star citizen>mwo for sure. Even though i don't like airplane simulators, but this one looks super awesome, unlike broken mwo.
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#362
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- 28 posts
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Posted 01 September 2013 - 06:52 PM
A few comments re this thread and some of the things I read (I see they merged it with an older one):
- One poster commented that Star Citizen is just another space sim and games that push boundaries as Chris Roberts is promising don't work out. Let's please not forget - Wing Commander was a game that pushed boundaries. Same with its sequels. Heck I think Wing Commander III is considered one of the first successful interactive movies. Privateer was also incredibly innovative for its time. A lot of other non-Roberts games pushed boundaries in the past as well (MechWarrior 2, the X-Wing series, System Shock, Deus Ex...).
- MMO's are more difficult, for sure, to fulfill as far as promises, but I think making sure Star Citizen also has a strong single player component is a great way to help diffuse that issue. Let's say worst case scenario, they have some problems with the persistant world and it's delayed in Star Citizen. (Hopefully that won't happen, but playing devil's advocate.) Well guess what. They release the single player campaign (probably with several paths so some replayability built in) and at least I can have fun in the world while I'm waiting for the rest. Maybe also an arena mode similar to MWO, so I can duel other players, or I can play single. The reason I'm bored with MWO is, I have plenty of mechs, but I'm frankly worn out on the same thing over and over again (basically, deathmatch with occasional capture the flag elements) - no surprises, nothing new, no story...just the same conflicts over and over. It might be different if I saw things being added besides new mechs/maps, but frankly, 100 new mechs and maps wouldn't make the game any more fun at this point - it needs more variety in what we can do! It's fun occasionally, I think the engine is great, but there's nothing to keep my interest or make me feel part of something. So I'm pretty much done investing in it (I've invested a good bit but I have more mechs than I need at this point and don't really see the point of getting any new ones) because I only occasionally play a few rounds, then I'm over it for a few weeks. It's sad, and not what I want to feel in regards to MWO, but I seriously could enjoy JUST the single player portion of Star Citizen a lot more even if that's all they achieved (and I fully expect they will get their persistant world going as they have one hell of a team [including many people who've worked for Digital Anvil/Origin Systems in the past, some with prior experience with each other], but again, playing devil's advocate).
- Communication from RSI has been phenomenal. They've had two issues so far. When the hangar released, many people were unhappy because there was a timeout getting in (me included). Within 24 hours, they increased the servers (I believe 32fold, but don't quote me on that) and completely solved that issue. They also have a kickass patcher (great music, very informative) and issued a patch within that first 24 hours with a bunch of random enhancements/bug fixes. The other issue was, some people were annoyed at the prices of the hangar's swag store when it opened (things like a drive around buggy, posters, etc.). On a holiday weekend, Chris himself wrote a letter addressing their concerns (complete with poll) and better explaining the purpose of why things are the way they are during this initial step. I've never seen anything like this from MWO, and in fact, we have no idea where things are with the persistant world. On the other hand, I can watch the YouTube show of the week to find out what's going on with Star Citizen, or I can read up on the website.
I'm not at all arguing MWO is terrible (it has a lot of promise; I just don't see it going anywhere right now) or that Star Citizen won't have it's share of growing pains. But, given I've invested a good bit in both projects, I already feel much more rewarded by the guys over at Cloud Impreium/RSI and that they value it a lot more and want to make sure I know what's going on. So they'll be getting any future funding instead.
So yes, at the moment, I'm much, much more excited for Star Citizen.
- One poster commented that Star Citizen is just another space sim and games that push boundaries as Chris Roberts is promising don't work out. Let's please not forget - Wing Commander was a game that pushed boundaries. Same with its sequels. Heck I think Wing Commander III is considered one of the first successful interactive movies. Privateer was also incredibly innovative for its time. A lot of other non-Roberts games pushed boundaries in the past as well (MechWarrior 2, the X-Wing series, System Shock, Deus Ex...).
- MMO's are more difficult, for sure, to fulfill as far as promises, but I think making sure Star Citizen also has a strong single player component is a great way to help diffuse that issue. Let's say worst case scenario, they have some problems with the persistant world and it's delayed in Star Citizen. (Hopefully that won't happen, but playing devil's advocate.) Well guess what. They release the single player campaign (probably with several paths so some replayability built in) and at least I can have fun in the world while I'm waiting for the rest. Maybe also an arena mode similar to MWO, so I can duel other players, or I can play single. The reason I'm bored with MWO is, I have plenty of mechs, but I'm frankly worn out on the same thing over and over again (basically, deathmatch with occasional capture the flag elements) - no surprises, nothing new, no story...just the same conflicts over and over. It might be different if I saw things being added besides new mechs/maps, but frankly, 100 new mechs and maps wouldn't make the game any more fun at this point - it needs more variety in what we can do! It's fun occasionally, I think the engine is great, but there's nothing to keep my interest or make me feel part of something. So I'm pretty much done investing in it (I've invested a good bit but I have more mechs than I need at this point and don't really see the point of getting any new ones) because I only occasionally play a few rounds, then I'm over it for a few weeks. It's sad, and not what I want to feel in regards to MWO, but I seriously could enjoy JUST the single player portion of Star Citizen a lot more even if that's all they achieved (and I fully expect they will get their persistant world going as they have one hell of a team [including many people who've worked for Digital Anvil/Origin Systems in the past, some with prior experience with each other], but again, playing devil's advocate).
- Communication from RSI has been phenomenal. They've had two issues so far. When the hangar released, many people were unhappy because there was a timeout getting in (me included). Within 24 hours, they increased the servers (I believe 32fold, but don't quote me on that) and completely solved that issue. They also have a kickass patcher (great music, very informative) and issued a patch within that first 24 hours with a bunch of random enhancements/bug fixes. The other issue was, some people were annoyed at the prices of the hangar's swag store when it opened (things like a drive around buggy, posters, etc.). On a holiday weekend, Chris himself wrote a letter addressing their concerns (complete with poll) and better explaining the purpose of why things are the way they are during this initial step. I've never seen anything like this from MWO, and in fact, we have no idea where things are with the persistant world. On the other hand, I can watch the YouTube show of the week to find out what's going on with Star Citizen, or I can read up on the website.
I'm not at all arguing MWO is terrible (it has a lot of promise; I just don't see it going anywhere right now) or that Star Citizen won't have it's share of growing pains. But, given I've invested a good bit in both projects, I already feel much more rewarded by the guys over at Cloud Impreium/RSI and that they value it a lot more and want to make sure I know what's going on. So they'll be getting any future funding instead.
So yes, at the moment, I'm much, much more excited for Star Citizen.
#363
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- FP Veteran - Beta 2
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Posted 02 September 2013 - 09:19 PM
I am not sure how Star Citizen becomes a "threat" to MWO in any sense, how all the Wing Commander, Privateer, and Freelancer series ever threatened the MW1 to 4. Different strokes for different folks. Those games are for people looking for a space sim. By the way, the Descent Freespace IP has been bought and personally I think Freespace has exceeded even the Wing Commander series. I also hear CCP of EVE Online is planning a space fighter series that can coexist with the EVE universe.
Anyone who has played Privateer and Freelancer knows the mechanics are much closer to let's say, the X franchise, like the coming X Rebirth someone posted in a separate thread. So you are basically talking about a space sim + RPG + MMO, with economies, missions, a vast universe to explore, in line of the true 4E game (Explore, Exploit, Evolve, Expand).
I do think MWO is stuck in its own niche in the FTP shooter genre, while Star Citizen has the makings of a scifi space MMO more in the line of EVE Online and Star Trek Online. Personally, I think independent massive online games have the most promise in the MMO format as opposed to shooters like MWO and Hawken no matter how they dress it up. But if you are thinking Star Citizen is going to be some kind of MWO substitute one is going to be mistaken, unless you are a seasoned RPG, MMO player.
The very name "Star Citizen" reeks of being a space based MMO.
Anyone who has played Privateer and Freelancer knows the mechanics are much closer to let's say, the X franchise, like the coming X Rebirth someone posted in a separate thread. So you are basically talking about a space sim + RPG + MMO, with economies, missions, a vast universe to explore, in line of the true 4E game (Explore, Exploit, Evolve, Expand).
I do think MWO is stuck in its own niche in the FTP shooter genre, while Star Citizen has the makings of a scifi space MMO more in the line of EVE Online and Star Trek Online. Personally, I think independent massive online games have the most promise in the MMO format as opposed to shooters like MWO and Hawken no matter how they dress it up. But if you are thinking Star Citizen is going to be some kind of MWO substitute one is going to be mistaken, unless you are a seasoned RPG, MMO player.
The very name "Star Citizen" reeks of being a space based MMO.
#364
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- 28 posts
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Posted 02 September 2013 - 09:40 PM
I don't think Star Citizen is a "threat" to MWO either. They could both coexist quite happily, in my opinion, with their own audiences and likely a significantly overlapping audience that would be glad to alternate. I know if MWO lived up to the initial promises I'd be playing it as well.
The comparison between the two is only analogous because they're both science fiction simulators with similar mechanics in that they both have more thought to the controls than your standard FPS and take more skill to successfully pilot. They also both disappeared around the same time and are just now trying to reemerge. I played Wing Commander III and MechWarrior 2 somewhere in the same rough period of years, and they both are near and dear to my heart. I didn't play one and exclude the other because I played the one. So they're not competitive in that sense - a space game is not going to satisfy the desire for a mech game and vice versa. But I would count them as being in the same broad genre.
Star Citizen isn't JUST going to be an MMO if we get what's promised. Its Squadron 42 element will be a full branching single-player game (ala Wing Commander) all on its own. The MMO element is in addition (though can certainly be the main focus for a large swath of people), and I agree with you about the 4E elements and (sim + RPG + MMO). MWO was planned to be a simulator + MMO as well; it's just the MMO persistant world portion hasn't materialized, and no single player was ever planned.
I've never played EVE Online, but I have Star Trek Online, and while the latter was enjoyable, it's not a simulator in the sense of getting in and actually flying like a fighter (or mech for that matter). It was a very click-oriented interface. Fun, but not the same. The world might be similar, sure, but I personally classify games more by mechanics of operation than mechanics of the universe. I can see how others might see it differently though.
Freespace was a lot of fun, and I enjoyed it, but for me (and it's obviously down to personal preference) nothing will really eclipse Wing Commander. Part of that is nostalgia; Freespace exists because of Wing Commander and follows in its footsteps. It also came out after most of the Wing Commander series, so had some newer technology in its arsenal. Great game though, agreed.
The comparison between the two is only analogous because they're both science fiction simulators with similar mechanics in that they both have more thought to the controls than your standard FPS and take more skill to successfully pilot. They also both disappeared around the same time and are just now trying to reemerge. I played Wing Commander III and MechWarrior 2 somewhere in the same rough period of years, and they both are near and dear to my heart. I didn't play one and exclude the other because I played the one. So they're not competitive in that sense - a space game is not going to satisfy the desire for a mech game and vice versa. But I would count them as being in the same broad genre.
Star Citizen isn't JUST going to be an MMO if we get what's promised. Its Squadron 42 element will be a full branching single-player game (ala Wing Commander) all on its own. The MMO element is in addition (though can certainly be the main focus for a large swath of people), and I agree with you about the 4E elements and (sim + RPG + MMO). MWO was planned to be a simulator + MMO as well; it's just the MMO persistant world portion hasn't materialized, and no single player was ever planned.
I've never played EVE Online, but I have Star Trek Online, and while the latter was enjoyable, it's not a simulator in the sense of getting in and actually flying like a fighter (or mech for that matter). It was a very click-oriented interface. Fun, but not the same. The world might be similar, sure, but I personally classify games more by mechanics of operation than mechanics of the universe. I can see how others might see it differently though.
Freespace was a lot of fun, and I enjoyed it, but for me (and it's obviously down to personal preference) nothing will really eclipse Wing Commander. Part of that is nostalgia; Freespace exists because of Wing Commander and follows in its footsteps. It also came out after most of the Wing Commander series, so had some newer technology in its arsenal. Great game though, agreed.
Edited by KnightWing, 02 September 2013 - 09:42 PM.
#365
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- 1,182 posts
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- LocationPhoenix, Arizona
Posted 03 September 2013 - 08:00 AM
Well, in for a penny, in for a pound.
Let tally up what I've spent so far:
MWO
$120 - Legendary Founders Package
$80 - Project Phoenix Overlord Package
$30 - PP Saber Reinforcement Package
$99.98 - MC credits
GRAND TOTAL = $329.98
STAR CITIZEN
$125 - Freelancer Orginal Backers Package
$150 - Gladiator Light Bomber
$175 - Starfarer Heavy Transport
GRAND TOTAL = $450
So far with Mechwarrior Online I received over a year of fun, non-stop play. Well, it stopped recently cause game is seriously borked right now. I needed to take a break from the BS. But, I will be back Sept 17th.
Star Citizen has only given me a Hanger Modules and promises. But, so far they have delivered on the first promise, (Hanger) EXACTLY when they said and it was EXACTLY what they said it will be. If they truly get the DOGFIGHT module to us before the end of the year, the scales will definitely be tipping towards SC.
But, in the end, I'm looking for the SCI-FI SIM that I will be playing for the next FIVE to TEN years so what I have contributed to both games is basically VENTURE CAPITAL.
Which ever investment delivers the goods in the next year or so will garner my attention (and more importantly my money) for the next decade.
I'm willing to wait it out a bit.
Let tally up what I've spent so far:
MWO
$120 - Legendary Founders Package
$80 - Project Phoenix Overlord Package
$30 - PP Saber Reinforcement Package
$99.98 - MC credits
GRAND TOTAL = $329.98
STAR CITIZEN
$125 - Freelancer Orginal Backers Package
$150 - Gladiator Light Bomber
$175 - Starfarer Heavy Transport
GRAND TOTAL = $450
So far with Mechwarrior Online I received over a year of fun, non-stop play. Well, it stopped recently cause game is seriously borked right now. I needed to take a break from the BS. But, I will be back Sept 17th.
Star Citizen has only given me a Hanger Modules and promises. But, so far they have delivered on the first promise, (Hanger) EXACTLY when they said and it was EXACTLY what they said it will be. If they truly get the DOGFIGHT module to us before the end of the year, the scales will definitely be tipping towards SC.
But, in the end, I'm looking for the SCI-FI SIM that I will be playing for the next FIVE to TEN years so what I have contributed to both games is basically VENTURE CAPITAL.
Which ever investment delivers the goods in the next year or so will garner my attention (and more importantly my money) for the next decade.
I'm willing to wait it out a bit.
#366
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- Bad Company
- 131 posts
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- LocationNewark, DE
Posted 03 September 2013 - 11:39 AM
Tsig, on 01 September 2013 - 02:13 AM, said:
Has it occurred to anyone that, maybe the reason PGI keeps sending such scathing responses is because this Forum Community has become incredibly toxic? This forum has become filled with people that have nothing but negativity for anything PGI does. Even if PGI implemented some of the features that this forum has suggested, which they have in the past, you all would just find something else to complain about. No matter what, PGI can't seem to do anything right for you people.
Ever heard 'You reap what you sew.'?
#367
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 03 September 2013 - 12:16 PM
Desdain, on 03 September 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:
Ever heard 'You reap what you sew.'?
More "it takes two to tango" from where I sit.
In other words, yeah, some of us have been quite nasty about things. Shame on those people.
But PGI had their role in bringing things to where they are.
You can't exactly up and say X percent of the BT/MW fanbase are raging jerkfaces for the sake of being raging jerkfaces.
#368
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- Elite Founder
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- LocationSinsinnati Ohio
Posted 03 September 2013 - 12:23 PM
I have a vote of "No Confidence" in PGI, and even if Chris and his team make some mistakes along the way, he hasn't lied to us. So I'm really feeling way more faith in Star Citizen. MWO is all but dead to me, especially after playing War Thunder and seeing what they've done then the efforts at PGI are just pathetic, and the lies are to much.
At least when MWO flops maybe MWLL will get a reboot!
At least when MWO flops maybe MWLL will get a reboot!
#369
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- 28 posts
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Posted 03 September 2013 - 10:17 PM
Werewolf486, on 03 September 2013 - 12:23 PM, said:
At least when MWO flops maybe MWLL will get a reboot!
You never know (and I never played MWLL), but interestingly enough, Dan Tracy, one of the guys chiefly responsible for MWLL and so a CryEngine expert is working on...*drumroll*...Star Citizen. Which I'm excited about from all the good things I've heard about MWLL! But it does beg the question, why didn't MWO approach them given the apparent popularity of the mod? I know this, by the way, because on the official weekly Star Citizen webcast called Wingman's Hanger, they interview all the different devs so you get to know them a bit.
#370
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- Knight Errant
- 581 posts
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- LocationBottom Of a Bottle
Posted 04 September 2013 - 08:03 AM
lockwoodx, on 31 August 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:
Even when they do communicate, does it make a difference? No. Hence the customers being trolled over 3Pv.
Tsig, on 01 September 2013 - 02:13 AM, said:
Has it occurred to anyone that, maybe the reason PGI keeps sending such scathing responses is because this Forum Community has become incredibly toxic? This forum has become filled with people that have nothing but negativity for anything PGI does. Even if PGI implemented some of the features that this forum has suggested, which they have in the past, you all would just find something else to complain about. No matter what, PGI can't seem to do anything right for you people.
Scroll down to VOYAGER DIRECT, That is the correct way to communicate when there is an issue with the community!
https://robertsspace...3241-17-Million
Desdain, on 03 September 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:
Ever heard 'You reap what you sew.'?
SOW
#371
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- 1,182 posts
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- LocationPhoenix, Arizona
Posted 04 September 2013 - 08:28 AM
Lord of All, on 04 September 2013 - 08:03 AM, said:
Scroll down to VOYAGER DIRECT, That is the correct way to communicate when there is an issue with the community!
https://robertsspace...3241-17-Million
SOW
Yes. I loved that. Not only are they specifically NOT trying to screw anyone, but when the slightest community stir was leaning towards this....BAM! An immediate, clear, thoughtful and friendly communication to clear things up.
Even though I love stompy robots more than any other genre (space ships is close 2nd or 3rd) GREAT customer server will win me over every time.
#372
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- The Defiant
- 32 posts
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- LocationNorthwest USA
Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:30 PM
Sky Rangers have a strong showing in SC. http://www.skye-rangers.net/home
#373
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- The Infernal
- 1,393 posts
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- LocationThe Fox Den
Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:48 PM
I know I'm on the SC forums, but personally not going to stay with a multi-game unit for it... I like clean distinct differences in my social circle for games I play to keep it fresh and different. Thus I joined LAMP, one of the large free floating SC corps.
But did notice alot of MWO unit's recruiting once the 24hr stream went up in June/July...
But did notice alot of MWO unit's recruiting once the 24hr stream went up in June/July...
#374
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- 1,435 posts
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- LocationGalatea (Mercenary's Star)
Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:15 PM
We of the Equestria Royal Guard stand ready to fight on both land and in the heavens
#375
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- Elite Founder
- 3 posts
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Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:15 PM
The 5th Drakøns/Warsworn Gaming shall be there
#376
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- The Vicious
- 620 posts
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- LocationEast Bay
Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:21 PM
I am personally going to wait for the Dogfight module to come out before dropping money. I spend too much on this game as it is, but can't stop!
#377
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- 435 posts
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Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:40 PM
Blackstone is playing both. Though I believe we will be playing as Blackstar Knights.
#378
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- Elite Founder
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Posted 11 September 2013 - 10:23 PM
The vast majority of the Blazing Aces will be playing Star Citizen.
#379
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- Rage
- 136 posts
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Posted 11 September 2013 - 10:48 PM
The entire Dismal Disinherited team will also be in SC. The hanger module was a sweet release and we are all avidly awaiting more content to play with. The hopes we had for MWO we now direct at SC as MWO is fine and all but so far a big let down on its potential.
#380
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- Legendary Founder
- 163 posts
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- LocationSomewhere in the Periphery...
Posted 11 September 2013 - 11:17 PM
Yeah, I noticed a lot of familiar names over there, which is totally not a bad thing. The community over there is a lot more cheerful and vibrant too, not nearly as much stagnancy or doom and gloom as over here (which is unfortunate because I love the Btech universe :/ ).
And on the topic of LTI, it's not that big of a deal, you essentially just don't have to pay small in game fees every few in game months with in game credits on your base hull, but if you feel it is a big deal there are plenty of reputable people out there that would swap your packages for LTI ones, with any price differences being paid in skins. The main thing is CIG said peoplecouldn't advertise such services on their site, meaning you've got to go to an external source and if you get scammed it's not their fault.
But chances are you've done the research and knew all that already so I'm just making a fool of myself Carry on then Citizen.
And on the topic of LTI, it's not that big of a deal, you essentially just don't have to pay small in game fees every few in game months with in game credits on your base hull, but if you feel it is a big deal there are plenty of reputable people out there that would swap your packages for LTI ones, with any price differences being paid in skins. The main thing is CIG said peoplecouldn't advertise such services on their site, meaning you've got to go to an external source and if you get scammed it's not their fault.
But chances are you've done the research and knew all that already so I'm just making a fool of myself
Carry on then Citizen.
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