269 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Darth Bane001, on 02 December 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

Just because they can be killed with the right team using their mechs like they should doesn't mean they can be annoying as hell, it's just a cheap way to play when you have half a dozen users on the other team just spamming ac20's it's a bit out of control. They dont really break the game but it's just not that much fun always going against the same kind of builds.

This is depending on who is or isn't having fun. Killing your enemy is fun. Dying isn't. Now if I wanna have fun I play the Mech that kills my enemy the best. That is fun for me. Which is what I am here for. So I can have fun. When I drop with other Lawmen I drop so WE can have fun. If I dropped with you I would want US to have fun. See how this works. Its up to you to do what is fun for you not for me. If we played this game so only I had fun, we'd be playing a much more terminal game. Where I could kill even an Atlas in one salvo, with the right combo of weapons. I would also die in one salvo under the same circumstances.

[Randalf Yorgen]

Joseph Mallan, on 02 December 2013 - 06:48 AM, said:

This is depending on who is or isn't having fun. Killing your enemy is fun. Dying isn't. Now if I wanna have fun I play the Mech that kills my enemy the best. That is fun for me. Which is what I am here for. So I can have fun. When I drop with other Lawmen I drop so WE can have fun. If I dropped with you I would want US to have fun. See how this works. Its up to you to do what is fun for you not for me. If we played this game so only I had fun, we'd be playing a much more terminal game. Where I could kill even an Atlas in one salvo, with the right combo of weapons. I would also die in one salvo under the same circumstances.

Actually Joseph, getting killed can be lots of fun IF it's a good game, say 5 on 3 and the 3 pull a goal line stance and in the end one of the three walk off the field victorious, or if it's an actual well played game but the other team just played better. I don't mind getting killed in those matches because that's how it should be, the better team won. I enjoy losing a great battle as much as winning one, I don't like crushing the other team with no challenge.

I have even walked away from an obvious new player becasue they couldn't figure out how to combat me and were over heating just from shooting at the air that was nowhere close to where I was. (MM for the win in those games) I'll general message them and suggest chain fire or breaking up their weapons until they can afford to get either Double heatsinks or fully outfit their mech. I might also try to help them out by giving in game tips like trying to stay close to the rest of their team and try to fire at what they are shooting at.

I have also said sorry when I have had to kill enemy like that because they were able to manouver but couldn't fight and I needed to get to their base as that was the game plan for that match.

[Ecto Cooler]

Darth Bane001, on 02 December 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

Just because they can be killed with the right team using their mechs like they should doesn't mean they can be annoying as hell, it's just a cheap way to play when you have half a dozen users on the other team just spamming ac20's it's a bit out of control. They dont really break the game but it's just not that much fun always going against the same kind of builds.

Who are you to determine what is a "cheap" way to play the game? You don't get to make-up your own rules to fit how YOU enjoy the game.

If they don't break the game you have no grounds to complain about how other people play.

[VoltarDark]

A small range adjustment is not really a nerf, Ac20 dmg stay the same.
Reducing it's max range to 540 will only help to even it's use with the AC10.
Its will also help to add some diversity in the battle lineup.

Except that (AC20), the game feel pretty balanced in term of weapons.

[Joseph Mallan]

Randalf Yorgen, on 02 December 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

Actually Joseph, getting killed can be lots of fun IF it's a good game, say 5 on 3 and the 3 pull a goal line stance and in the end one of the three walk off the field victorious, or if it's an actual well played game but the other team just played better. I don't mind getting killed in those matches because that's how it should be, the better team won. I enjoy losing a great battle as much as winning one, I don't like crushing the other team with no challenge.

I have even walked away from an obvious new player becasue they couldn't figure out how to combat me and were over heating just from shooting at the air that was nowhere close to where I was. (MM for the win in those games) I'll general message them and suggest chain fire or breaking up their weapons until they can afford to get either Double heatsinks or fully outfit their mech. I might also try to help them out by giving in game tips like trying to stay close to the rest of their team and try to fire at what they are shooting at.

I have also said sorry when I have had to kill enemy like that because they were able to manouver but couldn't fight and I needed to get to their base as that was the game plan for that match.

I agree with most of this. But my Inner Grunt does like to completely obliterate my enemy as much as I can. I can enjoy the well executed execution of my team by a better opponent. I just like one more than the other.

[Randalf Yorgen]

Joseph Mallan, on 02 December 2013 - 07:06 AM, said:

I agree with most of this. But my Inner Grunt does like to completely obliterate my enemy as much as I can. I can enjoy the well executed execution of my team by a better opponent. I just like one more than the other.

So do I, if it's a balanced Match and my team simply got the Jump on the other team. No one really likes a steamroll

[Cimarb]

Randalf Yorgen, on 02 December 2013 - 06:05 AM, said:

would love to see the old ammo values brought back, then AC users would have to choose a little more carefully when to pull the trigger. Also changing the reload times would be good as well. AC20 = 10 seconds AC10 = 7seconds AC5 = 4 seconds AC2 = 1 second. This gives the AC2 and AC 20 the same DPS over 10 seconds The AC 5 gets a slight boost to 25 in 10 and the AC10 becomes the best with 30 points in 21 seconds. Restore the old ammo values and no one will be able to sit there and dakka dakka for the whole 15 minutes AND people will have to bring back-up weapons like Medium Lasers and what not.

Ran 5 matches in a row lastnight where there were between 3 and 8 ac40's on the other team and none of the names were the same. It is a little out of control at this point.

That is silly. In TT, you only could shoot each weapon once per cycle, meaning an AC20 did TEN TIMES the damage per second of an AC2. The balance was range, weight/space and ammo.

The damage per second of the autocannons is perfect as it is right now - that doesn't need changed at all. It is the delivery and range of that damage that needs addressed. Make the autocannons fire bursts instead of a single slug (with a module or special ammo maybe to have slug/LBX-type shots?) and then adjust the ranges to more consistent values (x2 range like everything else and a consistent modifier off of TT hex values for all weapons across the board).

[Joseph Mallan]

VoltarDark, on 02 December 2013 - 07:03 AM, said:

A small range adjustment is not really a nerf, Ac20 dmg stay the same.
Reducing it's max range to 540 will only help to even it's use with the AC10.
Its will also help to add some diversity in the battle lineup.

Except that (AC20), the game feel pretty balanced in term of weapons.

I am behind this. An AC20 should not be able to match a AC10 for long range. Cut back our range for a proper feel.

[Jon Gotham]

Joseph Mallan, on 02 December 2013 - 05:25 AM, said:

So... you are using a in game counter to the dual AC20. Thank you sir. For playing the game and not asking for a Gimme!

hehe true, but....does not mean I like facing 3+ AC40 derpers does it?
I take almost twisted pleasure in getting my spider on one stripping those ballistic points off and leaving them to get murdered
You want to bring a weapon combo that delvers freakish levels of damage in one shot? I'll make it my mission that game to ruin yours:)
It's one of the reasons I'm gradually going light mech exclusive-too many high apha derp wannabees, and lights seem to be able to harrass them nicely:)

[Joseph Mallan]

kamiko kross, on 02 December 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

hehe true, but....does not mean I like facing 3+ AC40 derpers does it?
I take almost twisted pleasure in getting my spider on one stripping those ballistic points off and leaving them to get murdered
You want to bring a weapon combo that delvers freakish levels of damage in one shot? I'll make it my mission that game to ruin yours:)
It's one of the reasons I'm gradually going light mech exclusive-too many high apha derp wannabees, and lights seem to be able to harrass them nicely:)

I don't know many that would like facing that! BUT as House Steiner does like its heavy hitting weapons I can actually see a reason for there to be a glut of this kind of build in House Steiner forces!

[Mc JR]

Everyone that was having a b*tch fest over PPC's is now coming after the AC 20 because PGI screwed with the PPC's. Stop call weapons OP there are ways to beat them like: move faster, stay out of their max dmg range, or God for bid build one your self ( can't beat them join them right?) This craps getting old. Stop winning and figure out how to beat them like my self and others. examples to fallow.

PPC boats I stoped playing my atlas and went to a BJ and ran behind them, they eather turn to face me giving my team the rear shot or they didn't and gave me the rear shot. Or I played one my self and went after the PPC boats on the other team.

AC 40 boats, Stay out of range of max dmg, and return fire with my 4 AC 5's or use my own and hunt down the AC 40 boats on the other team.

[Cimarb]

Mc JR, on 02 December 2013 - 08:50 AM, said:

Everyone that was having a b*tch fest over PPC's is now coming after the AC 20 because PGI screwed with the PPC's. Stop call weapons OP there are ways to beat them like: move faster, stay out of their max dmg range, or God for bid build one your self ( can't beat them join them right?) This craps getting old. Stop winning and figure out how to beat them like my self and others. examples to fallow.

PPC boats I stoped playing my atlas and went to a BJ and ran behind them, they eather turn to face me giving my team the rear shot or they didn't and gave me the rear shot. Or I played one my self and went after the PPC boats on the other team.

AC 40 boats, Stay out of range of max dmg, and return fire with my 4 AC 5's or use my own and hunt down the AC 40 boats on the other team.

So you are saying the solution to any situation is to "accept and move on." Thank you for that constructive post. I have accepted it, now please move on.

Back to the issue - I don't think Autocannons are overpowered. That doesn't mean they don't need to be adjusted. Making their ranges more consistent, as well as changing how they distribute that damage, is what we are talking about (OP and trolls excluded).

[BlackDrakon]

AC/20 are great but only when the mech u are shooting at register the damage.

Ive been in lots of games where the AC/20 hits and the paper doll is still yellow....

[Ghost_19Hz]

Unless the AC/20 got a buff recently, its not "too good". The guass is just not very good now. Yes charge up is annoying and causes many missed opportunities, but the bottom line is that by adding .75 onto its reload, it got a damage nerf. You can't argue that really, its math. I also can't argue the nonsensical damage differential of the 20 vs the 10.

Hell i even made macro's to make the gauss always charge itself, and one left click of the mouse fires it with the PPC's firing a tiny bit before(since gauss was made faster than PPC, it helps to zero the weapons at ~600m). But i just felt disappointed with the direction the dev chose for that weapon(not everyone can macro/wants to), so in protest, i wont use it until it changes.

Long story short, all my mechs with Guass and PPC's either changed into AC/20+LL's, or got shelved hoping for the removal of the lame charge mechanic. With PPC minimum range castration, LL's are still better even with the heavy handed ghost heat on them. So boo hoo about AC20 all you want, eventually i'm sure the devs will ruin it and then i will equip 2 AC/5's in its place and we can boo hoo about AC/5's then.

[Cimarb]

BlackDrakon, on 02 December 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

AC/20 are great but only when the mech u are shooting at register the damage.

Ive been in lots of games where the AC/20 hits and the paper doll is still yellow....

This would also be "fixed" to an extent if they were changed to damage over time (hitscan) like lasers - it may not register all of the damage, but it would be the majority of it at least, so see, it's a buff!

Edited for spellcheck fail...

Edited by Cimarb, 02 December 2013 - 04:59 PM.

[Mystere]

kamiko kross, on 02 December 2013 - 05:21 AM, said:

In my games, I'm seeing them rofling pretty much anything they face. If I happen to be in an lrm mech-they are first target until they are dead.

I dismembered one last night using an artillery strike. You can't get any more satisfaction than that.

Edited by Mystere, 02 December 2013 - 02:58 PM.

[Galenit]

Joseph Mallan, on 02 December 2013 - 07:21 AM, said:

I am behind this. An AC20 should not be able to match a AC10 for long range. Cut back our range for a proper feel.

Its the whole line, cutting only the ac20 down will lead to a problem with the ac10 then and so on ...

Lets the gauss maybe have its 3x range,
the mg should stay the same as it is now,
but the ac-line should be reduced to 2x range in the whole.

Edited by Galenit, 02 December 2013 - 04:10 PM.

[Victor Morson]

Ecto Cooler, on 02 December 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

Who are you to determine what is a "cheap" way to play the game?

If it beats them and they don't want to learn to counter it, it's cheap.

[Whatzituyah]

Victor Morson, on 02 December 2013 - 04:10 PM, said:

If it beats them and they don't want to learn to counter it, it's cheap.

Sometimes the counter of such cheap move actually is the most annoying to do. Would you really like too dodge a spammer a cheap character in a fighting game one move after the other?

Edited by Whatzituyah, 02 December 2013 - 05:28 PM.

[Mystere]

Whatzituyah, on 02 December 2013 - 05:15 PM, said:

Sometimes the counter of such cheap move actually is the most annoying to do.

Well, you gotta do what you gotta do to defeat the enemy, no matter how distasteful the deed.

Whatzituyah, on 02 December 2013 - 05:15 PM, said:

Would you really like too dodge a spammer a cheap character in a fighting game one move after the other?

Why dodge when you can annihilate them totally instead?