424 replies to this topic

[Mudhutwarrior]

I had to give up one successful build because of the nerf with its primary being ac10s. Sad as I had to do it several times this last year. The AC20 not so bad but still lost some ability to get those ranged shots with some movement. At 400+ I can actually watch mechs duck and jink out of the way now.

My issue is none of this comes with any explanation but instead a decree. Mechwarriors has become the new gamer Scientology. Pretty much have to accept that some dude hiding in a darkened room is shouting instructions to his minions and if it make sense or not they have to follow the dictates .Then the diehard followers use every trick in the book to suppress dissent and cover the leaders tail. Thank god for hypnosis.

[o0Marduk0o]

Mudhutwarrior, on 10 January 2014 - 04:48 AM, said:

I had to give up one successful build because of the nerf with its primary being ac10s. Sad as I had to do it several times this last year. The AC20 not so bad but still lost some ability to get those ranged shots with some movement. At 400+ I can actually watch mechs duck and jink out of the way now.

Weapons are back where they have to be. You complain about difficulties in hitting mechs at 400+m with a weapon with 270m optimal range?
Even the AC10 change is fine. I feel no change with my 2x AC10 + PPC build and only slightly notable differences beyond AC optimal range.

[Evil Ed]

I've changed my mind, the nerfs are ok. Now it takes some skill to land the 40dmg at the same spot, not just fire the 2xPPC/AC20 in one big alfastrike. Still doing fine in my Victor, but takes a lot less pinpoint damage as I keep moving and twisting.

[Bagheera]

Mudhutwarrior, on 10 January 2014 - 04:48 AM, said:

I had to give up one successful build because of the nerf with its primary being ac10s. Sad as I had to do it several times this last year. The AC20 not so bad but still lost some ability to get those ranged shots with some movement. At 400+ I can actually watch mechs duck and jink out of the way now.

My issue is none of this comes with any explanation but instead a decree. Mechwarriors has become the new gamer Scientology. Pretty much have to accept that some dude hiding in a darkened room is shouting instructions to his minions and if it make sense or not they have to follow the dictates .Then the diehard followers use every trick in the book to suppress dissent and cover the leaders tail. Thank god for hypnosis.

Neither weapon was really affected all that much by this - which has been my point all along. Make a minor adjustment to your lead and pretty much nothing changes. There were much better ways to de-couple AC20 from PPC (for example, bonus range and damage fall-off curves to keep it a short range weapon), but instead the path of least resistance was chosen, only changing things dramatically for people who truly cannot aim. I could barely be described as an "average" player and it's really not that much harder to take advantage of the 3x range on either the 20 or the 10.

Basically this was either lip service change or a misunderstanding of the mechanics involved.

[l33tworks]

2 patches from now. AC/20 now deals 15 damage.

Edited by l33tworks, 10 January 2014 - 07:09 AM.

[WM Jeri]

l33tworks, on 10 January 2014 - 07:08 AM, said:

2 patches from now. AC/20 now deals 15 damage.

OH! Like double heatsinks! I get it!

[MrRuLZ]

Ok guys, to start with, I am playing from europe, and I have a ping around 150

The main problem is that not only the projectiles are a lot slower, but due to this, the number of false positive hits (when you see the sparks on the mech, but it doesn't register. It was already pretty high before) just SKYROCKETED. Hitting a spider or a jenner is now just a matter of pure luck, and this goes for every mech that goes above 80 km/h.
Is anyone facing the same issue?

Another example, is the shadowhawk hitbox when using jumpjet, that was already a joke (taking 1/10 damage of what it should, a lot of time), and now it manage to become even worse when using an AC 10/20 weapon.

As a game developer myself, I am really wondering about the decision making process in this team, as a lot of changes seems just to be 100% arbitrary with about 0 thinking and even less playtesting.

I would have said that the weapons were relatively well balanced before the patch.

PS: it seems that they also modified the convergence of the AC 10/ AC20, can someone confirm that? it feels completly aweful on my jagger with both mounted!

Edited by MrRuLZ, 10 January 2014 - 12:31 PM.

[Burpitup]

Sure makes since to nerf the ac 20. Why the heck can't they fix it before they nerf it. It still has a problem with registering hits. Jackasses.

[Bagheera]

WM Jeri, on 10 January 2014 - 07:30 AM, said:

OH! Like double heatsinks! I get it!

That would be 14 damage.

[Krujiente]

I have absolutely no problem with this Nerf, as a medium Hunchback 4H, Shadowhawk, and Yen Lo wang owner. If I see a shot coming from those AC40 jagers that just kinda stand completely still unflinching at incoming fire. At medium range I can literally torso twist my vital bones out of the way. And by the time I get to brawl range I am moving too fast for it to do anything accurately but unlock its arms and do the Jager-Shuffle while I pop out its side armor with a well placed AC20 shot or two along with laser fire.

I just can't chase jenners with my Yen Lo Wang going 110 KPH and put a bowling-ball sized hole in them, and I can live with that.

[Soulscour]

Does this mean its going to be harder to hit moving lights with the AC20?

[ShadowDarter]

I am enjoying the changes to the AC20/AC10 makes them more skilled based weapons instead of snap shot weapons, I will admit though AC5s are preferable in most cases imho because of the rounds per tonne. most of the times

[Strum Wealh]

So... perhaps I haven't been calibrated to notice it, but are the submunitions of the LB 10-X still at the previous projectile speed, or did the LB 10-X projectile speed change to match that of the AC/10?

Edited by Strum Wealh, 10 January 2014 - 11:19 PM.

[Krujiente]

Soulscour, on 10 January 2014 - 10:08 PM, said:

Does this mean its going to be harder to hit moving lights with the AC20?

Pretty much, my days of chasing lights with a Yen Lo and one-shotting them are over. That's why I have pulse lasers though.

[Brut4ce]

C'mon mechwarriors, can you not see the "The Plan"?

They are gradually evolving mech combat to the ultimate level of fun....
When we finally have no viable weapon choices and combos, they are going to put collisions back into the game and then we will finally experience the level of combat we have all been dreaming about......MECH BOWLING! 15mins of pure fun and awesomeness!!!!!!

<S>

[ShadowDarter]

Brut4ce, on 11 January 2014 - 12:24 AM, said:

C'mon mechwarriors, can you not see the "The Plan"?

They are gradually evolving mech combat to the ultimate level of fun....
When we finally have no viable weapon choices and combos, they are going to put collisions back into the game and then we will finally experience the level of combat we have all been dreaming about......MECH BOWLING! 15mins of pure fun and awesomeness!!!!!!

<S>

Chuckling, not to mention those like me that had Cat tipping jenners.

[Mudhutwarrior]

o0Marduk0o, on 10 January 2014 - 05:10 AM, said:

Weapons are back where they have to be. You complain about difficulties in hitting mechs at 400+m with a weapon with 270m optimal range?
Even the AC10 change is fine. I feel no change with my 2x AC10 + PPC build and only slightly notable differences beyond AC optimal range.

Well not everyone is the same. With my vision I cant see the dot for my arms most of the time So I have to use judgement and guess work. The change completely screwed me in that regard. Seems that every weapon I play hundreds of matches to learn they change just as i get competent with it.
I can accept they have to change things but we are mushrooms in their eyes and they just will not explain anything. Maybe a heads up or some reasoning would let people be more accepting. The true issue isnt so much the change but the total lack of respect in doing them.

[o0Marduk0o]

Mudhutwarrior, on 11 January 2014 - 04:11 AM, said:

I can accept they have to change things but we are mushrooms in their eyes and they just will not explain anything. Maybe a heads up or some reasoning would let people be more accepting. The true issue isnt so much the change but the total lack of respect in doing them.

Why explain something when it is obvious? The AC20 bullet speed was too fast, making the weapon viable against moving targets way beyond its intended weapon range.
If they reduce (U)AC5 speed to 1250 m/s they will have all AC in line with 300 m/s difference between them.

[Necroconvict]

MekShred, on 07 January 2014 - 10:13 AM, said:

This isn't so much a nerf (which normally means something has become useless) but a slight change to bring it more inline with the intended use of the weapon. I use AC/20's all the time and this will make it more difficult to hit long range targets 400m+ but should have little to no impact within the weapons effective range, this will also be the same for the AC/10. I give this change a thumbs up.

It is a popular weapon becauase of the damage it does. You have to actually carry Ammo that eventually runs out, unlike energy weapons. It already has enough of a trade off. This is a d-bag move, you just cut off almost a 3rd of my {Richard Cameron} basically here. Shooting Ravens, Spiders, Jenners, Commandos, Locusts, and Cicadas at full speed is already enough of a pain in the ***, especially the once that have jump jets. They AC 10 nerf is annoying, the AC 20 nerf is total {Scrap}. You want to nerf a weapon that doesn't make sense, nerf the firing speed of the AC 2. If you are trying to make it similar to the board game, check the fact that the AC 2 couldn't be able to out damage an AC 5 ,based purely on firing speed. AC 5 wouldn't out damage the AC 10, and that wouldn't out damage the AC 20.

Now to the shooting a mech with an AC 20 at 400 meters yeah sure you can, but the damage drop off is going to suck, it may not be worth taking the shot. You guys need to stop dropping the damned ball. Put the AC 20, and 10 back where they were. I assume your real problem are the mechs that are sporting the "AC 40 build" or the triple AC 10 build. The best way to stop something like that isn't to screw the people that play it normaly. Find a better way to screw those that min max, without hurting reglar players.

[Ironwithin]

After playing a couple of games with the "new" AC20: the change is MINISCULE ... stop trying to snipe with the damn thing and you won't even notice. No (additional) problems with hitting fast lights whatsoever.