322 replies to this topic

[Kaldor]

RussianWolf, on 22 April 2014 - 07:47 AM, said:

Yeah, I've seen the raging and excuses given from newer solos. I've also seen a lot of arrogance from 4mans (never play 12mans so no clue there). I'll give the newbs getting stomped a pass on being frustrated. I expect better from established players.

As do I and this shows their maturity level. In MGA, we simply will not put up with childish crap. Ive given my share of verbal beatdowns in the TS to someone that is being an a__bag though out the years.

Joseph Mallan, on 22 April 2014 - 07:48 AM, said:

This. Is something I support completely. But human nature being what it is there will always be some who are afraid to voice their opinion.
...
...
...
Obviously this demographic does not include one Joseph James Mallan!

You forgot "the Outspoken"!

[Davers]

Craig Steele, on 22 April 2014 - 07:50 AM, said:

But they are there right? And some of them are Founders and have Overlord Badges so they have certainly spent money on the game supporting it.

Shouldn't we embrace their view accordingly?



LOL, OK, Maybe I am getting my Marik badges mixed up. My apologies then

What do you think is their view and how does that differ from what other players have said?

It's ok. All the Marik badges look the same.

Edited by Davers, 22 April 2014 - 07:53 AM.

[M0rpHeu5]

I drop solo becouse i usualy play a couple of games at a time.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kaldor, on 22 April 2014 - 07:45 AM, said:

This is the nature of the game. In Closed Beta, when grouping was its peak, the forums were no more or less active in all reality, but generally those in Closed Beta, played to join a unit, group up and provide feedback via the forums.

Enter Open Beta. At this point the flood gates open, and everyone can get in, and alot of those people have little to no interest in grouping or posting on the forums. There is your silent majority. They dont generally join units, dont post on the forums, and beyond playing from time to time, dont really care.

Guess which group builds communities that help games stand the test of time?

I remember in CB there was a vocal group fighting to get a separate server or PUG as well Kaldor. I was a PUG for a short while sticking up for teams in a team game. My Logic was sometimes the opposition should be the Wilson's Hussars and sometimes they need to be the Black Widow Company, to keep us on our toes.

I never thought I'd be asked to join a group more less even be accepted into one!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 22 April 2014 - 07:55 AM.

[Craig Steele]

Kaldor, on 22 April 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

As do I and this shows their maturity level. In MGA, we simply will not put up with childish crap. Ive given my share of verbal beatdowns in the TS to someone that is being an a__bag though out the years.

I think his point was though Kaldor, that poor manners is not the exclusive behaviour of Solo players.

I'd suggest that statiscally, bad mannered people are bad mannered people regardless of whether they play Solo or in groups, as you yourself have indicated you have come across.

You may have come across more bad mannered solo's, others may have come acorss more bad mannered groups, its all relative.

[Joseph Mallan]

Kaldor, on 22 April 2014 - 07:51 AM, said:

As do I and this shows their maturity level. In MGA, we simply will not put up with childish crap. Ive given my share of verbal beatdowns in the TS to someone that is being an a__bag though out the years.



You forgot "the Outspoken"!

Looks at post count??? Didn't think it required mentioning!

[Nightfire]

I drop solo because:

• I don't! Ever!

If there is no space in the current group, I'll go play something else until there is or just play something else period.

[Joseph Mallan]

Craig Steele, on 22 April 2014 - 07:55 AM, said:

I think his point was though Kaldor, that poor manners is not the exclusive behaviour of Solo players.

I'd suggest that statiscally, bad mannered people are bad mannered people regardless of whether they play Solo or in groups, as you yourself have indicated you have come across.

You may have come across more bad mannered solo's, others may have come acorss more bad mannered groups, its all relative.

My group is present and former Military we can go from well mannered to disgusting in 0.chit below rock level seconds. It's why I love 'em!

[Kaldor]

Craig Steele, on 22 April 2014 - 07:50 AM, said:

But they are there right? And some of them are Founders and have Overlord Badges so they have certainly spent money on the game supporting it.

Shouldn't we embrace their view accordingly?

Never said we shouldnt Craig. Im all about supporting the game in its entirety, solo PUGger, 4 mans, 12 mans, whatever. Most unit guys just want a queue that they can drop with more than 4 and less than 12. As someone who does play solo, I would play in this queue as a fill in for the challenge.

Most of the unit guys are pretty forgiving. Problem is they have been left out in the cold as the focus of the game has shifted from groups (closed beta) to solo casual players (open beta to now). Most have said screw it and moved on, but a few hold on for the cookie that is CW and the potential grouping that will come from this.

[RussianWolf]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 April 2014 - 07:54 AM, said:

I remember in CB there was a vocal group fighting to get a separate server or PUG as well Kaldor. I was a PUG for a short while sticking up for teams in a team game. My Logic was sometimes the opposition should be the Wilson's Hussars and sometimes they need to be the Black Widow Company, to keep us on our toes.

I never thought I'd be asked to join a group more less even be accepted into one!

I remember those arguments. I recall being told on many occasions that this is a team game and I should go elsewhere. Now, I'm here and most of them are gone. I'm still putting money in (granted less now, bought the KitFox package until PGI gives more info, etc.) and most of them are spending none. I guess most of them aren't really that dedicated to the IP, they just wanted to act like it.

[Davers]

Craig Steele, on 22 April 2014 - 07:55 AM, said:

I think his point was though Kaldor, that poor manners is not the exclusive behaviour of Solo players.

I'd suggest that statiscally, bad mannered people are bad mannered people regardless of whether they play Solo or in groups, as you yourself have indicated you have come across.

You may have come across more bad mannered solo's, others may have come acorss more bad mannered groups, its all relative.

But bad mannered group players tend to complain over VoIP and not in texts. Well, usually.

[Kaldor]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 April 2014 - 07:54 AM, said:

I remember in CB there was a vocal group fighting to get a separate server or PUG as well Kaldor. I was a PUG for a short while sticking up for teams in a team game. My Logic was sometimes the opposition should be the Wilson's Hussars and sometimes they need to be the Black Widow Company, to keep us on our toes.

I never thought I'd be asked to join a group more less even be accepted into one!

I could see why they resisted it in Closed Beta as it will simply put a division in between players and make it more difficult for testing purposes. Now it would be a god send. I think if they put solo queue in, a group queue solos can drop in, and straight 12 man queue, the amount of people that would come back would be astounding.

Craig Steele, on 22 April 2014 - 07:55 AM, said:

I think his point was though Kaldor, that poor manners is not the exclusive behaviour of Solo players.

I'd suggest that statiscally, bad mannered people are bad mannered people regardless of whether they play Solo or in groups, as you yourself have indicated you have come across.

You may have come across more bad mannered solo's, others may have come acorss more bad mannered groups, its all relative.

You will always have clowns like the Goons. You will always have the idiotic solo player that gets mad and vents before rage logging. Id say as a whole, people in MWO are pretty damn nice.

Joseph Mallan, on 22 April 2014 - 07:56 AM, said:

Looks at post count??? Didn't think it required mentioning!

38 posts to 20k? Gogogogo

[Rogue Jedi]

I drop solo when I am testing builds or only have time for a few matches, I estimate half my drops are solo despite belonging to a team

[Kaldor]

Davers, on 22 April 2014 - 08:01 AM, said:

But bad mannered group players tend to complain over VoIP and not in texts. Well, usually.

Yes, but is it tolerated in TS Davers? Does Roadbeer sit back and let people run their mouth in TS and generally be a pain in the a_s? I know that doesnt happen in MGAs channels...

I remember when Kunae ran the FWLM TS server. Banhammer for a_sholes on a regular basis.

[Galenit]

Artgathan, on 22 April 2014 - 06:12 AM, said:

Furthermore, isolating the data presumes that players play exclusively in their category (IE: group players only group and never PUG and vice versa for PUGs). However, that has been shown to be false. If we assume that the average player who plays in a group spends their time 50/50 between group and solo drops, the number of players that are sometimes part of a group rises to ~52% of the population.

If you go the 50/50 way, this would also increase the number for soloplayers.
If its 50/50 you have not only to count the solos to groups, you also have to count the groups to the solos, because they do their groupsdrops only 50% of the time.

Numbergames work both ways and still not tell the truth.

Did you know, that you can statistical prove that the climate warming collerates to the number of pirates?

Edited by Galenit, 22 April 2014 - 08:11 AM.

[RussianWolf]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 April 2014 - 07:58 AM, said:

My group is present and former Military we can go from well mannered to disgusting in 0.chit below rock level seconds. It's why I love 'em!

Joseph, I'm a former CTI3 myself. Harsh and disgusting language I have no issue with. I can even give you a run for your money if I want.

Mocking, condescension and arrogance I have no use for. And yes, I've seen that from some of the team players, even some who were soloing at the time. Some even well respected here on the boards. These are people that I would never group with, even if it were required in the game. I'd DC and I don't DC.

[Davers]

Kaldor, on 22 April 2014 - 08:09 AM, said:

Yes, but is it tolerated in TS Davers? Does Roadbeer sit back and let people run their mouth in TS and generally be a pain in the a_s? I know that doesnt happen in MGAs channels...

I remember when Kunae ran the FWLM TS server. Banhammer for a_sholes on a regular basis.

No, he does not. In fact I can only remember a handful of disruptive players in the last 2 years and they were sorted out quickly. Dropping on the Marik TS has really been a high point in online gaming for me.

Edit: Spelling

Edited by Davers, 22 April 2014 - 08:12 AM.

[Flaming oblivion]

Sandpit, on 21 April 2014 - 05:38 PM, said:

It IS amazing though that any time someone says "I want group play" a few of the trolls try to translate that to

PUGs are irrelevant
PUGs are insignificant
Groups are evil
Teamwork is "op"
I'm a PUG and I don't like groups
Groups shouldn't be allowed to "prey" on (insert latest sally struthers type infomercial about starving pilots here)
and a myriad of other just ridiculous things like that to detract from the point of the OP and/or just try to derail the thread.

It's also funny how a select few try to make it sound like those that want groups are somehow detracting from or otherwise forcing puggers to play in a specific manner against them or some such when it's already been explained numerous times that that simply isn't the case.

How about that select few just stop with your propaganda war and answer the following:

How does
opening 12man queue to all groups and solos that want to opt in
keeping the pug queue as is
force/detract from/etc. your gaming experience?

How about give a reason beyond "PGI said so" or "I don't liek groups" or "They're evil and roflstomped me"

Just like you will do anything to defend your position (until the day that will never happen) When grouping is made a lot easier and able to create 12 man teams that can face PuGs and PuGs players either are forced to group or leave or get perma stomped.

[Roadbeer]

Kaldor, on 22 April 2014 - 08:09 AM, said:

Yes, but is it tolerated in TS Davers? Does Roadbeer sit back and let people run their mouth in TS and generally be a pain in the a_s? I know that doesnt happen in MGAs channels...

I remember when Kunae ran the FWLM TS server. Banhammer for a_sholes on a regular basis.

OT:

This was one of the reasons we set up the system we did with the revamp. On the new Marik TS server, you don't even have to be a Unit Leader or Admin to resolve your problem. If you have the MGA tag, you can kick non MGA out of your channels for being an ******.

I think when we were on the old TS servers when the banhammer was wielded with authority, we weeded out most of those elements. I can count on one hand since we came to the new server that, as a group, we've had to take action on anyone.

/resume topic

[Craig Steele]

Davers, on 22 April 2014 - 07:53 AM, said:

What do you think is their view and how does that differ from what other players have said?

It's ok. All the Marik badges look the same.

I certainly cannot speak for all of them, but on several threads I have suggested it's a larger demographic than many assume.

I would summarise the demographic as having lots of RL stuff, responsibilities and so forth and strong values (sense of ownership etc). When they play, they have a certain window of time to play in and its a "plug and play" scenario for them. They don't want to waste time linking up with on line friends, they don't want the sense of obligation to play one more game until such and such can take his place. They want to log on, blow stuff up and get lost in the flash of lasers and roar of missiles for an hour / 2 hours or whatever. They play by themselves or maybe with a significant family member (brother, SO, child, whatever). They are not competitive per se, they just want a casual fun environment they can share with people close to them.

I also think they drop more money on the game than many people think. They want the shiny toys just like everyone else and have the disposable cash to buy them because they are to time poor to grind them.

I also think they rarely come to Forums, its the last place they are going to spend their limited "entertainment" time.

When I see posts like this suggesting the game should exclude Solo players from CW because they're not part of a team,

wanderer, on 21 April 2014 - 08:20 PM, said:

Why do I drop solo?

The group game PGI told me was coming never materialized. Thus, I bide in PUGatory until the time comes, or else it may be a Limbo to fade into obscurity and failure.

Only PGI could make factional warfare a matter of "soloing in unison".

...that tells me there is a level of exclusion of this demographic by some. Some people have a view of how the game "should be" and it's to the exclusion of some demographics at times.

So I am kinda glad that there are posts seemingly identifying with this demographic. Whether its a 35% demographic or 70% I won't ever know, but its great to see some people highlighting another side to the one we see so often in Forums Threads. Now that some have spoken up, we can reflect on whether there is room in our personal visions of the game to accommodate someone else's desires.

The hard part is no game is going to encompass everyones needs, but its nice to at least consider other peoples desires and see if they can be accommodated.