect when now you just stop doing anything with balance directly for several patches.

Edited by Victor Morson, 19 November 2013 - 12:14 PM.

[Roadbeer]

Victor Morson, on 19 November 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

Nobody serious agrees.

Hyperbole and Opinion 2 fer!

[Nathan Foxbane]

Joshytclegg, on 19 November 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

So my concerns were completely valid then? Well this is awfully depressing, and yet I feel validated in my concerns, especially considering the derision I have received almost instantly from some members of the community.

No doubt I am going to receive yet more contradictory evidence and comments now, to further increase my confusion.

However, I must thank you for giving genuine links and quotes on this matter, rather than snarky remarks or derision. It is very much appreciated.

While I do not wish to add to your confusion, after the above mentioned Ask the Devs was posted, your worry became an implied risk to all Project Phoenix and Saber purchasers.

Edited by Nathan Foxbane, 19 November 2013 - 12:15 PM.

[Mister Blastman]

BUDFORCE, on 19 November 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

To all Spider pilots:

hahahahahahahhahahahhaahahahahahahahhaahah!!!

....end

To you:

hahahahahahahahahahhaa.

... end.

Newsflash: Hit detection hasn't been fixed. Just hit boxes. Your damage will still roll off all mechs as badly as it was yesterday, today.

Spiders were never hard to kill even before this change. They were a simple joke to smash.

So where are the "aggressive" balance changes we need for the gameplay? Nothing in this patch...

[Fang01]

Zekester81, on 19 November 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

Someone mentioned a Panther? I want a Panther...

The patch notes look good. I say "look" good, I hope they work as well as they sound, because this will be a lot of fun.

Or Wolfhound...

[stjobe]

Parazaine, on 19 November 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

That's primarily due to the hit registration issues for fast-movers. Once that's fixed, people won't have to leg lights to kill them, they will actually be able to hit them.

Legging a light is, always has been, and now even more than ever will be the easiest way to take them out, especially if they're good.

And when hit registration is finally fixed, a lot of people will still complain that it's broken - because they're just that poor shots.

aniviron, on 19 November 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

Most players (excluding UNSKILLED light pilots) are looking forward to the real problem being addressed

Yes.

aniviron, on 19 November 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

so players don't play lights as if they are in an assault brawler mech.

That only happens in forum posts.

aniviron, on 19 November 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

Lights have a specific niche, fast recon and in packs: anti-assault mechs.

Stop trying to diminish the role of the lights; there are both strikers and snipers as well as scouts and recon 'mechs in the light weight class. Trying to shoehorn them into your narrow-minded view of what a light 'mech is capable of is doing the game a disservice.

And if that's not enough, this is a PvP game where every 'mech needs to have a viable and workable role or it won't be used at all, so even if you had been right from a TT perspective (which you're not, just ask the Panther or Hollander if they're "fast recon"), you're wrong from a MWO perspective.

aniviron, on 19 November 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

They were never meant to be able to take (and i really mean AVOID) damage like they can currently.

Yes they were. Well, perhaps not exactly like they can currently; HSR and hit detection needs to be fixed - but one of a light's primary defenses is exactly to be able to avoid taking damage; in case you missed it, they're not exactly thick-skinned.

[CMClueless]

Roadbeer, on 19 November 2013 - 12:04 PM, said:

You missed the point.
You went on your diatribe about being disappointed that no new mechs would be released in concurrence with the Phoenix mechs being released to the rest.

So in short, you purchased 4 to 6 months worth of content and received it in one lump sum, while those who didn't, have to wait. Yet you want to have more content released for you, because you've finished your candy and want more, while others haven't been able to enjoy theirs yet.

This, good sir, is what's called entitlement.

No, it isn't entitlement, sadly it seems I will have to explain myself to you here, when I hoped that you would at least be smart enough to grasp the concept I presented to you.

Regardless of whether or not I bought a Phoenix pack, the game still runs into this community issue. The issue is that, even if one does not have access to certain content, which may be in a period of exclusivity, the saturation of said content, and it's presence within the game, creates a state in which the game reaches a plateau in the experience, with nothing fresh to add further discussion outside of the game, or significant gameplay values within the game, it can cause a very stale experience for players.

For example, I have my Phoenix mechs and many other mechs in game, I fight against such in game. I do not however own a Hunchback. If the Hunchback was an exclusive mech for one month and then released to the general community the next month as the 'new' mech, then the gamestate does not change over that time in terms of content, the matches will not change in mix or variety, it all remains the same.

Releasing the Phoenix mechs to the community does nothing to liven up or change the gamestate. It will remain the same and could very rapidly become very bland due to lack of new content, the game will not change over these next few months in terms of content and variety. It will be improved functionally, but without new mechs or maps, it becomes a stale experience, rather than a varied and interesting one. Introducing new stimulus is a way to keep the community alive and active. Wanting a company to make new content and keep changing their gamestate is not entitlement, it is expectation and hope.

It also comes down to simple marketing and business. You want to instill good respect for your business within the community, then you should do so by innovating, whether it be through new content, features or even gameplay when it comes to games. Anyone with even the remotest business acumen could spot that.

The Phoenix pack was a fantastic way to make money, but the very nature of the pack has stimied the innovation and pacing of the game, and they should not just let that sit and fester, they need to deal with it and realise that their content production can't take a back seat without also creating a stale gamestate.

[DrSlamastika]

Nothing about fix of missiles Catapul . . so sad.

[NuclearPanda]

Victor Morson, on 19 November 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

Also nobody should be saying they don't need a buff, which is all I'm saying.

Hi, my name is Nobody. I'd like to take this chance to ask you to stop putting words into my non-existant mouth.

And for the record, LB's don't need a buff.

[Deathlike]

Pwnocchio, on 19 November 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

The bit about XP/C-Bills for countering ECM, does that apply to all devices that can counter ECM (BAP, TAG, UAV, ECM in Counter-mode) or *just* for ECM in counter mode?

It's just an ECM bonus... that's it. ECM isn't really used for Countering (but they are already used for missile protection as is, so it's kinda silly IMO).

I'm not liking the projection for the Atlas hitbox change... it seems to me that the CT should be bigger and the sides should be smaller. The most effective thing to do to cripple an Atlas is to remove its sides since the time it takes to core an Atlas is kinda long as it is (it can still be short due to poor torso twisting and armor setups). It is a lot more productive to do so (including stripping the ECM/missile side of an Atlas).

Oh well, go figure.

[Xeno Phalcon]

Mister Blastman, on 19 November 2013 - 12:16 PM, said:

To you:

hahahahahahahahahahhaa.

... end.

Newsflash: Hit detection hasn't been fixed. Just hit boxes. Your damage will still roll off all mechs as badly as it was yesterday, today.

Spiders were never hard to kill even before this change. They were a simple joke to smash.

So where are the "aggressive" balance changes we need for the gameplay? Nothing in this patch...

[Victor Morson]

NuclearPanda, on 19 November 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

Hi, my name is Nobody. I'd like to take this chance to ask you to stop putting words into my non-existant mouth.

And for the record, LB's don't need a buff.

If they want to be remotely worth the tonnage of an AC/5 or even AC/10, they do.

[DyDrimer]

I haven't played a game yet that has been able to fix lag shields on small fast moving objects and i don't think pgi will be the first to do it, so as long as spider runs...spider lives, I do see them being legged more often.

[NuclearPanda]

Victor Morson, on 19 November 2013 - 12:21 PM, said:

If they want to be remotely worth the tonnage of an AC/5 or even AC/10, they do.

They're definitely worth the tonnage when you factor in crit damage. *shrugs*

Strip the armor with something else and then lay into them with LB's. They're quite effective if you use them properly.

What DOES need adjusting are pulse lasers and SRMs/Hit Detection in general.

[Sephlock]

stjobe, on 19 November 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

Bigger leg hitboxes = easier to leg 'mech. It's what happened to the Raven, it'll be what happens to the Spider.

Most people seem to have learned that the easiest way to kill a light is to leg it first, and this (both increasing leg hitboxes and splitting the pelvis between left and right leg) will only serve to weaken lights already weak position as a 'mech of choice.

As a primarily light pilot, I'm not sure I'm entirely happy about this change.

I think they need to focus on fixing their hit detection before enlarging any leg hitboxes on any lights.

On the other hand, they could treat this situation like they did the WAH WAH I GET ROCKED BY DAKKA situation: as an opportunity to release a new module!

[PropagandaWar]

stjobe, on 19 November 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

Bigger leg hitboxes = easier to leg 'mech. It's what happened to the Raven, it'll be what happens to the Spider.

Most people seem to have learned that the easiest way to kill a light is to leg it first, and this (both increasing leg hitboxes and splitting the pelvis between left and right leg) will only serve to weaken lights already weak position as a 'mech of choice.

As a primarily light pilot, I'm not sure I'm entirely happy about this change.

I think they need to focus on fixing their hit detection before enlarging any leg hitboxes on any lights.

I think this is fine and it should be adjusted after they get down to the bottom of HSR.