Clan And Is Weapon Update - Feedback
#321
Posted 09 June 2014 - 01:52 PM
#322
Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:11 PM
Mcgral18, on 08 June 2014 - 01:33 PM, said:
Nope, but I imagine overwhelming firepower will beat precise firepwer, when it gets close.
We will see. The WubShee certainly beats meta when it gets close, and my proposed Nova is actually more powerful than it, along with a low heat alternative.
But a team of meta will probably win. Hence why teamwork is OP.
Wait, so...the Clan's indiscriminate brute force will beat out the Inner Sphere's precision weaponry....
GaiDaigoji, on 08 June 2014 - 04:04 PM, said:
*ahem*http://www.sarna.net...lan_Ghost_Bear)
PhoenixFire55, on 09 June 2014 - 03:59 AM, said:
Everything my dear boy/girl has its price. The fact that you were freely given a mech that would have cost 25m c-bills for somebody that isn't part of your society, doesn't negate this. The price was paid in other forms, such as the labour of workers who mined the metals, or scientists who designed the mech, or engineers who build it. Your society has paid the price for you. Without this society you are nothing. Do you have such a society in MWO where somebody gives you mechs and equipment for free? I might look ... to you, but you in turn are simply nothing.
You do not seem to have much of a grasp on Clan society. The trueborn MechWarrior is the elite of the elite, superior to anyone else in the Clan. It is only right that we are given free stuff, quiaff?
#323
Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:21 PM
If a single gauss rifle is too weak, that's a separate problem that should be dealt with separately. Two is too ganktastic. Even if dual gauss mechs aren't topping the charts and winning all the matches, what they do detracts from the fun of the game.
#324
Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:41 PM
Trauglodyte, on 09 June 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:
If it's true, then great.
But somehow I'm left with doubt.
#325
Posted 09 June 2014 - 02:46 PM
What happens if you hit a side torso with a cERPPC when its attached arm is gone? Does the splash damage to the arm reflect back onto the side torso, cut in half? (and same for every other case of destroyed components taking splash damage)
Edited by Scratx, 09 June 2014 - 02:47 PM.
#326
Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:08 PM
Or you can be ******** and worry about balancing 12 clan vs 12 IS and forget the lore and encourage people to ***** about the changing meta of 12 v 12. MAKE A NEW META NOOBS OMG !!!!
Im worried about anyone at PGI having a pulse.. geez
Edited by Herpa Derpa, 09 June 2014 - 03:10 PM.
#327
Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:27 PM
JohnnyWayne, on 09 June 2014 - 01:44 PM, said:
LBX slug mode fires one projectile.
They don't work that way. Clan LBX in slug mode fires in bursts, not a single projectile.
The difference between CLBX in slug mode and the actual CUAC is that the CUAC can be double-tapped to increase rate of fire.
#329
Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:38 PM
Cimarb, on 09 June 2014 - 03:27 PM, said:
The difference between CLBX in slug mode and the actual CUAC is that the CUAC can be double-tapped to increase rate of fire.
Well I heard differently. Thats also the reason why we get clan auto canons and not lbx only.
If they do it differently then they have destoryed the only argument that could balance clan mechs compared to IS.
Then they totally wrecked them.
Edited by JohnnyWayne, 09 June 2014 - 03:40 PM.
#330
Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:41 PM
JohnnyWayne, on 09 June 2014 - 03:38 PM, said:
Well I heard differently. Thats also the reason why we get clan auto canons and not lbx only.
You may want to actually read the Command Chair post you are responding to. Unlike previous PGI communications, it is actually pretty clear on this subject:
Paul Inouye, on 07 June 2014 - 08:31 PM, said:
As mentioned in the last Dev Vlog, we ran into an issue with the ability to swap ammunition types on the fly while playing the game. This has not changed. For the time being, we have created a one off weapon type that has the exact same characteristics as the LB-X in terms of weight and space requirements but fire slugs with the same characteristics of the Clan Ultra AutoCannon counterparts. For example, the Clan LB 2-X will fire a cluster round totalling 2 damage. The Clan AutoCannon/2 will fire a 2 round volley with each slug doing 1 damage for a total of 2 damage.
Edited by Cimarb, 09 June 2014 - 03:42 PM.
#331
Posted 09 June 2014 - 03:43 PM
#333
Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:41 PM
JohnnyWayne, on 09 June 2014 - 03:43 PM, said:
Feel free to go somewhere else at any time. The unrelenting negativism (and cussing) is tiring, especially when you haven't even played Clans yet...
#334
Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:51 PM
Paul Inouye, on 07 June 2014 - 08:31 PM, said:
The Clan LBX Cluster vs Slug Ammunition Selection
As mentioned in the last Dev Vlog, we ran into an issue with the ability to swap ammunition types on the fly while playing the game. This has not changed. For the time being, we have created a one off weapon type that has the exact same characteristics as the LB-X in terms of weight and space requirements but fire slugs with the same characteristics of the Clan Ultra AutoCannon counterparts. For example, the Clan LB 2-X will fire a cluster round totalling 2 damage. The Clan AutoCannon/2 will fire a 2 round volley with each slug doing 1 damage for a total of 2 damage. Players will have to make the choice as to which weapon to equip to their Clan 'Mechs according to the firing style they wish to use. The space and weight of the Clan AutoCannon/2 is the same as the Clan LB 2-X. The range, firing mechanics, damage, etc. are the same as the Clan Ultra AutoCannon/2 (minus the double tap ability). These "Clan AutoCannon/#" weapons will remain in the game until such time that we can get the ammunition switching working.
I'm sorry, no, this is unacceptable.
The whole point of having ammo-switching in LB-X ACs is to allow us to choose between cluster and SLUG fire, NOT between cluster and stream-fired. There is absolutely zero point in including the made-up, stop-gap "Clan AC" unless it fires a single, pinpoint-damage slug.
There is an alternative. If you're going to make Clan non-Ultra ACs fire in stream fire, then you need to convert the IS ACs to stream-fire weapons, like they should have been lore-wise from the start, anyway.
The level of fail here is absolutely mind-boggling.
#335
Posted 09 June 2014 - 04:58 PM
Sable Phoenix, on 09 June 2014 - 04:51 PM, said:
I'm sorry, no, this is unacceptable.
The whole point of having ammo-switching in LB-X ACs is to allow us to choose between cluster and SLUG fire, NOT between cluster and stream-fired. There is absolutely zero point in including the made-up, stop-gap "Clan AC" unless it fires a single, pinpoint-damage slug.
There is an alternative. If you're going to make Clan non-Ultra ACs fire in stream fire, then you need to convert the IS ACs to stream-fire weapons, like they should have been lore-wise from the start, anyway.
The level of fail here is absolutely mind-boggling.
The key to understand is... "For the time being".
They're going to fix that. And I think you should expect IS ACs to get the clan treatment sooner or later, too.
#336
Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:09 PM
Raigner, on 08 June 2014 - 10:02 PM, said:
Pretty much all of this.
Scratx, on 09 June 2014 - 04:58 PM, said:
The key to understand is... "For the time being".
They're going to fix that. And I think you should expect IS ACs to get the clan treatment sooner or later, too.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure I recall them specifically saying they will not be doing that. The IS ACs are and will remain pinpoint slug-throwers, in spite of the lore inaccuracy and the inherent balancing it would lend to the game (just try to pop-tart that AC-5 when it's firing 3 slug bursts).
This decision is purely meant to "balance" the Clans against the Inner Sphere, rather than worrying about the balance of the game as a whole.
Edited by Sable Phoenix, 09 June 2014 - 05:12 PM.
#337
Posted 09 June 2014 - 05:21 PM
I am committed to my clan package so we will just have to play and see.
But I must say that my enthusiasm has been dampened. That hurts.
#338
Posted 09 June 2014 - 07:10 PM
Scratx, on 09 June 2014 - 06:37 AM, said:
Yup. Even if demanding a refund because you're not getting the OP Masters of the Universe you wanted isn't cool.
(and am I the only one who thinks a lot of the discussion is almost at the level of horoscopes because we simply don't know how it'll all play out? it's not like weapons alone dictate balance, can't ignore we don't know the exact hardpoint combos we'll be able to pull out and more importantly just how much more survivable clan mechs will be thanks to no death on losing a single side torso...)
[Redacted] Had you played in competitive leagues (or perhaps you do, but have no idea what you are doing or what works) you should have picked up some idea of what works and what does not. Pinpoint damage is greatly superior to spread damage, the best plan is to quickly take down opposing mechs. You can choose to spread your 30 points of damage around or you can do them to one location - which do you think would work better?
Nevermind - you have already shown you cannot figure that one out - here is the answer: pinpoint damage is always preferred. The fact that clan weapons always do spread damage is fine as long as the freebirth weapons on the other side work the same way, but alas they don't. So my 70 ton Cataphract 3D will do 30 points of pinpoint damage (2xPPC's and 2xAC-5's) while my 70 ton Summoner cannot. Maybe that sounds like balance to you - but to people with enough brain power to actually walk and breathe at the same time it appears quite unbalanced....
#339
Posted 09 June 2014 - 07:26 PM
Fastwind, on 09 June 2014 - 04:35 PM, said:
Both burst fire (thats not pinpoint accurate),and far heavier.
Still no viable alternative to a IS PPC!
Or even UAC/5's, actually.
We'll see what we see on IS designs. Poptart, PPC, AC. Or perhaps Gauss. Which is the point. Parity. The same song on different instruments, perhaps- but the same song none the less. If the Clan AC's only fire two-round bursts, a UAC/10 is a bit more spread than a twin IS AC/5, and the lower tonnage and space requirements should neatly compensate for the hotter ER PPC, which is 1 ton and one crit less for roughly 50% more heat and a touch of spread damage that'll still tenderize the CT if you near-miss a bit. UAC/10's match IS AC/5's for range profile, so they'll have similar firing to IS poptarts. They're 10 tons each.
#340
Posted 09 June 2014 - 07:28 PM
Moenrg, on 09 June 2014 - 07:10 PM, said:
No, you are just an unimaginative dolt. Had you played in competitive leagues (or perhaps you do, but have no idea what you are doing or what works) you should have picked up some idea of what works and what does not. Pinpoint damage is greatly superior to spread damage, the best plan is to quickly take down opposing mechs. You can choose to spread your 30 points of damage around or you can do them to one location - which do you think would work better?
Nevermind - you have already shown you cannot figure that one out - here is the answer: pinpoint damage is always preferred. The fact that clan weapons always do spread damage is fine as long as the freebirth weapons on the other side work the same way, but alas they don't. So my 70 ton Cataphract 3D will do 30 points of pinpoint damage (2xPPC's and 2xAC-5's) while my 70 ton Summoner cannot. Maybe that sounds like balance to you - but to people with enough brain power to actually walk and breathe at the same time it appears quite unbalanced....
Correction, pinpoint FLD is better to a point. I know for a fact if the WubShee closes, your PP FLD will never win, because A, I have 25 tons on the CTF along with all the armor that comes with that, and B, you lose 20 PP FLD when I close to 90M. The 95 tonner can fire 52 damage at your 10, and you'll be cored within 10 seconds. Of course, I have to close first.
As for the Thor...That B variant can mount 5 SSRM6s...AKA, 75 damage. 250% of your alpha at 360M. Along with some extra armor, although I'm not sure 5 tons of ammo would be enough...but 1250 damage should suffice for most matches. But I guess that's only two atlai.
There is a point spread damage will overwhelm pinpoint damage. For less random results, you can also go the laser route...and honestly the stock D loadout isn't half bad. 2 ERLL, 2 ERML, 2 MG and an AMS. Remove AMS, CTC add armor and another heatsink or two. But the 34 damage won't overwhelm your CTF until it closes...which is risky.
I'm going to say if we can max armor, the Thor's will actually be half decent...or at least not terrible. SRM18, 2 ERLL, 21 DHS and 3 tons of ammo fit fine, remove 2 DHS and max the armor, you'd still be fine. With a 56 point alpha strike. At the 50 threshold, it doesn't matter if it's spread or not, two of those can remove a leg. Good luck spreading damage after that.
Edited by Mcgral18, 09 June 2014 - 07:35 PM.
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