238 replies to this topic

[MortVent]

TimePeriod, on 11 May 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:

They are energy weapons

Direct fire energy weapons, where lasers are hitscan weapons

Learn your weapons. Once you actually know what you're talking about people might take you serious...

[TimePeriod]

MortVent, on 11 May 2014 - 11:20 AM, said:

Direct fire energy weapons, where lasers are hitscan weapons

Learn your weapons. Once you actually know what you're talking about people might take you serious...

You used ERPPC x2.
-Faster, longer range, higher damage, more FLD.


I used LRM's.
-A lot slower, minimum range, less damage, a lot less FLD.

Where the **** do you get your logic from? I used a feeble weapon to do something far less then you and yet you proclaim yourself the best? **** you and your logic, man. If you are supposed to brag about something, do it with something that is worse then the opponent.

You don't earn bragging rights by carpet bombing a taliban fighter stuck out in the open with a crapton of clusterbombs.

Edited by TimePeriod, 11 May 2014 - 11:29 AM.

[MortVent]

TimePeriod, on 11 May 2014 - 11:23 AM, said:

You used ERPPC x2.
-Faster, longer range, higher damage, more FLD.


I used LRM's.
-A lot slower, minimum range, less damage, a lot less FLD.

Where the **** do you get your logic from? I used a feeble weapon to do something far less then you and yet you proclaim yourself the best? **** you and your logic, man. If you are supposed to brag about something, do it with something that is worse then the opponent.

tsk tsk

You dared me to do it with direct fire weapons.
You then complained that PPCs were not autocannons
You were corrected, and then grumbled that PPCs were energy weapons still

That's the logic behind telling you to learn your weapons. Silly rabbit

I've mostly killed mechs with... LRMs and Streaks. I'm usually in a catapult A1,C1, or C4 though now I pilot Griffins (all three) built around a lrm20 with back up weapons (one with a lrm5 and two medium lasers, one with 2 medium pulse lasers, last one with one medium laser and 2 ssrm2s)

Rarely do I pilot my Jester, K2, or thunderbolts ( along with some trial mechs and the champ models from my overlord package of the mechs I sold off cause I didn't like them)

So I have used the weapons you say I need to use to be able to call you out btw...

[Wolfways]

Murasama, on 11 May 2014 - 10:46 AM, said:

The whole point of lights are to scout and disengage.

Not in MWO, but you can play that way.

Quote

It takes skill to hit a light at medium to long range with energy or ballistics, even when they are out in the open.

Umm...no.

Quote

Look I'm not saying make lights completely impervious to lrm fire, like they were during closed beta. Just allow them a chance to calculate a proper escape vector to minimize damage. A slight lrm speed nerf would accomplish this.

I know escape routes before i get where i'm going. Just learn the maps.

Roland, on 11 May 2014 - 10:36 AM, said:

Except with direct fire weapons you actually have to aim them.

As opposed to having to aim for a lot longer with LRM's...

[TimePeriod]

MortVent, on 11 May 2014 - 11:30 AM, said:

tsk tsk

You dared me to do it with direct fire weapons.
You then complained that PPCs were not autocannons
You were corrected, and then grumbled that PPCs were energy weapons still

That's the logic behind telling you to learn your weapons. Silly rabbit

I've mostly killed mechs with... LRMs and Streaks. I'm usually in a catapult A1,C1, or C4 though now I pilot Griffins (all three) built around a lrm20 with back up weapons (one with a lrm5 and two medium lasers, one with 2 medium pulse lasers, last one with one medium laser and 2 ssrm2s)

Rarely do I pilot my Jester, K2, or thunderbolts ( along with some trial mechs and the champ models from my overlord package of the mechs I sold off cause I didn't like them)

So I have used the weapons you say I need to use to be able to call you out btw...

And yet in this case you decided to bring up your ERPPC Jester, so pardon me but my case still stands true. You decided to bring a superior set of weapons in a situation where inferior weapons was used and automaticly assume it gave you bragging rights.

And I don't even pilot 'correct' LRM-boats and still earn in 5-600 damage each match.

[MortVent]

TimePeriod, on 11 May 2014 - 11:35 AM, said:

And yet in this case you decided to bring up your ERPPC Jester, so pardon me but my case still stands true. You decided to bring a superior set of weapons in a situation where inferior weapons was used and automaticly assume it gave you bragging rights.

And I don't even pilot 'correct' LRM-boats and still earn in 5-600 damage each match.

Nope, I do lousy in the jester.
with erppcs my to hit ratio is : 16.49% (157 dmg)
with large lasers (which I had in most matches) : 30.84% (513 dmg)
my kdr is : 1 kill... the spider to 12 losses.

So I did it with a weapon system I suck at using in a mech I've barely played.

As for the correct lrm boats... did you score with the direct fire weapons or the missiles... weapon stats matter.

Edited by MortVent, 11 May 2014 - 11:44 AM.

[Roland]

Did you just say that your accuracy rate with erppcs is less than 17%?

[Wolfways]

I decided to take my "almost stock" CPLT-C1 out for a few matches yesterday for a change.

1st match - Frozen City - Enemy used the buildings very well, i was mostly useless.
2nd match - Tourmaline - Enemy had multiple ECM and used cover well. I was mostly useless.
3rd match - Crimson Strait - Enemy used buildings but not as well as the 1st match, but also came after me with three lights that pretty much wrecked my mech before retreating.

IT'S OFFICIAL!!! LRM'S SUCK!

/sarcasm

[MortVent]

Roland, on 11 May 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

Did you just say that your accuracy rate with erppcs is less than 17%?

Yep, but only used them in two matches. Had large lasers there instead for heat management the rest of the games... the K2 and jester are mechs I don't like. Too center torso heavy.

Which was just icing on the cake when I cored the spider... as bad as I am with the weapons...

Edited by MortVent, 11 May 2014 - 11:49 AM.

[Roland]

If your accuracy rate is so incredibly bad, that kind of proves my point regarding how the requirement of actually aiming direct fire weapons makes them less than trivial to use.

[Lucky Noob]

An Match without an Light who cries loud, "that LRM Boat is mine, no one touch it " ?

Damm i soo want to play in your Elo with an Real Missle Boat

[MortVent]

Roland, on 11 May 2014 - 11:50 AM, said:

If your accuracy rate is so incredibly bad, that kind of proves my point regarding how the requirement of actually aiming direct fire weapons makes them less than trivial to use.

nope. When you consider the full weapon chart.



Missiles are far more inaccurate due to weapon spread, vs direct fire weapons. Especially when you mostly pug drop and those locks go bye bye quickly, most of my direct fire shots are against pop tarts or close range vs lights.

I don't usually get to line up shots too often. Hence the large number for the mediums and launchers. Course this is the current list and not the archived, had rl between the changes.

[Roland]

Those numbers are even more ridiculous, with a 22% accuracy with LASERS? I mean, they are hit scan, and you're missing almost 4 out of 5 shots with them.

You suggest direct damage weapons are easy to use, but then you post stats suggesting you are terrible with them.

[TimePeriod]

Roland, on 11 May 2014 - 12:10 PM, said:

Those numbers are even more ridiculous, with a 22% accuracy with LASERS? I mean, they are hit scan, and you're missing almost 4 out of 5 shots with them.

You suggest direct damage weapons are easy to use, but then you post stats suggesting you are terrible with them.

I am not sure how to 'interpret' this spread-sheet...

Is he missing ENTIRELY with lasers? As in the whole beam is off-target? Partial hit?

I don't understand his logic here.

Edited by TimePeriod, 11 May 2014 - 12:14 PM.

[MortVent]

Roland, on 11 May 2014 - 12:10 PM, said:

Those numbers are even more ridiculous, with a 22% accuracy with LASERS? I mean, they are hit scan, and you're missing almost 4 out of 5 shots with them.

You suggest direct damage weapons are easy to use, but then you post stats suggesting you are terrible with them.

If you line up shots and don't take snap shots at circling lights, yes you're accuracy is better. When you are in a missile boat or a slow heavy trying to deal with a fast moving target with torso mounted weapons. It becomes a lot harder to hit them.

Most of my mech battles are in mechs with little to no arm weapons. Or with arms that are ... launchers! I tend to keep most of my ordance in torso slots and use the arms as shields on others. It's a choice... post your stats and lets see them.

TimePeriod, on 11 May 2014 - 12:12 PM, said:

Even I fail to see his logic.

Look at the mechs I use, try to handle a couple lights circle strafing with torso weapons. Or limited arc arms... ask your average jagger pilot which is harder to hit. A target at range or a circle strafing medium/light with those missing arm actuators.

[Lucky Noob]

Showing that hes bad with Lasers didnt say that Lasers arent easy Hit Weapons

[Gyrok]

Captain Stiffy, on 11 May 2014 - 06:13 AM, said:

I got liquid metal in an LRM boat with over 1k damage

That is how I got it, in a LRM battlemaster, with 980 something damage and 5 kills.

[Lykaon]

Aeten, on 11 May 2014 - 05:25 AM, said:

Well I can't say I didn't expect the snarky troll comments that ignore the real problem, but if you are going to open your mouth you should at least reference the idea in the thread.

The fact is with LRMs and no other weapon system, I can sit in base semi-AFK and just accumulate damage like a sponge. How is this FPS-style gameplay? This is arcade.

Things an LRM mech generally doesn't need to worry about:

- Heat (if set up by someone with any semblence of intelligence)
- Damage
- Aiming
- Positioning
- Poptarts / alpha strikes

Yet all other mechs do. It's just dumb the way it's set up.

And it was 3 tons of ammo I'm sorry for the typo. I forgot the space in the head I only counted the 2 tons in my center torso.

No snarkyness or trolling intended but...

Heat: LRMs do generate heat,they are subject to ghost heat.A dedicated LRM carrier does need to keep an eye on heat.Your use of 2 LRM5s hardley qualifies as an exstencive LRM test don't you think?

Damage? do you mean dealing or receiving damage? because both occur.

Aiming: LRMs do require locks so they do require rudimentry aiming.Since by the nature of the weapon system you can not aim precisely at specific target locations this seems like a reasonable trade off.You aim at a mech in general to lock on and damage is dealt to that target in a dispersed general coverage sort of way.

Positioning: This is absolutley mandatory and here is why. LRMs have a max range and a sizeable min range.Unlike the easy mode AC5 that is so very popular that has no min range and has damage dealing capacity out past it's listed max range.LRMs detonate as soon as they have traversed a distance equal to their max range.
You mentioned you stood in a specific possition on the River City map, you should try hitting with LRMs while standing against a building perhaps or maybe facing the aft portion of the ship in the lower city or parked under the wing of the drop ship.
In fact I would go as far as saying correct use of LRMs is all about location location location.

Poptarts/alpha strikes: So in your very limited experience with LRMs where no one apparently attacked you you didn't need to worry about being hit of course means everyone every time will ignore an LRM carrier?

You apparently either had an excellent team that screened your LRM supporting mech so well you were never engaged (superior team work should net excellent results) or your opposition was so lacking in battlefield awareness that they allowed you to deal damage unmolested (they sucked and as a result you should have been successful)

Here are undisputable facts.

LRMs have the slowest projectile speed in the entire game.Thus easiest projectile to evade.

LRMs are the only weapon systems that provides a warning that you have been fired upon BEFORE the weapon hits.

LRMs are the weapon system with the largest min range (180m) this makes LRMs useless against targets under 180m.A highly exploitable weakness given the neccessity of boating LRMs to be a real force on the field.Frequently a dedicated LRM carrier has between 3-4 medium lasers as back up weapons so not exactally a power house in a brawl.

Indirect fire requires a spotters thus 2+ mechs mandatory to indirect fire.A mech under fire from LRMs launched indirectly is opposed by 2+ enemy mechs out numbered mechs in combat frequently lose the fight if they don't withdraw or rapidly even up the numbers (kill the spotter)

Anti Missile Systems exists there are no Anti Ballistic Systems or Anti PPC Systems etc.

ECM!

[TimePeriod]

AC/20 28 1,016 683 67.22% 02:40:47 13,448
CATAPULT CPLT-K2 76 40 36 1.11 92 52 1.77 28,164


It is the closest thing I have to an LRM carrier, since I never pilot something which has such a massive cross-air painted all over it.

Edited by TimePeriod, 11 May 2014 - 12:29 PM.

[Foxfire]

TimePeriod, on 11 May 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:

They are energy weapons

They are still direct fire weapons.

Everything not LRM's are direct fire weapons. LRM's are the only ones that can fire indirect... aka fire and hit targets without having a direct line of sight to the target.

*edits to add* Well, didn't realize that there was another page when I replied to this.. so.. ignore if you'd like, don't if you don't want to.

Edited by Foxfire, 11 May 2014 - 12:30 PM.