61 replies to this topic

[Calamus]

If you want to talk about forcing a mech to be useless. The PRIME variant that I PAID MONEY FOR has a FIXED Flamer in the CT.

Why on earth would a mech be built that I could not remove an energy weapon? And why on earth would you set it as the Prime variant that people are paying real money for.

I like running it. I think it looks cool, and it's fun. But clan mechs are supposed to be versatile, and you're seriously limiting its versatility by forcing it to carry a single flamer... Not impressed.

[101011]

sarna said:

The Adder has a Flamer in a fixed mount which cannot be removed from the 'Mech.

Edited by 101011, 18 June 2014 - 07:57 AM.

[General Taskeen]

Because this: http://bte.battletec...te/pdf/4878.pdf

Its just too bad they have been unable to make the Flamer as good as it is in MW3 an MW4 for 2 years.

[DONTOR]

Flamer? Thats a lighter for your Cigars.

[Jeb]

http://www.sarna.net...dder_%28Puma%29
"The Adder has a flamer in a fixed mount which cannot be removed from the 'Mech"

That would be my guess...


edit - wow we all pounced on that one lol...

Edited by Jeb, 18 June 2014 - 08:00 AM.

[Koniks]

Because it's hardwired to the Base chassis like the Summoner or Nova jump jets.

[divinedisclaimer]

Calamus, on 18 June 2014 - 07:56 AM, said:

If you want to talk about forcing a mech to be useless. The PRIME variant that I PAID MONEY FOR has a FIXED Flamer in the CT.

Why on earth would a mech be built that I could not remove an energy weapon? And why on earth would you set it as the Prime variant that people are paying real money for.

I like running it. I think it looks cool, and it's fun. But clan mechs are supposed to be versatile, and you're seriously limiting its versatility by forcing it to carry a single flamer... Not impressed.

Because Battletech fans are so offended at any slight changes in a spin-off to their fiction that PGI feels compelled to align the game as closely as possible to a 20-year-old board game.

Use it on lights that get into point-blank range to blind them. I recommend setting up a toggle switch somehow.

Edited by divinedisclaimer, 18 June 2014 - 08:13 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

divinedisclaimer, on 18 June 2014 - 08:11 AM, said:

Because Battletech fans are so offended at any slight changes in a spin-off to their fiction that PGI feels compelled to align the game as closely as possible to a 20-year-old board game.

Use it on lights that get into point-blank range to blind them. I recommend setting up a toggle switch somehow.

Why play a Battletech/Mechwarrior game if it doesn't stay within the general confines of the original concepts? Might as well play Hawken....seriously...go away and play Hawken. Derp.

[Gigastrike]

PGI made players aware of this.

[Zerberus]

1. It`s always been that way.
2. The chance of this information not being public before you purchased your pack is extremely low, a timeframe of about a week

But sure, try the BS "WAAAH, you never told me that!!" approach... after all crying children always garner sympathy, right? *facepalm*

Edited by Zerberus, 18 June 2014 - 08:20 AM.

[Scratx]

Everybody who bothered to check Sarna (and lots of posts have mentioned it even then) knew the Adder comes with a fixed flamer.

It's half a ton, nothing to get hot and bothered about.

[Koniving]

Calamus, on 18 June 2014 - 07:56 AM, said:

If you want to talk about forcing a mech to be useless. The PRIME variant that I PAID MONEY FOR has a FIXED Flamer in the CT.

Why on earth would a mech be built that I could not remove an energy weapon? And why on earth would you set it as the Prime variant that people are paying real money for.

I like running it. I think it looks cool, and it's fun. But clan mechs are supposed to be versatile, and you're seriously limiting its versatility by forcing it to carry a single flamer... Not impressed.

Because in lore, the Flamer is as effective of a weapon as a machine gun and an AC/2.
It's specifically meant for the infantry and battle armor that's trying to jump on you to kill you.

Here, well, meh.

But it's definitely reason for flamers to be rebalanced into something useful.

[Shalune]

If it's any comfort you get exactly as much free tonnage to use in Adder builds as Nova, a mech 15 tons heavier.

[Koniving]

Scratx, on 18 June 2014 - 08:25 AM, said:

It's half a ton, nothing to get hot and bothered about.

But flamers are hot and bothering!

[Mechwarrior413183]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 18 June 2014 - 08:14 AM, said:

Why play a Battletech/Mechwarrior game if it doesn't stay within the general confines of the original concepts? Might as well play Hawken....seriously...go away and play Hawken. Derp.

You should shave that neckbeard.

[Thermal Scorpion]

"Why on earth would a mech be built that I could not remove an energy weapon? And why on earth would you set it as the Prime variant that people are paying real money for."

Easy Answer: Because of lore which creates the world's flavor and to add a balance element. Everyone wants to create the perfect mech with maximum benefit and 0 waste. I understand the desire to do this but I can't see how a single flamer is going to scuttle a build entirely.

Your statement seems to demand a real world answer though. Here it is, because military hardware is purpose built. Not necessarily by the soldiers but by people who think soldiers need something. Mechs are also purpose built in the lore. I'm sure if you ask a few military folks there is more than one that would say they had issues with a weapons system they used. While some poor choices are corrected in later versions of real world weapons systems not everything is. I just consider this an additional quirk of the mech like the yaw and pitch rates for the various mech variants.

You may not agree with why this was included from a game perspective, and you are totally entitled to disagree, but that doesn't mean that the devs' decision is off-base.

[Ngamok]

Calamus, on 18 June 2014 - 07:56 AM, said:

If you want to talk about forcing a mech to be useless. The PRIME variant that I PAID MONEY FOR has a FIXED Flamer in the CT.

Why on earth would a mech be built that I could not remove an energy weapon? And why on earth would you set it as the Prime variant that people are paying real money for.

I like running it. I think it looks cool, and it's fun. But clan mechs are supposed to be versatile, and you're seriously limiting its versatility by forcing it to carry a single flamer... Not impressed.

So if it was on the other variants that you also paid money for, would you be good?

[FupDup]

Because the engineers who designed it were dipshits. That's really the most accurate way to put it.

Flamers were semi-functional in the BT but they were still garbage anyways -- the engineers weren't good enough at SSW min-maxing to realize this. If they truly knew what they were doing, they would have made it an ER Small Laser for more range and damage.

[Nyte Kitsune]

The fixed Flamer is a "Carry Over" from CBT. In the original TT rules the Adder (Puma) had a fixed Flamer. Primarily because in CBT/TT Flamers were used to create cover by setting trees on fire to generate smoke.

[Ultimax]

Because the devs randomly cherry pick bad design ideas (in the video game, when they made sense on table top) from table top "lore" to appease fans of the franchise, even when those designs are awful and have low practical use in a different medium.

Those same devs also find all kinds of places to completely ignore "lore".


Unfortunately in many long-lived IPs, not just BattleTech, you have a lot of people who become dogmatic to the point of absurdity when it comes to random bits of fluff regardless if that fluff actually makes for fun, engaging gameplay.


I've always preferred finding the optimal compromise, keep to the spirit of the universe/lore, maintain the integrity of the IP, but don't let that stand in the way of good gameplay/mechanics for the medium the game works under.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 18 June 2014 - 08:53 AM.