58 replies to this topic

[BourbonFaucet]

Egomane, on 06 May 2014 - 06:03 AM, said:

Any post that is calling for developers to get fired is not acceptable. It's a form of harrasment.

I was poking fun at those guys with the tiny text at the bottom saying it's satire. Spamming to fire people doesn't do any good.

[Rasc4l]

Karl Streiger, on 06 May 2014 - 05:50 AM, said:

Thats a perfect example - why things are ugly.
My guess what will happen if you double the charge time

So PopTarter or sniper will show every 8 seconds...maybe they will even over exceed ghost heat penalty - because they have 8-10seconds for cool down.

The mid range trooper / allrounder Mechs (SHD-2K, Grand Dragon (Flame), Wolverine ...Thunderbolt) will be at the reciving end. with virtually halved firepower.

If you increase the damage to accumulate the reduced RoF you only increase the usage as a sniper weapon.

That's the whole point, PPC is more a long range weapon and this move would push it towards that. Due to the RoF decrease, it wouldn't do so much short term dps but in the hands of good snipers and long range playing mediums, it would still be very useful.

[Karl Streiger]

Tombstoner, on 06 May 2014 - 06:05 AM, said:

all excellent reasons showing the interactions between currently implemented factors. its also exactly why the game needs a new factor called dynamic precision where player choices effect accuracy. thus creating a player controlled COF.

PLUS a hitbox armor model that is based on how the hits are applied: player choice - not 2d6 hit tables. Maybe even tweaking by hitbox size (for example a ton of armor may include 40 points for the awesome but only 25 for the Spider)

We have a similar topic lately - in the german subforum - the CoF is really controversy discussed and it really needs to be made carefully. To much and its a game of dice - to few nothing changed.

I thought that CoF may be a good idea - but alone - and with current hitboxes i fear that mechs with "huge" hitboxes will get nerfed by CoF. While good and slimm hit box mechs get a buff.

I

[Josef Koba]

I don't even know where my loyalty medallions are, to be honest. One's in a Kintaro I think. My buddy religiously changes his out so if it's true and that they're keeping track of that stuff, he's going to have a ton of Loyalty Points (No further information).

In terms of meta, I generally ignore it and run what I want. I'm largely successful with any build that doesn't include flamers. I don't believe you NEED the meta to succeed. We run a Firestarter with a bunch of small lasers and target info gathering and wreck things and that's not meta if I'm not mistaken.

[Troopie]

"My customer experience"
I had to say, this year, I have seen some community communications
I part of me is disappointed waiting CW for ever, which makes really big expectation of CW.
Other part is hoping that there will be full MWO, filling all earlier promises from beginning.
I have spend my money for supporting game development, I might be "whale" in statistics, but not big "whale". (F2P buying customer)

End of last year, communication level was so, that trust of PGI was gone --> relatively small dev group, big promises. Game content was only few new maps and lots mechs, where you need to use money, at least to make room for new mechs. Only grinding.

I saw some slide from GDC, that did give some light to PGI. Dev team is good, and can make awesome stuff. There is good constructive conversations at forums, not only balancing issues.

Setback, CV delays

More positive. Last update did bring some early state players back, but let see, will it last, because CV delays.

This is triggering me to go more and more to buy clan mechs, but still not so sure...

After all, way is better. I hate META, but still there is people who plays only meta ladder as competitive groups. Why take it away. For me is enough, if you can make launcher, with disabling or enabling different types of rules, and this way, you cannot use full meta, or meta at all.

I really hope, that PGI is focusing to matchmaking and fulfilling CV promises.
If this comes true, there will be long lasting community, and paying customers.

[Jerrard Cranston]

Just want to give kudo's to the OP. I'm a Founder as well and my concerns mirror your own. There are a lot of things I could complain about and there are a lot of things I'm also happy with MWO about (I think communication has seen steady improvement that past half year). At the end of the day though I've been strung along for Community Warfare for far too long. I didn't trust PGI/IGP enough to buy a Phoenix package when they came out, and I'm glad I went with my gut on that one. I've seen a few people come back to my unit to check on the game to see how private matches and the LM are working (again, a step forward), but at the end of the day everyone is waiting for community warfare and the number of regular players continues to drop.

[Tombstoner]

Karl Streiger, on 06 May 2014 - 06:13 AM, said:

PLUS a hitbox armor model that is based on how the hits are applied: player choice - not 2d6 hit tables. Maybe even tweaking by hitbox size (for example a ton of armor may include 40 points for the awesome but only 25 for the Spider)

We have a similar topic lately - in the german subforum - the CoF is really controversy discussed and it really needs to be made carefully. To much and its a game of dice - to few nothing changed.

I thought that CoF may be a good idea - but alone - and with current hitboxes i fear that mechs with "huge" hitboxes will get nerfed by CoF. While good and slimm hit box mechs get a buff.

I

the solution really has 2 parts. if PGi implemented the first then a COF may not be needed, but MWO should have a COF as something to grind and spend money on to reach 100% convergent shots.

First each mech gets a set of armor coefficients one per location. Without them art work becomes a part of mech survivability and the atlas is at a huge disadvantage since it's so easy to hit even at extreme ranges, by virtue of its size it must have some sort of compensation.

PGI must build a gunnery range and build a model simulating how mech size, speed, range, interacts with hit frequency and location. that way PGI can normalize armor across all mechs such that TTK is the same. lights have a co factor of 1 with assaults posably being 3-4. light have speed for survival with armor for the atlas.

Then accuracy can be explored.

Edited by Tombstoner, 06 May 2014 - 08:06 AM.

[Doakes]

LAUNCH MODULE: We are definitely getting some good reviews here. People not only like it, but a few guys are saying it is at least temporarily bringing some of their guys to the group.

Are any clans or individual premium members making an effort to invite new guys to the private matches? Maybe we could all get together and do a weekly or biweekly event to encourage this. We have stock mech Mondays. The scramble Tuesdays.....maybe we could start "Tag Along Thursdays". Something along the lines of every vet shadows and helps a new guy in two man teams. That encourages growing the groups, changes the flavor a bit, and helps PGI get more premium time guys. Any thoughts?

[ZenFool]

Weapon balance will always be argued about, but I must say as someone who has played every game since MW2, PGI has done a fairly good job. I know I might get some eyebrows raised from saying that, but I feel its true. I even like the occasional shake up of weapons to keep everyone honest. I don't always agree with what they do(see reduced range on AC2.....) but I feel they are trying.

My only real issue is the lack of a true lobby. It makes the game feel incomplete. This feeling and the experience of new players has eroded what I believe would have been a very very healthy population.

Oh, and Doakes... ANY attempt on PGI's behalf to help this situation would go a long way toward consumer confidence.

Edited by ZenFool, 06 May 2014 - 12:06 PM.

[SharpTooth Steiner]

Egomane, on 06 May 2014 - 06:03 AM, said:

I removed the "form" posts.

Any post that is calling for developers to get fired is not acceptable. It's a form of harrasment.

As one of the posts mentioned that this should be send to support in mass and/or regularly...
No, that is also not acceptable. That is also not feedback but harrasment. You are not doing yourself a favor with it!

If there is a "mute", "ignore" or "block" button available. It is next to impossible to accuse someone of harassment on the internet. I know, I've tested this lol

Edited by SharpTooth Steiner, 06 May 2014 - 01:04 PM.

[Sable]

Not to completely dismiss the OP but this really sounds like the same complaining i was seeing on the forum 6 months ago when we had no new information. They have been delivering everything they said they would so far. They outlined their timeline of features in development. It's like you went into a coma for 6 months.

[Greyfyl]

Quite honestly.....anyone that didn't see where this company/game was headed back in closed beta had their heads in the sand. It couldn't have been more clear how this whole thing was going to play out.

Single gold mechs costing hundreds of dollars. Freaking hilarious.

[Doakes]

Sable, on 06 May 2014 - 01:32 PM, said:

Not to completely dismiss the OP but this really sounds like the same complaining i was seeing on the forum 6 months ago when we had no new information. They have been delivering everything they said they would so far. They outlined their timeline of features in development. It's like you went into a coma for 6 months.

I think you are mistaking some of my statements. The criticism is aimed purely to be constructive and I have said there are many things they are doing extremely well. I never claimed they are not delivering on their end there; simply posting some things I wish could be done better and discussing things WE can do better.

For CW....it has been promised and delayed and promised and delayed. Read my link. Read what we have been told for over a year. Now we find out it isn't off the drawing board properly? That is most certainly failure to deliver.

Edited by Doakes, 06 May 2014 - 05:20 PM.

[girl on fire]

blehhh. i get so burned on waiting and waiting.The game has been the same for months and everything they advertise as some great new feature just seems like nothing. private matches? great (for some people, not me), but... isn't this game out of beta? why are they still adding that kind of thing? i may be wrong but are games that come out of beta supposed to be complete with all the function you expect from game? maybe? i could see releasing it and then adding major other things that change the game in meaningful ways but this is not that.. I think.

perhaps it is just my inexperience, but, it seems odd to me that this sort of feature has taken so long.. at some point shouldn't you put off those minor functionality things and work on what will actually make this a game? there's no point to anything, progression for the sake of progression isnt fun (IMO). what are the stakes? what am i working towards? what is the goal? i launch the game i run around and pewpew annnnd.. make minimal amount of cbills that takes forever to buy the simplest things so i end up never experimenting, because, what's the point? I still need 2 more chasis to unlock the next level of progression and and and....

i realize the need to release purchasable stuff like new mechs and such but they seem to come far too frequently at the things we've been actually waiting for drag on and on and seem no close to reality than they were 3 years ago (so i hear i only started playing last year).

i don't really have a lot of money (i only work part time for minimum wage), and because this game is so bare bones and exceedingly expensive i just don't see a point. why are video games the only industry in which a business feels entitled to money before actually producing the product? cart before the horse, much, pGI? perhaps it might be one thing if it had been in the works all this time, but (apparently) it has not... so what exactly have they been doing? what are these mech packs for if not funding development on the things we actually want?

it just seems like this is not a franchise that is beign taken seriously or seen as having any sort of longevity...i don't mean any offence but this is just how it seems to me.

sry for spelling ad grammar. english is my second languiage,

my .02. i'll keep lurking ont he forums and watching for changes but right now i have no meaning to start the game up. really hope that changes cause tge game has a really fun base it just needs to expand more and be more liek the old mechwarrior games. i downloaded the MW4 free version from mektek when it came out and it is tons of fun. SP, anyway. i never tried MP>

Edited by girl on fire, 06 May 2014 - 06:44 PM.

[Karl Streiger]

SharpTooth Steiner, on 06 May 2014 - 01:03 PM, said:

If there is a "mute", "ignore" or "block" button available. It is next to impossible to accuse someone of harassment on the internet. I know, I've tested this lol

You mean you try to harrass others and wait for the police to knock on your door?
Hm - harrassment like team killing other Atlas Mechs in your AS7-D?
Interesting a large Laser in the Left Arm.... i know it don't have to be your fault - sometimes i have also problems to differ the red arrows from the blue ones

Regarding new player experience - i was shocked .... some body must have turned to many stones - i hardly ever can remember such a vile behavior and rude language in MWO. I droped only 5 times - while MM did wonky thinks. There was almost a single or even more person in my team -that was unable to reflect his mistake - aqussing others.
Another friend told me - he was the last Mech standing on conquest - only some points till victory. Because of the flaming he let the other team kill him - he didn't want to give this idiot a victory.

[Grimmrog]

I wonder a lot more, why this is working so commonly on games in the internet.

People spend X amount of Dollar for a promised feature. feature gets not delivered. Another Features is announced, and then these people do again spend money for that.

Why?

Imagine you would hire a builder company to build you a house and you pay them. Yet they have charged you but not even half finished it with the promised deadline. Now their Boss comes around and says: Hey for another 20k$ we build you a Pool too.
Would you really agree with that?
Why is that even working in the internet? In RL the builder company would be in extremely serious troubles now.

[Aresye]

When it comes to balance, the main issue is that it's all being built and changed over a broken foundation. Hit detection issues, weapon mechanics, and balance changes resulting from things that aren't even related to weapon balance (ex: 3,3,3,3).

They're chasing their own fictional concept of "balance," but in the process of doing so, they're continuously chasing their own tails by introducing new balance problems.

At this point in the game there really isn't anything to do about the current weapon balance and meta, aside from scratching everything entirely. They need to fix hit detection first and foremost, reset everything to tabletop values, eliminate ghost heat, and THEN work on changing individual weapons.

The balance is currently so wonky that as soon as hit detection gets fixed, everything's going to go to hell. SRM boats will suddenly be overpowered, laser boats will be picking off people from left to right, and PGIs going to end up changing even more weapons away from tabletop values (not to mention introduce more wonky mechanics like a multiplier for ghost heat).

Now, I'm not a tabletop player, but it's still a game, and thus it's designed to be balanced. I understand tabletop rules don't transfer perfectly into video games, but I also understand that nearly every MechWarrior game up til now has largely been based on those values, and (for the most part) didn't have any balance issues aside from massive boating, which can easily be tweaked by adjusting hardpoints and slots on the mechs (like MW4), instead of adjusting the weapons themselves, which does nothing but nerf most mechs and buff others.

[Karl Streiger]

Well my SRMs work well... and i have allready scored multiple kills with my SRM 8 medal mount on the Victor.
And as before - they work as intended vs internals but have problems when used against armor (or at least this what i have seen)

The problem with TT values is that you still don't have range brackets. Currently the MLAS is to powerful in comparison to the Large Laser. The increased range helps a little bit to make the summary look good
(if i sum up the average damage of a MLAS over range and compare it with the LLAS over range - i get the same ration as when i would do this in MWO - but anyhow the system is still corrupt - simple because thats the way how aggregation (sum is a aggregation works) - (Have you heard about the cow that did drown in a lake - the lake has a average depth of 20cm)

Instead of keeping true to the values - you need a complete new concept purely based on immersion:

What is the MLAS supposed to do?

• its a everymechs weapon
  
• can do everything from heaten up your can of beans till melting some heavy mechs armor

What is the LLAS supposed to do?

• dangerous weapon, killer weapon
  
• deal large damage at medium to long range

Read the novels - of the Sunglow Type 2 of the Thunderbolt.... Charley did Look in the face of death - when the Thunderbolt did point his laser at his Mech. Do you have the feeling that you face death when a thunderbolt turns its pommel arm laser in your direction?

So the LLAS should do 12-17 dmg...with a cruel 2sec burn, but maybe only a cylce time of 8seconds.
The MLAS on the other hand may deal only 2 dmg but with a much much faster cycle time and short beam duration
(Wait is this not the SLAS?)
No its not - don't keep the TT values - the SLAS could be a sniper laser....3-5dmg with the cylce time of the large laser - but only a short beam duration. (Everything that fits)

Same could be made for the PPC.... it must be a seriously devastating weapon.
So give it splash damage.... that tore a Mechs torso wide open - not just hit a single location. Increase the heat on a Mech that is hit by a PPC....

I can go on an on. There isn't a single good reason to keep the TT values.

[Trystan Thorne]

All I can say that in recent month I think PGI has improved the way they deal with the community and how they communicate.
I think most of us like the game and want it to succeed. Most of us are a bit frustrated at the same time that this game could be so much better as PGI hasn’t implemented many of the great sounding features yet.
At the same time they did some crazy stunts (though how much of that is PGI and how much of that is IGP, we don’t know). And because this game is niche and received some bad press with the Clan package (most of the press agreed that the Clan package is a cheeky cash in), quite a few people are afraid that it is true and this game will shut down without us ever seeing CW.
I’m sure even PGI sees that errors have been made and I can understand that they probably can’t admit to all of them.
But, I do believe that these errors were not always PGI’s fault and I’m pretty certain that they don’t operate some kind of scam here.
I also do believe that they are passionate about MWO.
They do want to earn money and they should. Now I think they could do better there, if some prices were a bit cheaper.
I would see Marvel Heroes as a good example. They started a bit too pricey, but listened to their community and prices went down. At the same time they worked on the issues the game had and improved it quite well and popularity went up and the game is getting more popular and better press too now.
Now PGI works a bit slower (probably smaller team), but as I said earlier I see improvement. I don’t know where this game is going, but right now I still have loads of fun with it and that’s a good thing.
If PGI delivers on their promises, I could see this game become really popular. Now, it will be never as popular as World of Tanks or War Thunder for example, but it has the potential to be ‘THE’ Mech game.
I’m sure once CW comes into play and it really turns out like it sounds, then the press will once again take a look at MWO and we surely will see some positive press too. Right now, maybe it’s a good thing that the press doesn’t take a second look at MWO yet.
Call me a white knight if you want. I see myself maybe as a black & white knight.
There are still enough great things about this game to keep me more positive than negative and I don’t regret my Phoenix package at all (even with not everything been delivered yet). Maybe it’s because I also never take my gaming hobby too serious anyway (way more important things in life) and usually don’t get upset easily about games.

Okay, I’ll stop rambling now.