91 replies to this topic

[Koniks]

Dennis Ward, on 20 June 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

I've been using this build fairly effectively. The UAC5s carry the build for me, I find them to be just too good to pass up. but never forget about the effectiveness of lasers.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e0121ef44ea6107

Also with AMS and ERsml instead. More heat effecient and surviable.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...8e2d7296aaf7249

So far, the 70 ton Firestarter has been doing the trick. I merged the 2 builds. 2xUAC5, 2xERML, 2xERSL, no AMS.

I think the TBR is still clearly the superior mech, but the gap isn't as wide as it's made out. The Summoner's agility and hit boxes go a long way towards that.

[Dennis Ward]

Mizeur, on 20 June 2014 - 10:01 PM, said:

So far, the 70 ton Firestarter has been doing the trick. I merged the 2 builds. 2xUAC5, 2xERML, 2xERSL, no AMS.

I think the TBR is still clearly the superior mech, but the gap isn't as wide as it's made out. The Summoner's agility and hit boxes go a long way towards that.

What did you do with the extra tonnage? Fortify armor? I've been getting 300+ damage per game with the the 4x ERSl and UAC5s. Glad to hear other people have been doing well with it as well. The mobility of the Summoner is pretty nice.

[Moomtazz]

Before clan release I saw this Thunderbolt build that was billed as the "IS Summoner" http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e851388968ff312

PPC/LBX10/LRM15

I used it for awhile and it performed very well. The funny thing is you can't fit this build on the real Summoner!

[Koniks]

Dennis Ward, on 21 June 2014 - 02:09 AM, said:

What did you do with the extra tonnage? Fortify armor? I've been getting 300+ damage per game with the the 4x ERSl and UAC5s. Glad to hear other people have been doing well with it as well. The mobility of the Summoner is pretty nice.

Full armor, except for the legs and head. 4.5 tons of ammo.

Edited by Mizeur, 21 June 2014 - 12:02 PM.

[C A R N A G E]

I'm doing well with 2 lbx5s and 4 er mediums on prime,just gotta swap around a few parts.:-)
I've had quite a few 500 plus damage games and a 1051 best for me.I'm totally having a blast with it.

[Lucian Nostra]

SMN-D

Been far and away my favorite Summoner build. Put the actuator onto the left arm for some mobility, pop-tarts and brawls decently as well.

[Koniks]

Samziel, on 18 June 2014 - 10:48 PM, said:

SRMMONER PRIME

Probably the best thing to try after the SRM fixes.

You can boost your DPS, reduce your left torso's profile, and get bonus rewards by adding a NARC +1/2 ton of ammo in place of the 5th SRM6+A.

I also like 1xLPL, 1xERML, 2xSRM6+A, NARC.

Edited by Mizeur, 22 June 2014 - 09:51 AM.

[gbalanced]

Have any of you tried running 3 ER PPC's? You've got room for near max armor and 3 extra heat sinks. It's actually really good, from my experience. Even on Terra Therma you can alpha and not overheat.

Another variant for light mech defense is 5 Streak SRM6's plus Beagle Active Probe. You have room for 5 tons of ammo. It's ridiculously good against lights and fairly effective on mediums/heavies. Great for clean up!

Edited by gbalanced, 22 June 2014 - 10:56 AM.

[1453 R]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d061d52f7bb72d3

A variant I’m interested in trying out on the 2^nd. The Summoner is one of very few Clan ‘Mechs that actually has room for the biggest-azz of bigazz targeting computers, and anyone who has eyes in their face and a brain in their skull can tell that the targeting computer is purpose-built to bust PPCs wide open. Run near-max armor on the Summoner, sling two C-ERPPC alongside a Mk. VII TC and a Beagle Active Probe, then load out with Adv. Sensor Range, TIG, and Radar Dep modules. Gain nearly 1300 sensor range, the closest thing to instant paperdoll information you’ll ever see (more important than ever against OmniMechs!), extra zoom range to help your long distance shots (assuming that gets fixed before the 2^nd), and of course huge bonuses to projectile speed and critical hit chance, plus short-range ECM penetration.

The potential of this as a scout-sniping team spotter interests me greatly – and for once it’s something the Timber Wolf can’t copy, since the Timber Wolf only has enough space for a Mk. VI TC at most. That’s…not much of a disadvantage, but by Gum it still is one!

[Turboferret]

1453 R, on 26 June 2014 - 10:50 AM, said:

The potential of this as a scout-sniping team spotter interests me greatly – and for once it’s something the Timber Wolf can’t copy, since the Timber Wolf only has enough space for a Mk. VI TC at most. That’s…not much of a disadvantage, but by Gum it still is one!

Why can't the TW mount a TC7? Seems fine to me.

[1453 R]

Azrael1911, on 26 June 2014 - 10:54 AM, said:

Why can't the TW mount a TC7? Seems fine to me.

...damn. Just double-checked, and you're right. I'd investigated scout-sniping Timber Wolves in a similar vein before, but had thought for sure they could only go up to a Mk. VI.

Whelp, there goes that notion. Poor Summoner's back to being the derpy cousin again. Damnit.

[Turboferret]

1453 R, on 26 June 2014 - 10:56 AM, said:

...damn. Just double-checked, and you're right. I'd investigated scout-sniping Timber Wolves in a similar vein before, but had thought for sure they could only go up to a Mk. VI.

Whelp, there goes that notion. Poor Summoner's back to being the derpy cousin again. Damnit.

I mean, it's not like you can't just stuff it in the arm anyway if there isn't enough torso slots.

You're not really planning on getting hit much with such a long range mech anyway, right?

[1453 R]

Azrael1911, on 26 June 2014 - 10:58 AM, said:

I mean, it's not like you can't just stuff it in the arm anyway if there isn't enough torso slots.

You're not really planning on getting hit much with such a long range mech anyway, right?

Best-laid plans of mice and men and all that. Just because you can see/R-key/hit them from 1300 meters out doesn’t mean you won’t find yourself in a 60m death duel at some point. Probably a lot of points

Also I categorically refuse on general principles to mount a TC in a ‘Mech’s arms. There are some things you just shouldn’t be able to do, and that is one of them. Only possible reasonable exception is a smaller (Mk. III or less) TC directly attached to the only direct-fire weapon a ‘Mech’s got can reasonably go in the same arm as that weapon, but doing the typical Timber Wolf thing and hanging a Mk. VII off one arm and both PPCs off the other? Blasphemy. Blasphemy and poppycock, my good man. Find room for it in the main body where it damn well belongs.

Also Mk. II: stop mounting all your jump jets in one side torso. Unless you want to rename them Cartwheel Jets and use them for a highly interesting evade dash instead of upward movement.

Edited by 1453 R, 26 June 2014 - 11:03 AM.

[Turboferret]

1453 R, on 26 June 2014 - 11:03 AM, said:

Also Mk. II: stop mounting all your jump jets in one side torso. Unless you want to rename them Cartwheel Jets and use them for a highly interesting evade dash instead of upward movement.

Why isn't that a thing? I would also love jets mounted in legs and jets mounted in torsos to behave differently.

Also, honestly, each hardpoint should have a "max size" restriction for what can be mounted in it, you can "break" the restriction, but then your weapon starts firing in burst the more you go over. (Ie. if you mount an AC20 on a point made for an AC10 it fires 2 round burst, if you mount an AC20 on a mount meant for a MG, it behaves almost like an LB20X).

[NRP]

Is the Summoner really maligned? I see quite a lot of them in game, granted not nearly as many as Timber Wolves though. People seem to do pretty good in them too. Looks like they're pretty heat efficient.

Is the Summoner truly crap, or is it just a case of "it's not a Timber Wolf"? How does it stack up against IS heavies?

Edited by NRP, 26 June 2014 - 11:16 AM.

[101011]

Well, for those who absolutely love min-maxing the hell out of builds, the Summoner actually makes a very nice 70 ton DS. SMN-PRIME
For those who enjoy non-cheese builds, this is what I run. SMN-PRIME

[1453 R]

NRP, on 26 June 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

Is the Summoner really maligned? I see quite a lot of them in game, granted not nearly as many as Timber Wolves though. People seem to do pretty good in them too. Looks like they're pretty heat efficient.

Is the Summoner truly crap, or is it just a case of "it's not a Timber Wolf"? How does it stack up against IS heavies?

Mostly? It’s not a Timber Wolf.

The Timber Wolf does everything the Summoner does, but it also does everything the Cataphract*, Orion, Catapult, and Thunderbolt do, just off the top of my head. It can’t quite pull off the superfocused ballistics build of the JagerMook and it can’t hit the same top groundspeeds as the Dragon or Quicklegged, but pretty much every other heavy in the game, short a slow, overgunned Cataphract (i.e. all Cataphracts everywhere except the good ones) is out of a job.

The Summoner’s not terrible by any stretch of the imagination, it’s just not special for the most part. It’s got less hardpoints than it needs and is undergunned for its weight bracket due to pod space restrictions, but it’s quick, it’s got good hitboxes, it can’t not have great mobility because of the fixed jets, and if you’re creative with what few hardpoints you do have it works just fine. A lot of people call it the Clan Thunderbolt – as a pilot whose TDR-5S(P) is one of his best and most consistent ‘Mechs, I’n honestly inclined to agree.

EDIT: Amendment - the Timber Wolf faces strong competition from the Orion as a pure, slug-it-out brawler, and as previously mentioned the Cataphract outdoes it for heavy gunboat builds. Most anything the Summoner does, however, the Timber Wolf can do with more armor and significantly more weaponry. Poor Summoner.

Edited by 1453 R, 26 June 2014 - 11:35 AM.

[Mirenheart]

Something important to note about the Summoner is that the prime's body parts give a host of nice bonuses. The Prime left arm gives a -10% cooldown time for balistics, the Prime right arm gives a -10% cooldown to Energy, and the Prime right and left torso's give +5 degrees of twist each.

Taking the Prime right arm, I made this: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ade6e9820c3b52d

It's not the most weapon heavy of builds, but It gets some good use out of that reduced cooldown.

[Pygar]

NRP, on 26 June 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

....or is it just a case of "it's not a Timber Wolf"?

Pretty much this. All the people who keep saying this are going to be the ones who flip out the hardest and threaten to rage quit the most when the T-wolf gets nerfed too. (Oh it's going to happen, both the nerf and the rage- it's a simple matter of karma at this point.)

Edited by Pygar, 26 June 2014 - 12:24 PM.

[1453 R]

Pygar, on 26 June 2014 - 12:02 PM, said:

Pretty much this. All the people who keep saying this are going to be the ones who flip out the hardest and threaten to rage quit the most when the T-wolf gets nerfed too.

*Sigh*

A lot of folks wouldn't really mind too much if the Timber Wolf got knocked down a peg or two. Unfortunately Pygar, and this is what you missed in the Victor thread as well, Piranha doesn't do 'a peg or two'. It does "EHRMAHGERHD, WE DUN SCREWED UP. INOUYE, GO GIT THE SHOTGUN, WE GOT STUFF WHAT NEEDS KILLIN'."

The Timber Wolf could probably stand some adjustments. it does not need to get completely ruined the way the Victor and Highlander were, quineg?