75 replies to this topic

[BLOOD WOLF]

Ghost Badger, on 20 March 2014 - 07:34 AM, said:

You can certainly have an opinion on what it SHOULD do.

I'm telling you what it DOES in MWO, the way PGI has coded it.

no, im reading the way they coded it, what your doing is telling me the way they coded it.

[AlmightyAeng]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 07:36 AM, said:

no, im reading the way they coded it, what your doing is telling me the way they coded it.

Semantics much? Fine lol. I have interpreted a poorly worded explanation on a wiki page for you.

In MWO, Ferro doesn't increase the maximum possible armor values on a 'mech. Enjoy.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Ghost Badger, on 20 March 2014 - 07:39 AM, said:

Semantics much? Fine lol. I have interpreted a poorly worded explanation on a wiki page for you.

In MWO, Ferro doesn't increase the maximum possible armor values on a 'mech. Enjoy.

not only MWO but Sarna, and various other sources. not only that Sarna is relatively strong and provides Sources. you cant beat sources. Its okay to be wrong sometimes, nobody is gonna look at you differntly

[BLOOD WOLF]

• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ MechWarrior 4: Vengeance (Resource)
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3055 Upgrade, p. 56, "Produced Hercules Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3145 Capellan Confederation, p. 24, "Produced Behemoth II Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058 Upgrades, p. 106, "Typhoon Vehicle Profile"
  
• ↑ Objective Raids, p. 124, "Produced Gibson BattleMech Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058, p. 10, "Produced Maultier Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058, p. 198, "Produced Maultier Components on Sterope"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3060, p. 122, "Produced Tai-sho 'Mech Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3067, p. 68, "Produced Tessen Components"
  
• ↑ Objective Raids, p. 105, "Produced Independence Weaponry Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3060, p. 110, "Produced JagerMech III Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3145 Mercenaries, p. 26-27, "Kite Reconnaissance Vehicle"
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 56
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 146
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 36
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 46
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 158
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 64
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 54
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 68
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 62
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 140
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 152
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 58
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 44
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 184
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 176
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 60
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 160
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 162

[edit] Bibliography

• Technical Readout: 2750
  
• Technical Readout: 3050
  
• Technical Readout: 3058
  
• Technical Readout: 3060
  
• Technical Readout: 3067
  
• Technical Readout: 3055 Upgrade
  
• Technical Readout: 3058 Upgrade
  
• Technical Readout: 3145 Mercenaries
  
• Technical Readout: 3145 Capellan Confederation
  
• Total Warfare
  
• TechManual
  
• Objective Raids
  
• MechWarrior 4: Vengeance (Resource)

IF a site doesnt have refernces then you probably should think twice but if one does, to be accurate check those sources

[Amsro]

Endo before Fiberous ALWAYS.

Only if you need that little bit of tonnage and don't need the 14 slots does ferro work. Lights/ Some Mediums/Couple Heavies/Not likely in an assault.

[TercieI]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 07:59 AM, said:

<snips irrelevant TT crap>

Sorry, none of that matters. In MWO, it's just lighter armor that takes space. Fact. Stop trying to spread misinformation, because unless you're hopelessly obdurate, there's no other reason for you to continue arguing.

Edited by Terciel1976, 20 March 2014 - 08:25 AM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Terciel1976, on 20 March 2014 - 08:24 AM, said:

Sorry, none of that matters. In MWO, it's just lighter armor that takes space. Fact. Stop trying to spread misinformation, because unless you're hopelessly obdurate, there's no other reason for you to continue arguing.

your wrong, it doesnt matter if its in MWO.

People dont take FF because the added protection doesn't outweigh the benefits of reduced weight of Endo steel. based on your words here i might conclude that your a sinister person but i hope you have a nice day.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 20 March 2014 - 08:31 AM.

[TercieI]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 08:26 AM, said:

your wrong, it doesnt matter if its in MWO

Hopelessly obdurate, indeed. Thankfully, I'm not. Enjoy your delusion and a trip to my ignore list.

[Zerberus]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 07:59 AM, said:

• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ MechWarrior 4: Vengeance (Resource)
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ TechManual, p. 205
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3055 Upgrade, p. 56, "Produced Hercules Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3145 Capellan Confederation, p. 24, "Produced Behemoth II Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058 Upgrades, p. 106, "Typhoon Vehicle Profile"
  
• ↑ Objective Raids, p. 124, "Produced Gibson BattleMech Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058, p. 10, "Produced Maultier Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3058, p. 198, "Produced Maultier Components on Sterope"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3060, p. 122, "Produced Tai-sho 'Mech Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3067, p. 68, "Produced Tessen Components"
  
• ↑ Objective Raids, p. 105, "Produced Independence Weaponry Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3060, p. 110, "Produced JagerMech III Components"
  
• ↑ Technical Readout: 3145 Mercenaries, p. 26-27, "Kite Reconnaissance Vehicle"
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 56
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 146
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 36
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 46
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 158
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 64
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 54
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 68
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 62
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 140
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 152
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 58
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 44
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 184
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 176
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 60
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 160
  
• ↑ TRO 3060 p. 162

[edit] Bibliography

• Technical Readout: 2750
  
• Technical Readout: 3050
  
• Technical Readout: 3058
  
• Technical Readout: 3060
  
• Technical Readout: 3067
  
• Technical Readout: 3055 Upgrade
  
• Technical Readout: 3058 Upgrade
  
• Technical Readout: 3145 Mercenaries
  
• Technical Readout: 3145 Capellan Confederation
  
• Total Warfare
  
• TechManual
  
• Objective Raids
  
• MechWarrior 4: Vengeance (Resource)

IF a site doesnt have refernces then you probably should think twice but if one does, to be accurate check those sources

And all of those sources mean essentially nothing here because this is MWO, not CBT /TT. "Based on" is not = "100% identical as", or why do mechs have 18 head armor again? How many shots are in a ton of LRM ammo? Where to the CT lasers on an Atlas-D face, front or rear?

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

not only MWO but Sarna, and various other sources. not only that Sarna is relatively strong and provides Sources. you cant beat sources.

The only valid source for MWO is MWO itself, and we have very cleary explained to ou that FF in MWO does not work the way you think it does. Nor did it inTT, BTW, max armor points are still a constant determined by chassis, not armor type, and 1AP=1AP regardless of armor type.

Quote

Its okay to be wrong sometimes, nobody is gonna look at you differntly

For somebody stating this, you seem the have a hard time translating those words into appropriate actions, because you`re still trying to prove us wrong, using "evidence" that has no relevance in this arena to boot.

I`m out, believe what you want about armor, the truth has been clearly stated in this thread and it seems that you are ignoring it by choice..

But I can tell you one thing for sure: My ac20>your belief that your armor is somehow stronger.

[Unusual Suspect]

This is like a guild of chess masters arguing with a pigeon. Despite logic, reason, intelligence, data, and research being entirely on the Master's side, they aren't winning, because you don't WIN arguments with pigeons, you just get shit all over the debating hall and a self-satisfied pigeon.

Stop feeding the pigeon. Do you want pest problems? Because that's how you get pest problems!

[Amsro]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 07:17 AM, said:

Guys do your research, FF does give more protection. Use sarna or whatever other resource

Uh.. umm...

Per Ton, yes. But that is compared to standard armor. Endo is a lighter chassis resulting in MORE weight savings. Both use 14 slots.

Endo is better then Ferro. No doubt.

[Zerberus]

Unusual Suspect, on 20 March 2014 - 08:40 AM, said:

This is like a guild of chess masters arguing with a pigeon. Despite logic, reason, intelligence, data, and research being entirely on the Master's side, they aren't winning, because you don't WIN arguments with pigeons, you just get shit all over the debating hall and a self-satisfied pigeon.

Stop feeding the pigeon. Do you want pest problems? Because that's how you get pest problems!

[BLOOD WOLF]

I think you guys are in delusion

Zerberus, on 20 March 2014 - 08:31 AM, said:

And all of those sources mean essentially nothing here because this is MWO, not CBT /TT. "Based on" is not = "100% identical as", or why do mechs have 18 head armor again? How many shots are in a ton of LRM ammo? Where to the CT lasers on an Atlas-D face, front or rear?


The only valid source for MWO is MWO itself, and we have very cleary explained to ou that FF in MWO does not work the way you think it does. Nor did it inTT, BTW, max armor points are still a constant determined by chassis, not armor type, and 1AP=1AP regardless of armor type.



For somebody stating this, you seem the have a hard time translating those words into appropriate actions, because you`re still trying to prove us wrong, using "evidence" that has no relevance in this arena to boot.

I`m out, believe what you want about armor, the truth has been clearly stated in this thread and it seems that you are ignoring it by choice..

But I can tell you one thing for sure: My ac20>your belief that your armor is somehow stronger.

yea, they already explained how it works in MWO but apparently that's not good enough. If you think it it does nothing more than lighten your mech by 1.35 then your being rediculous

[DEMAX51]

Blood Wolf, you are wholly wrong about how FF works in this game. The people who have explained its actual mechanics to you are correct.

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 08:49 AM, said:

I think you guys are in delusion

yea, they already explained how it works in MWO but apparently that's not good enough. If you think it it does nothing more than lighten your mech by 1.35 then your being rediculous

Dude, that is EXACTLY what it does (though, the number of tons saved changes from Mech to Mech). If you don't understand that, you are being ridiculous. (And it's rIdiculous, nor rEdiculous - meaning "deserving of ridicule")

[BLOOD WOLF]

DEMAX51, on 20 March 2014 - 08:51 AM, said:

Blood Wolf, you are wholly wrong about how FF works in this game. The people who have explained its actual mechanics to you are correct.


Dude, that is EXACTLY what it does (though, the number of tons saved changes from Mech to Mech). If you don't understand that, you are being ridiculous. (And it's rIdiculous, nor rEdiculous - meaning "deserving of ridicule")

it does that and adds extra protection.

Besides over-pig headed overlords, i need some hard facts against what i said, rather than personal opinions.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 20 March 2014 - 08:56 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 06:55 AM, said:

How many people run
Ferro-Fibrous Armor- just curious

Pretty much all lights, some of my Mediums. I think I even have an Assault packing it because I had the crits for it or endo, but no crits left to use the tonnage from endo, so I tossed the ferro on just because.

[Bishop Steiner]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 08:56 AM, said:

it does that and adds extra protection.

Besides over-pig headed overlords, i need some hard facts against what i said, rather than personal opinions.

Got any "hard facts" showing it gives extra protection?

I have a teammate that swears that shooting armor with lasers first "softens" it and makes the ballistics more effective, but oddly there are no facts to support it.

Your hard fact is this : Your armor points are listed. 65 pts is 65 pts. 65 pts of ferro is not magically 70 pts of protection. It's still 65 pts. Show us ANYWHERE that states otherwise. weapons do finite , definitive damage, armor absorbs finite, definitive damage. That's simply how it works. FF armor simply gives you more points per ton. Those points are still 1 pt of armor absorbs 1 pt of damage.

[DEMAX51]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 08:56 AM, said:

it does that and adds extra protection.

Besides over-pig headed overlords, i need some hard facts against what i said, rather than personal opinions.

It does not add extra protection! The description of Ferro Fibrous says that it offers "more protection PER TON of armor."

What this translates to, is that for the cost of ONE TON you can have 36 points of ferro fibrous armor, vs. only 32 points of Standard Armor. Ferro Fibrous armor doesn't absorb any extra damage - 1 point of armor will absorb 1 point of damage no matter what. FERRO ONLY WEIGHS LESS!

You want proof? Do this...

Make a mech with 10 points of standard armor on one of its arms and have a buddy shoot you in that arm with an AC/10 - you should see it remove all of that arm's armor.

Then go edit the mech so that it has Ferro, and still place 10 points of armor on that arm, and have your buddy shoot it again. The AC/10 will (unsurprisngly) still remove all of the armor. Because 10 points is 10 points!

Edit: If you choose not to test it out, and just decide to keep believing whatever the hell you want, then I wish you the best of luck in your delusional little world. We're trying to help you and you just keep offering up the same garbage.

So go put 15 points of Ferro armor on your 'Mechs cockpit hitbox, and I'll laugh the next time you get headshot by a dual Gauss and sit there wondering why your armor didn't give you that precious extra protection you believe it will.

Edited by DEMAX51, 20 March 2014 - 09:12 AM.

[EyeOne]

BLOOD WOLF, on 20 March 2014 - 08:56 AM, said:

it does that and adds extra protection.

Besides over-pig headed overlords, i need some hard facts against what i said, rather than personal opinions.

None of it has been personal opinion.

Here is a Cicada-2A (empty) with max armor with Ferro Fibrous / without Ferro Fibrous.

Both have 274 points of armor, but the one with FF has 28.35 free tons while the one without FF only has 27.43 free tons. That's it. It's just lighter armor. It gives you more armor points per ton, but the max is absolute.

[AlmightyAeng]

Bloodwolf,

If I manage to pull in a MechWarrior Online game developer and he tells you you're wrong, will you stop being obtuse?

Is that "source" enough for you?

Edited by Ghost Badger, 20 March 2014 - 09:14 AM.