325 replies to this topic

[Harathan]

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 08:47 AM, said:

Funnily enough, the Stock Match Craze will soon fade as those same min/max'rs show up and "force" their BEST OF into that sphere of game-play too. 2-3 more weeks should about do it...

Not sure you understand how Stock Matches work, or how Stock mechs work versus only other Stock mechs.

[Name140704]

Ofcourse it is. It's the players' fault. Thank you Niko, Russ, Ekman, and Paul for the reminder. See you on the 29th.

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 08:50 AM, said:

I have never played a stock 'mech night and have no idea what I am talking about. Please put me on ignore.

[Agent of Change]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 May 2014 - 08:53 AM, said:

And who's fault is that? If we the players are so thin skinned that we cannot take a joke, then a man was fired for the truth, and that sir is a shame I will not tolerate.

I asked a Mod, If calling someone a name that is accurate (For instance calling Me arrogant), is still against the rules.

Garth was fun to have around and his departure, if under the auspices of the above, was a real shame. Of course I have my own tinfoil beenie and it wouldn't surprise me if his ouster in the wake of Russ's "I am sorry you are mad but it's your fault for misunderstanding" letter about the 3PV release was part scapegoating as that self same letter tried to pawn off all the lack of communication and "misunderstandings" on Garth.

[Almond Brown]

Harathan, on 27 May 2014 - 08:54 AM, said:

Not sure you understand how Stock Matches work, or how Stock mechs work versus only other Stock mechs.

I understand perfectly. You just have never witnessed a "Stock Meta" before. Oh yes, there is a Stock Meta awaiting everyone out there.

You seem to be under the mistaken impression all Stock Mechs are built the same... LOL!

Just wait until the same filters that get applied to non-Stock super Custom builds (and many Mechs are the suck even under that open system), gets applied to non-changeable Stock Mechs. LOL!

Rude awakenings await you friend. Rude....

Psycho Farmer, on 27 May 2014 - 09:01 AM, said:

Ofcourse it is. It's the players' fault. Thank you Niko, Russ, Ekman, and Paul for the reminder. See you on the 29th.

Ostrich behavior ftw.

Edited by Almond Brown, 27 May 2014 - 09:03 AM.

[Roland]

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 08:50 AM, said:

PGI cannot do that publicly though. Garth was raked over the coals for even making a funny on the Forums that someone invariably took offense to. "How dare they treat their customers like that!"

They don't and can't respond Joe. That is the point. They are in no win situation and the beating never stops.

Star Citizen proves that what you're suggesting here is clearly false.
They have a whole section on their forum dedicated to asking the devs questions... and the devs actually answer them on a regular basis! Amazing!

Their devs also routinely show up in their live chat server, and answer anything you feel like asking them.

You don't catch flak from responding to your players.

You catch flak from responding to them in an unprofessional manner.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Almond Brown and Lockwood. Brothers in arms. It explains so much.

[Joseph Mallan]

Agent of Change, on 27 May 2014 - 09:02 AM, said:

Garth was fun to have around and his departure, if under the auspices of the above, was a real shame. Of course I have my own tinfoil beenie and it wouldn't surprise me if his ouster in the wake of Russ's "I am sorry you are mad but it's your fault for misunderstanding" letter about the 3PV release was part scapegoating as that self same letter tried to pawn off all the lack of communication and "misunderstandings" on Garth.

I had nothing to do with it, and I have no control, do seem to be said far to much (not just here either)!

[Agent of Change]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 27 May 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

Almond Brown and Lockwood. Brothers in arms. It explains so much.

Well at least united by delusion, bound by inaccurate scape-goating and together blinded by self-righteousness anyway.

Edited by Agent of Change, 27 May 2014 - 09:10 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Roland, on 27 May 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

Star Citizen proves that what you're suggesting here is clearly false.
They have a whole section on their forum dedicated to asking the devs questions... and the devs actually answer them on a regular basis! Amazing!

Their devs also routinely show up in their live chat server, and answer anything you feel like asking them.

You don't catch flak from responding to your players.

You catch flak from responding to them in an unprofessional manner.

So an attempt at humor is unprofessional? What profession do you work in...

The Dev respond lots. They just can't tell the DB's to go **** themselves, like they really deserve. What was your point again?

[Joseph Mallan]

Roland, on 27 May 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

Star Citizen proves that what you're suggesting here is clearly false.
They have a whole section on their forum dedicated to asking the devs questions... and the devs actually answer them on a regular basis! Amazing!

Their devs also routinely show up in their live chat server, and answer anything you feel like asking them.

You don't catch flak from responding to your players.

You catch flak from responding to them in an unprofessional manner.

I don't want my DEVs to be "professional". I want em to be honest!

[Agent of Change]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 May 2014 - 09:06 AM, said:

I had nothing to do with it, and I have no control, do seem to be said far to much (not just here either)!

I wasn't implying you did, I was just said if Garth was removed due to thin skins (of which there are many here) it's a shame.

I was also saying that I suspect that internal corporate politics may well have found an effigy to burn in the shape of Garth (deservedly or otherwise, I don't know the details.)

[Almond Brown]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 27 May 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

Almond Brown and Lockwood. Brothers in arms. It explains so much.

Nicholas Carlyle and a valid Point. Never the pair shall meet.

[Odins Fist]

This was ALL that ever needed to be said about this thread, so everyone read it one more time, and let it sink in REAL good.
Spilitting hairs/Semantics, or trying to church it up by arguing positions that have no basis other then opinion doesn't mean a thing, the reality of the situation is the reality of the situation, regardless of the size of the pile of participation trophies anyone has, it won't change the fact.

Odins Fist, on 25 May 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

The player base is not EXPLOITING anything, they are using what the DEVs have put into MWO.
The player base can do NOTHING but use what's given to them. Players will use the best Mechs/Weapons/modules/etc, to play the game and win. If the DEVs didn't want things used in that manner, then they would take carr of that on THEIR end.. You know since the player base doesn't write code or develop MWO, they only spend their money and voice their opions on the forums.

As far as game DESIGN, and DEVELOPMENT, that statement is about as WRONG as any statement could be.

#1. The player base does NOT design or write code.
#2. The player base does NOT make any decision on what content will be implemenetd.
#3. The player base does NOT set pricing or do the marketing.
#4. The player base does NOT set values for weapons balance.
#5. The player base does NOT set deadlines and miss them.
#6. The player base does NOT make ANY decisions on ANY of the development for MWO.

You cannot blame the player base for using what's given them to use by the DEVs.
You cannot blame the player base for ANYTHING other then voicing their opinions, playing the game, FUNDING the game.

The DEVs get to pick and choose what's put into MWO to use, the DEVs get to pick and choose what player opinions to listen to, and what to do about them.

The only thing the player base gets to choose, is how much money they spend, and how to loadout their mechs.

Edited by Odins Fist, 27 May 2014 - 09:15 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Agent of Change, on 27 May 2014 - 09:06 AM, said:

Well at least united by delusion, bound by inaccurate scape-goating and together blinded by self-righteousness anyway.

It is a Game [Redacted]. Nothing more. Perhaps you should look up the definition.

[Joseph Mallan]

Agent of Change, on 27 May 2014 - 09:09 AM, said:

I wasn't implying you did, I was just said if Garth was removed due to thin skins (of which there are many here) it's a shame.

I was also saying that I suspect that internal corporate politics may well have found an effigy to burn in the shape of Garth (deservedly or otherwise, I don't know the details.)

Sorry, I needed to put quotations on those two statements Agent. I did not mean them as if I was saying them just that they are used to often to pass the buck.

[Almond Brown]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 May 2014 - 09:07 AM, said:

I don't want my DEVs to be "professional". I want em to be honest!

They try from where I sit. They even caveat most things to prevent to much crushing disappointment if things get delayed. Sadly no one around here can handle the truth (with a caveat).

[Name140704]

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 09:04 AM, said:

I understand perfectly. You just have never witnessed a "Stock Meta" before. Oh yes, there is a Stock Meta awaiting everyone out there.

You seem to be under the mistaken impression all Stock Mechs are built the same... LOL!

Just wait until the same filters that get applied to non-Stock super Custom builds (and many Mechs are the suck even under that open system), gets applied to non-changeable Stock Mechs. LOL!

Rude awakenings await you friend. Rude....



Ostrich behavior ftw.

I really have no idea how you expect a response that isn't a flame from that wall of garbage. You're just pulling stuff out of your behind to try to incite me in to continuing this pointless "discussion". No, thank you. Please go **** yourself and get a ******* clue as to what you are talking about.

Ignored, good riddance

[Roland]

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 09:07 AM, said:

So an attempt at humor is unprofessional? What profession do you work in...

Amusingly, I work in the software development industry. I've developed software professionally, and led large software development efforts for around 15 years now.

Humor is not inherently unprofessional, but in certain cases it most certainly is. You don't want to make jokes about things which you know are already a sore point for your players. Such things can be worse than saying nothing (which is itself generally bad) because it gives the impression that you not only fail to understand the issues your customers are bringing up, but that you are actually trivializing them. It puts you into an antagonistic relationship with your customers, which is something you NEVER want to do.

Quote

The Dev respond lots. They just can't tell the DB's to go **** themselves, like they really deserve. What was your point again?

No, the developers at PGI very rarely interact with their customers. Some interact more than others, but folks like Paul basically never discuss anything with the players.

Again, if you want to see how it can be done properly, you need only look as far as Star Citizen.

That community is certainly by no means 100% behind everything done by CIG. There's tons of criticism all the time... But they interact with their playerbase in a consistent manner. They respect their players, and as a result, their players tend to respect them.

Joseph Mallan, on 27 May 2014 - 09:07 AM, said:

I don't want my DEVs to be "professional". I want em to be honest!

Honesty and professionalism are not mutually exclusive. In most cases, they are complementary. Professionals are honest.

[Lightfoot]

This is like the old complaint telling players not to leg other mechs because it is dishonorable. There are an awful lot of legged mechs everyday though, is that the Meta?

I think the Meta is whatever someone doesn't like and all the weapons are actually roughly balanced within MWO's GunWarrior version of Battletech. So if you want to escape the real Meta MWO creates, don't use any Ballistic weapon because MWO favors them like the good-gun fairy.

But let's focus on what the "Meta" seems to mean, which is usually, "playing the game in a way I don't like or want to use." Isn't that it? I don't see everyone with Jump Jets, I don't see everyone with ACs and PPCs or LRMs, I don't see everyone with Victors or Jagermechs, but these are all "the Meta".

This is bunk really, players are free to do as they please within the normal parameters of the game, not as what someone says is honorable. I don't see any meta in the game I just see good players of the game. That's the reality and only the Devs can change that.

QFT, "You legged me, you cheater!" Reply, "You have no Leg."

[Agent of Change]

Almond Brown, on 27 May 2014 - 09:11 AM, said:

It is a Game dummy. Nothing more. Perhaps you should look up the definition.

*Ahem*

It's a game, yes. nothign more, yes. one of us is spending an awful lot of time and energy try to convince the players of said game of a patent falacy that fits an incredibly narrow viewpoint and the other has spent very little time pointing out how very very very silly that first one is.

yup, I feel good about my trivial participation in this. If you'd like more evidence of how much more time you have spent on this even though it's "just a game" count your posts in this thread vs mine. I think you'll find despite the facts you discover you'll have yet another justification but it's okay. Despite your mental gymnastics I know you are wrong and deep down you know you are wrong so i can live with your squawking and flapping. It's great entertainment at least.

Edited by Agent of Change, 27 May 2014 - 09:20 AM.