4349 replies to this topic

[stealthraccoon]

You don't have to worry about quirks or negative weight, just make it have a value of at least 5 fixed heat sinks - two are provided by the 60 rating, and just have three weightless fixed heat sinks attached to it, if it weighs in at half a ton, we're in business!

[jper4]

aniviron, on 24 December 2014 - 03:55 PM, said:

That is an absolutely terrible plan. The Urbanmech is going to be pretty marginal even if it doesn't have any negative quirks, but man, that'd be the most punitive quirk in the game, far far worse than anything that even affects the clans. It would make the Victor nerf look lighthanded. Forget even trying to upgrade the engine in the thing- and it'd be a double whammy, because the 100 rated engine weighs a lot more than a 60 would.

bah you people and your EZ mode urbies

[IraqiWalker]

Strum Wealh, on 24 December 2014 - 07:18 AM, said:

Didn't the Centurions receive a boost to their Engine rating limits?

If they did, then I forgot about it. Like I said, the only one I /remember/ is for the commandos and spiders.

stealthraccoon, on 24 December 2014 - 11:27 AM, said:

So if they release a Santa Urbie, does that mean I can look forward to a St Patricks Urbie, and an Easter Bunny Urbie too?

aniviron, on 24 December 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:

I very sincerely doubt it can handle negative tonnage, and even if it can, it just makes absolutely no sense from a logic standpoint, which is sure to be an issue that people raise as well.

Like I was saying though, that doesn't mean it's impossible, just that it's going to take them time and effort to come up with a solution, which is probably what has delayed the UM's release to this point and will likely continue to delay it further while programming time is devoted to more important things.

The thing is that the engine actually would have weighed negative tonnage anyways. It's just a slide modifier. The reason the engines have tiny weight compared to what they did in TT, is because the gyros, fixed heatsinks, and a few other structure components totaled up the weight to something more. Also in TT they all came with the heatsinks fixed (a STD 100 weighs actually 7 tons, instead of the 1 in MWO, because it comes with all heatsinks mandatory in the mech, on top of the cockpit stuff ... etc.)

They could also just have the STD 60 have fixed heatsinks that come with it, giving it weight above 0.

Dawnstealer, on 24 December 2014 - 01:50 PM, said:

I thought the negative tonnage thing was a bit of a workaround - you still have to put 10 HS in, which brings the weight back up to where it should be. Or that's what I thought?

You are correct. It was a workaround that allowed us to move the heatsinks around, upgrade them, etc, without having to sacrifice slots we needed (moving a DHS to the arm frees up 3 slots in the ST for that ERPPC for example).

[Soul Tribunal]

IraqiWalker, on 24 December 2014 - 06:05 PM, said:

If they did, then I forgot about it. Like I said, the only one I /remember/ is for the commandos and spiders.







The thing is that the engine actually would have weighed negative tonnage anyways. It's just a slide modifier. The reason the engines have tiny weight compared to what they did in TT, is because the gyros, fixed heatsinks, and a few other structure components totaled up the weight to something more. Also in TT they all came with the heatsinks fixed (a STD 100 weighs actually 7 tons, instead of the 1 in MWO, because it comes with all heatsinks mandatory in the mech, on top of the cockpit stuff ... etc.)

They could also just have the STD 60 have fixed heatsinks that come with it, giving it weight above 0.



You are correct. It was a workaround that allowed us to move the heatsinks around, upgrade them, etc, without having to sacrifice slots we needed (moving a DHS to the arm frees up 3 slots in the ST for that ERPPC for example).

I believe they also upped the Panthers Engine as well to compensate. So they are capable of doing whatever they want to make a Chassis work in game.
Which, hopefully means our deadly Trash Can is more of a reality than ever before.

-ST

[aniviron]

IraqiWalker, on 24 December 2014 - 06:05 PM, said:

The thing is that the engine actually would have weighed negative tonnage anyways. It's just a slide modifier. The reason the engines have tiny weight compared to what they did in TT, is because the gyros, fixed heatsinks, and a few other structure components totaled up the weight to something more. Also in TT they all came with the heatsinks fixed (a STD 100 weighs actually 7 tons, instead of the 1 in MWO, because it comes with all heatsinks mandatory in the mech, on top of the cockpit stuff ... etc.)

They could also just have the STD 60 have fixed heatsinks that come with it, giving it weight above 0.

See, that's the ideal solution. I just don't know how PGI's system works, whether they can just open a database and add "Item: Engine, Std 60, weight 7 tons" or if the system dynamically calculates engine properties based on a set of rules. If it's the former, then great! Easy solution, problem solved, we all get Urbanmechs for Christmas. If it's the latter, they have to do a rewrite of the way the game handles how engines are made, which is a big project. I just don't know.

[Emilio Lizardo]

If I got an Urbanmech for Christmas I would paint it red and white and put all my holiday cockpit items inside and mount red and green lasers.

[3xnihilo]

"The children were nestled all snug in their beds,
As visions of Urbanmechs danced in my head..."

Merry Christmas!

[verybad]

3xnihilo, on 24 December 2014 - 07:29 PM, said:

"The children were nestled all snug in their beds,
As visions of Urbanmechs stomped all over their heads..."

Merry Christmas!

Slight change added...

[Dawnstealer]

You know something? All of us are from different factions, all united by the urbie. It's a Christmas murrrcal!

[3xnihilo]

Dawnstealer, on 24 December 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

You know something? All of us are from different factions, all united by the urbie. It's a Christmas murrrcal!

The Urbie; bringing peace, love, and dakka to all!

[wanderer]

James Amirault, on 24 December 2014 - 02:11 PM, said:

We Bears love walking Trash Cans. They make good on targets. Ask the Coyotes about it sometime. True, they stopped the Burrock freebirths dead in their tracks, but out in the open. . . bye bye.

http://www.sarna.net...i/UrbanMech_IIC

So much so the Clans built a mass-production upgrade for defensive work. Inexpensive. Efficient. Unwasteful. Quite Clanlike.

[Sereglach]

Urbanmech Build using an Anansi

Here you go, this is easily how they could implement the Urbanmech utilizing a STD 100 engine and make everything work perfectly kosher, so to speak, with what we already have built into MWO. Yeah, the build isn't EXACTLY canon, but . . .

-The base Urbanmech also had 11 heat sinks, so we can dump one right from the start, earning us 1 extra ton towards the STD 100 engine. The build was absurdly heat efficient, anyway, as it could only build a maximum of 7 heat yet had 11 heat sinks. I'd say the extra heat sink could have been crit-padding, but it was put into the head, instead of with the ammo or autocannon.

-It also didn't utilize maximum armor, anyway, having 96/105 (or 192/210 in MWO's doubled armor number terms) . . . so, it shouldn't be breaking anyone's hearts if we shave off a little extra armor in order to make the build fit. MWO has already doubled the armor numbers over canon values, so other finagling and/or tweaking to a mech's overall armor value is a bit of a moot point if you're just trying to make a mech build work.

-The other viable variants all have little effort needed to put them into the game using this design philosophy. The only two variants that don't have the 11th heat sink are the R69 and the AIV. Neither of those will be added, at this time, because they're not viable. The R69 has an IS UAC/10 and the AIV has an Arrow IV artillery system . . . both weapons that we're not seeing anytime soon; and when/if we do see them we'll just be able to make the variants on our own by cramming them into the Urbanmech variants we already do have (Except the AIV because that would require a missile hardpoint . . . perfectly doable if they give us the R68 with MRM's later on, however, when/if those weapons are introduced).

-This all prevents PGI from having to somehow figure out how to encode in a STD 60 engine just for the Urbanmech, thereby allowing us to have the Inner Sphere's most dangerous Trash Can with even less extra work required . . . thereby getting it into our hands faster. This is just a good move in general . . . getting the Urbanmech into our hands as fast as possible.

-This somewhat applies to the Urbanmech IIC, as well, because it uses a STD 90 engine, but with the absolutely miniscule differences between that and the 100, you can just solve the problem by either shaving off the tiniest bit of armor or giving it Clan Ferro Fibrous armor off the bat. Both solve the problem effortlessly.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

For those talking about potential variants and hardpoints, again, I had also made mention and did a pretty hefty bit of writing on what is/isn't/could/couldn't be done a few pages back: Potential Urbanmech Variants and Quirks. I am also one who doesn't foresee the Urbanmech being a useless mech, and actually look forward to piloting one. I think in either attack or defend it will provide a decent screening mech to put surprising punishment on target while the heavier mechs take the hits . . . especially with whatever quirks it gets. On top of it, depending upon the quriks the thing might be able to take some serious hits for a 30 tonner . . . and based on the tiny, squat stature the thing might also be the smallest mech in the game, if not tied with the locust.
That would be nothing to scoff at.

[Wintersdark]

MAVRICK64, on 24 December 2014 - 08:11 AM, said:

If we do get the Urban Mech it will be exciting but what good will it be? for this game/environment it doesn't have a part in CW because its to slow and it doesn't hold a lot of ammo. Its doesn't fit will with any unit/team. I believe if we do get this mech it will be stored away because it wont help win matches or make you any CB's.

1) You can win matches and earn cbills with any Mech in the game.
2) Swap the engine out; PGI can give it any upper engine cap they want. They've arbitrarily changes upper engine caps many times before, so there's no reason to assume the Urbanmech will have an absurdly low engine cap... And thus no reason to assume it'll be slow.
3) Slow lights are crappy when attacking in CW, but if the Urbanmech has good enough quirks, a slow Urbanmech with a HBK4H style AC10 would be a valuable asset defensively while only eating 30 tons.

Edited by Wintersdark, 25 December 2014 - 12:22 AM.

[IraqiWalker]

Dawnstealer, on 24 December 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

You know something? All of us are from different factions, all united by the urbie. It's a Christmas murrrcal!

I believe that. It's the power of Urbie.

[Dawnstealer]

MERRY URBANMAS, EVERYONE!!

[Nightshade24]

MAVRICK64, on 24 December 2014 - 08:11 AM, said:

If we do get the Urban Mech it will be exciting but what good will it be? for this game/environment it doesn't have a part in CW because its to slow and it doesn't hold a lot of ammo. Its doesn't fit will with any unit/team. I believe if we do get this mech it will be stored away because it wont help win matches or make you any CB's.

1) A very nice brawling or snipping platform for a CW drop deck. It being a 30 tonner you can have (with 240 ton cap atm) you can have say an atlas (100 tons total), an awesome, (180 tons thus far), and 2 urban mechs (240), or drop 1 and lower the awesome for 2 heavy mechs or what ever. drop the atlas for another assault or heavy-heavy.

2) It is a very good defense platform. Pug matches have confirmed the AC 10 stock urban mech (subbing for a std 100 engine) is not impossible and even 'rekts' people. It'll most likely have a Tier 5 mech quirk so the thing is that AC 20 is gonna reach far and be high velocity while the AC 10 may be firing the rate of nearly an AC 5. Etc....

3) It has a 360 torso turn as well as jumpjets, if you try to make it play like a clan light mech with the max 160 engine then you at least got a mech that can do a full 360 torso turn and 4+ jumpjets. It can do good with an ER PPC I can assume.

Trust me. I use the Mist Lynx Alt Configeration A for fun. UAC 2 + ER med + ER small laser.

If I can use that and get 300 damage + then I think I can use an urban mech which is as valid as a hunchback in CW pretty much...

James Amirault, on 24 December 2014 - 02:11 PM, said:

We Bears love walking Trash Cans. They make good on targets. Ask the Coyotes about it sometime. True, they stopped the Burrock freebirths dead in their tracks, but out in the open. . . bye bye.

oh really? Because these targets sure did kick ghost bear arse in the UM-68 variant.
They stopped Ghost bear so well that practically after that point ghost bear took no more planets from kuritan space.

Edit: I am saying this while I am aligned under the same faction. hozzah....

Edited by Nightshade24, 25 December 2014 - 06:15 AM.

[PhoenixX2]

I thought for sure Santa urbie was going to leave me an Urbanmech and mechbay in my stocking.

[Dimento Graven]

PhoenixX2, on 25 December 2014 - 09:40 AM, said:

I thought for sure Santa urbie was going to leave me an Urbanmech and mechbay in my stocking.

Ha! Not for free. When it happens, and I'm almost positive it will... We'll end up having to pay, a lot.

[jaxjace]

I cried

[GentlemanBryan]

The urbanmech will not have a role in a unit. I think most of us know this. There is no role for it in CW. After a couple of weeks it will be put away because sooner or later you have to win matches and CB's - the urbie will not help win matches or CB's.