80 replies to this topic

[Skyfaller]

Xeven, on 07 January 2014 - 05:14 PM, said:

Why are you still nurfn stuff? People will just move to next most effective weapons. Put guns back the way they were. SIGH

I put dual AC20 and a PPC into a Jager DD.

Its so insanely OP its ridiculous. There's zero difficulty or skill required to cripple or flat out take out mechs. My LRM boat (quad LRM15 stalker) relies on my team-mates to hold locks for my indirect fire and when I direct fire I have to expose myself for nearly 10 seconds just so that the damn things will hit. Thats IF the enemy mech doesn't break LOS or gets into cover or runs to his AMS-generous friends or runs to his ECM.

LRMs are balanced as they are in the game now. Learn to use cover. Equip an AMS.

[Axeman1]

Just made a thread on this and yes it's true. LRM's are all over the place. The most lrm's wins a skirmish match, and both Missles and Ballistics are superior to energy weapons. I saw an lrm 40 Jaegger yesterday, it's no coincidence that lrms destroy everything from incredible ranges, worse yet everyone abusing lrm spam doesn't want this to come out so they get nerfed and people will actually have to use skill to play. Think of it like Raiding in World of warcraft, Average players don't raid (With the exception of the free loot from raid finder which is a tuned down version of the real thing for those who don't know with lower rated gear). Another example is Blitzcrank in League of Legends. Yes someone with a brain can beat Blitzcrank but a majority of players can't avoid his grab and just feed bottom lane. Same applies with LRM's in this game. The only difference being this game doesn't have thousands of paying customers to rely on to keep It afloat.

[Varent]

played most of the day. Still didn't see too many missle boats. that said... PLEASE COME BACK!!!! I miss playing mine and would love to see people playing them more so I can group up with them and rain death.

[Ngamok]

Axeman1, on 07 January 2014 - 09:58 PM, said:

Just made a thread on this and yes it's true. LRM's are all over the place. The most lrm's wins a skirmish match, and both Missles and Ballistics are superior to energy weapons. I saw an lrm 40 Jaegger yesterday, it's no coincidence that lrms destroy everything from incredible ranges, worse yet everyone abusing lrm spam doesn't want this to come out so they get nerfed and people will actually have to use skill to play. Think of it like Raiding in World of warcraft, Average players don't raid (With the exception of the free loot from raid finder which is a tuned down version of the real thing for those who don't know with lower rated gear). Another example is Blitzcrank in League of Legends. Yes someone with a brain can beat Blitzcrank but a majority of players can't avoid his grab and just feed bottom lane. Same applies with LRM's in this game. The only difference being this game doesn't have thousands of paying customers to rely on to keep It afloat.

This is why you fail so much. In a skirmish match, if the enemy has a lot of LRM boats, you sit back and wait for them to come to you. Then you can rush and kill them when they are in range and then they can't shoot back at you. You have to dictate the fight because you can. They can shoot missiles if they can't see you or send a scout in with which you can kill fast and then be ahead. Every map has hidey spots to do this on for skirmish mode.

Also, there is AMS, ECM, and terrain to hide behind. Instead of crying about LRMs, just use your head to avoid them.

[Joseph Mallan]

Coralld, on 07 January 2014 - 08:09 PM, said:

PGI: Ok boys and girls, we tweaked the AC20 for this patch a bit so that it has a slower projectile velocity to make it a bit more in line as a brawling weapon...blah blah herp derp.

Dude, I been a brawler for 35 years, less damage, slower delivery do not allow a brawler to survive long at knife range.AC20 is a brawler weapon, reduce the extreme range to 2X keep projectile speed up and we have a good brawling weapon.

[Barantor]

Whenever a patch hits a lot of folks 'retry' the game and have no idea what they are doing and think that LRMs are a good weapon for easy kills. Couple that with the folks not trying LRMs and not using cover and you get a bunch of pug matches where one side gets owned by LRMs then the losing player comes on here saying the sky is falling.

In a week we will be back to posts about LRMs needing a buff and everyone complaining about ballistics again.

[Joseph Mallan]

My experience with LRMs have proven that are good "support" weapons but not the go for the jugular weapon people whine about. I never got high Kill numbers with LRMs but I did rack up the assists like mad. Supporting the team on its way to victory.

[Ngamok]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 January 2014 - 07:32 AM, said:

My experience with LRMs have proven that are good "support" weapons but not the go for the jugular weapon people whine about. I never got high Kill numbers with LRMs but I did rack up the assists like mad. Supporting the team on its way to victory.

I get easy kill steals with them after the brawlers have pounded them down, I'll get a CT or whatever final hit on them, lol.

[Barantor]

Lot's of rock, paper, scissor out there. You can turn off ecm by tagging the mech too then fire away with direct fire lrms for even better effect.

LRMs are fine and have been fine for a while. Lots of other things this game needs or needs to have adjusted.

Slowest weapon in the game kills you and even warns you that it is coming? Time to learn to use cover.

[AlmightyAeng]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 January 2014 - 07:26 AM, said:

Dude, I been a brawler for 35 years, less damage, slower delivery do not allow a brawler to survive long at knife range.AC20 is a brawler weapon, reduce the extreme range to 2X keep projectile speed up and we have a good brawling weapon.

I'd love to see the test server switch around the range bonuses on energy and ballistics...that'd make for some interesting results

[AlmightyAeng]

Joseph Mallan, on 08 January 2014 - 07:32 AM, said:

My experience with LRMs have proven that are good "support" weapons but not the go for the jugular weapon people whine about. I never got high Kill numbers with LRMs but I did rack up the assists like mad. Supporting the team on its way to victory.

More of this please Or you can take your own tag and confuse the hell out of a DDC.

LRM 'mechs, support your brawlers...there's nothing more annoying than getting cockpit shake and flashes in the face while trying to brawl a competent enemy. Please provide this for your friends

[RickySpanish]

Axeman1, on 07 January 2014 - 09:58 PM, said:

Just made a thread on this and yes it's true. LRM's are all over the place. The most lrm's wins a skirmish match, and both Missles and Ballistics are superior to energy weapons. I saw an lrm 40 Jaegger yesterday, it's no coincidence that lrms destroy everything from incredible ranges, worse yet everyone abusing lrm spam doesn't want this to come out so they get nerfed and people will actually have to use skill to play. Think of it like Raiding in World of warcraft, Average players don't raid (With the exception of the free loot from raid finder which is a tuned down version of the real thing for those who don't know with lower rated gear). Another example is Blitzcrank in League of Legends. Yes someone with a brain can beat Blitzcrank but a majority of players can't avoid his grab and just feed bottom lane. Same applies with LRM's in this game. The only difference being this game doesn't have thousands of paying customers to rely on to keep It afloat.

I played a game last night where a 4 LRM stalker hit my IG with 1 and a half full volleys and I did not die. I had ample time to get out of the way but choked and bounced off a building before finally getting to cover. A mistake like that should have cost me my Mech instantly, but I got away with just one medium laser crit off of the arm I tried to shield myself with. LRMs are so pathetically weak that the only way you will ever die to them is if the entire enemy team targets you at the same time AND you have no cover to get to within 5-10 seconds. I dunno if I'd compare that to avoiding Blitzcrank's rocket grab which is as much a problem in team fights when the carry thinks they're safe as it is when used to initiate.

If you see folk getting bombed by LRMs, remind them that MWO plays like an extremely clunky COD / BF and they will get the idea - just like in any other multiplayer FPS ever made, cover is far, far more important than the hitpoints on your Mech are.

Also, not sure why the AC10 / AC20 nerf is a problem, since everyone uses AC5s or UAC5s anyway.

Edited by RickySpanish, 08 January 2014 - 08:39 AM.

[ReXspec]

For those complaining about LRMs, or for those praising LRMs...

LRMs are a game of rock, paper, scissors...

To defeat LRMs, you use ECM.

To defeat ECM, you use PPC's or other ECM, then you launch half the world at your intended target, and the cycle begins all over again.

Edited by ReXspec, 08 January 2014 - 08:41 AM.

[Drunk Canuck]

Use it as intended and stop whining, it's perfectly fine as a brawler weapon. Here is a thought, drop the PPC's down to ER Large Lasers, bump up the engine in whatever cheese factory piece of garbage you choose to run and go brawl instead of being a pop tart D-bag like the majority of people who think the AC/20 sucks because it doesn't have the range anymore.

[ReXspec]

Drunk Canuck, on 08 January 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

Use it as intended and stop whining, it's perfectly fine as a brawler weapon. Here is a thought, drop the PPC's down to ER Large Lasers, bump up the engine in whatever cheese factory piece of garbage you choose to run and go brawl instead of being a pop tart D-bag like the majority of people who think the AC/20 sucks because it doesn't have the range anymore.

Sad part is, the AC-20 was never supposed to have range. lol

[Hexenhammer]

Projectile speed was nerfed so clan weapons could be faster.

Because everyone knows the best way to make something better is by nerfing the competition.

Edited by Hexenhammer, 08 January 2014 - 08:46 AM.

[Drunk Canuck]

RickySpanish, on 08 January 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

I played a game last night where a 4 LRM stalker hit my IG with 1 and a half full volleys and I did not die. I had ample time to get out of the way but choked and bounced off a building before finally getting to cover. A mistake like that should have cost me my Mech instantly, but I got away with just one medium laser crit off of the arm I tried to shield myself with. LRMs are so pathetically weak that the only way you will ever die to them is if the entire enemy team targets you at the same time AND you have no cover to get to within 5-10 seconds. I dunno if I'd compare that to avoiding Blitzcrank's rocket grab which is as much a problem in team fights when the carry thinks they're safe as it is when used to initiate.

If you see folk getting bombed by LRMs, remind them that MWO plays like an extremely clunky COD / BF and they will get the idea - just like in any other multiplayer FPS ever made, cover is far, far more important than the hitpoints on your Mech are.

Also, not sure why the AC10 / AC20 nerf is a problem, since everyone uses AC5s or UAC5s anyway.

It's funny, people complaining about LRM's being OP and others saying they are useless, especially comp players. My team runs them and we have beaten better teams then ours with them. It's all about skill and using them effectively as well as getting targets on your enemy. If you are terrible at using them effectively, they suck, if you know how to use them and can get your shots off correctly, they are painfully annoying.

ReXspec, on 08 January 2014 - 08:44 AM, said:

Sad part is, the AC-20 was never supposed to have range. lol

I know, and it still has too much range if you ask me, it should do zero damage outside 270 meters, that would literally force people to brawl with it or go with the AC10 if they want more range, it would make the game much more interesting that's for sure. AC/40 Catapults and Jagers would be far less lethal if they couldn't do any amount of damage outside 270 meters since those builds generally run XL engines.

[Barantor]

Stalkers using LRMs out of their 5 tube slots are just annoying, nothing more and easy enough to take cover from and come out without a lot of damage if you are in a heavier mech.

LRM 15/20s being volleyed hits a lot harder when out of something that makes use of the tubes.

[N E R E V A R]

Xeven, on 07 January 2014 - 05:14 PM, said:

Why are you still nurfn stuff? People will just move to next most effective weapons. Put guns back the way they were. SIGH

Lolwut, just played 3 games with my wang, 2 of them ended with 4 kills and 600+ damage (got my ac20 arm shot off before I could fire on the third game). Ac20 is fine, at brawling range it's almost as if nothing has been changed and I can still hit a moving cicada 500m away with consistency.

[Marmon Rzohr]

Barantor, on 08 January 2014 - 07:28 AM, said:

Whenever a patch hits a lot of folks 'retry' the game and have no idea what they are doing (...)

This is so hilariously true xD

I renember the wonderful day they implemented the big PPC nerfs and the Gauss nerf. People were randomly running into the enemy charging them with pulse lasers, LBX, Autocannons, you name it. Not to mention getting spammed to death by UAC5s.


Regarding the OP - the point of these changes is to alter convergence and make it harder to spam an alpha keybind and hit everything spot on. That was the point of the Gauss change as well. And i agree with this approach. The "soft" nerfs are a good way to go.

Regarding LRMs:
They are not in the least bit OP. If you think they are, try them yourself or check the damage table after matches. LRM boats (except those experiencing good teamwork) have to work really hard to break 400 damage, which is really easy in a mech that has 3xUAC5, AC + PPCs etc.
The reason LRMs sometimes dominate PUG matches in that sometimes an entire team will stand in a bad position and LRMs are free focus fire since the LRM boats are probably firing on a target someone is already shooting at. This does not make them OP, becuase if a couple of, let's say, 2xGauss snipers were focusing one target it would die A LOT faster.