104 replies to this topic

[Mr David]

I enjoy playing the Summoner very much in it's current state, but thats due to play style. It's really fun! The challenge of designing effective loadouts with such limitations is engaging. It challenges my conventional play styles and makes for a great learning opportunity. In some sense it is similar to the Orions that I love dearly. Effective, but underappreciated and totally overshadowed by its more min/maxable sibling. Since tonnage and hardpoints are not going to change, Endo will not be allowed, and JJ changes probably won't be as effective as hoped and may even further hinder the Summoner, I would love to see some Griffin level agility thrown in to make an even more fun ride, even if still far underpowered compared to a Twolf. That would give players some motivation to use the Summoner since the Twolf is currently just as fast and agile while carrying more armor and more firepower. Interesting discussion.

[mogs01gt]

Using the 3d as a comparable mech(almost). Endo would frees up 3.5t, with the smn-d variant but the LT being Prime, you could effectively equipe an ac10, lrm20 and 3mls. Obviously tweak it to what you want, I simply selected the heaviest that would fit but that is a decent increase of available firepower.

Edited by mogs01gt, 02 July 2014 - 06:41 AM.

[Ursh]

Bobby Blast, on 02 July 2014 - 05:36 AM, said:

Because of these issues with clan mechs I have avoided 3 in particular because of blatant flaws in design.

Adder- The Kitfox is superior in every way. The adder literally brings nothing to the table.

Summoner- Terrible Hardpoints, I'll play my elited Griffin, thanks.

Direwolf- CT hitbox makes this "terror" a free kill to any mech who can escape it's 30° firing arc.

For all the whines 3 of the 8 clan chassis are practically a no brainer to stay away from playing.

That's why I avoided all the packages and just bought a StormCrow. Been playing the game off and on for 20 months now. I have the patience and the cbill stack to wait for the good chassis to come out for cbills, and maybe get a hero clan mech if one tickles my fancy.

Just like some of the Inner Sphere mechs are blatantly inferior to mechs of similar weight, there are going to be some clan mechs that suffer from that as well. My real money and spacecash spending strategy is going to work out to my satisfaction I think. Not trying to be smug, people made their decisions and many seem happy with them. I made mine and I'm happy with it.

[LastPaladin]

Mechs are more than just stats though. For example, the 1N is a pretty poor mech because your main weaponry will usually be removed in seconds upon meeting the enemy, since everyone knows to just shoot the right arm. So, in practice, I think the Summoner would beat out a 1N. Now, if you compared it to the 3M, that would be a different story entirely.

[Roadkill]

Cathy, on 02 July 2014 - 06:02 AM, said:

So its like the light cruisers in avalon hills federation space game, about the only one the Klingons fleets ships were superior to all the rest ton for ton were superior and the best the klingons could hope for was a draw.

Do you mean Federation Space from Task Force Games, or Federation & Empire from Amarillo Design Bureau? I don't recall an Avalon Hill game, but it's been ages since I've played SFB or F&E.

The Klingon D5 was an excellent war cruiser, but it wasn't the only Klingon ship that was good. The C7 Battlecruiser, C8/C9 Dreadnought, and B10 Battleship are all fearsome, and the F5 Frigate is very capable. It's really only their cruisers, the D6 in particular, that are lacking.

[Gryphon187]

Since reading your topic, I have been seeking out Summoners and fighting them. In all cases, and with various versions of the Griffin, I have lost (although I have meted out serious damage). Now that could be do to 1) inexperience, or 2) too much battle damage accrued during previous fights during the match. As a devoted Griffin pilot, it pains me to say that, If there was a showdown at high noon in the middle of the street, between a Griffin and a Summoner, It would be the Summoner that LIMPS away. The Summoner might be one step from Death's Door, but it would still be standing. From what I have seen / experienced, the Summoner is good, solid, Battlemech.

[CancersCincar]

Well the Griffin might be "better" but it doesn't have a special place in my heart like the Summoner does. I'll keep using my Summoner thanks.

Edited by CancersCincar, 11 July 2014 - 04:40 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gryphon187, on 11 July 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

Since reading your topic, I have been seeking out Summoners and fighting them. In all cases, and with various versions of the Griffin, I have lost (although I have meted out serious damage). Now that could be do to 1) inexperience, or 2) too much battle damage accrued during previous fights during the match. As a devoted Griffin pilot, it pains me to say that, If there was a showdown at high noon in the middle of the street, between a Griffin and a Summoner, It would be the Summoner that LIMPS away. The Summoner might be one step from Death's Door, but it would still be standing. From what I have seen / experienced, the Summoner is good, solid, Battlemech.

speaking as

a devotee

of both

Griffin

and

Summoner

It would require

a pilot

of significant skill

to slow

my precious

il Fianchetto

Which has yet

to lose

to a Summoner

which pains me

more

as the Summoner

SHOULD

stand head and shoulders

above an

Obsolete product

of a bygone era

[Tremendous Upside]

I very much like my Griffin. I'm fairly lukewarm about my Summoner -- but I'd pick the latter every day of the week in a 1-to-1 comparison. The Summoner has better weapons. It has more armor capacity, better hit boxes, and it doesn't die the moment it loses one side torso.

[Bishop Steiner]

Banky, on 11 July 2014 - 05:59 PM, said:

I very much like my Griffin. I'm fairly lukewarm about my Summoner -- but I'd pick the latter every day of the week in a 1-to-1 comparison. The Summoner has better weapons. It has more armor capacity, better hit boxes, and it doesn't die the moment it loses one side torso.

It has

Better armor indeed

yet misguided

you are,

if you believe

It's Hitboxes

are close

The Griffin exceeds

it by far

in this capacity

coupled with

superlative agility

Those bold flaring

Shoulders

and small pectorals

combine

for a massive advantage

IRL durability

[Tremendous Upside]

Nah. I'm not misguided. I simply disagree with you. Simple as that

[Angel of Annihilation]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 June 2014 - 10:31 AM, said:

Only thing is, relying on one or 2 sets of Pods does not really equal "balance" as those pods now become "de-facto" must haves for the Chassis to legit compete.

However since lets face it, Clan are suppose to be able to mount any weapon in virtually any free location. Therefore it is not a stretch for PGI to release 2-3 omnipods that provide some different options that aren't based on some alt config or another.
Basically give the Summoner a Torso Onmipod that allows you to remove up to 2 JJs. Give it another that adds gives it 2 Missile mounts instead of one. Give an Arm with 2 ballastic mounts, perhaps another with 3 energy. Do that same for all the Clan mechs just to be fair to all chassis.

Basically they would still be stuck with alot of hardwired equipment and you still wouldn't be able to change armor, structure or engines and the individual pods still could be balanced by this sorts of fixed EQ slots. However, having this system would open up alot of customization and really make the Clan mechs feel more like the Omnimechs they are suppose to be and correct alot of might make a Clan mech subpar.

[Karmen Baric]

Summoner is good at what its built for mostly a hit and fade mech the way I see it. Its not a get in your face and demolish you mech which is what the OP wants.

And with regards to Griffin comparison, the Summoner has many advantages including the Clan XL engine, so its tougher to take down, the better & lighter clan weaponry, yet it is heavier so it shouldn't be more agile than a medium mech. The Summoner is in a good position as it Is right now. Provided you're a half capable pilot you shouldn't have any problems doing well in it.

OP states everyone who disagrees with him is wrong, perhaps OP is wrong and just a bad player to be able to pilot his mech well.

Edited by Karmen Baric, 11 July 2014 - 07:38 PM.

[KhanCipher]

FupDup, on 27 June 2014 - 10:33 AM, said:

Nicolai Malthus demands a hero Thor in his honor.



2 energy per arm, 6 energy per side torso (because they won't fit in the legs). The ultimate trolllololololol hero.

*cough* Thor M

[FupDup]

KhanCipher, on 11 July 2014 - 07:41 PM, said:

*cough* Thor M

That's what Malthus "technically" piloted in canon, but his loadout in the cartoon is quite clearly a laser boat. The M variant basically has almost the same hardpoints as the prime, though, so it would be fairly boring. His laser spam boat from the cartoon would be much more fun and unique.

Edited by FupDup, 11 July 2014 - 08:00 PM.

[GRiPSViGiL]

Great comparison Bishop.

I really like my Summoner and have no regrets that I went Gold with it but I would love it to be buffed some. Don't get me wrong I do very well in a 2 PPC 1 LBX5 loadout. The high flying mobility suits my playstyle very well and that is because I play it like my GRF-1N.

So please, PGI, make my favorite mech a little better.

[Bishop Steiner]

Karmen Baric, on 11 July 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Summoner is good at what its built for mostly a hit and fade mech the way I see it. Its not a get in your face and demolish you mech which is what the OP wants.

And with regards to Griffin comparison, the Summoner has many advantages including the Clan XL engine, so its tougher to take down, the better & lighter clan weaponry, yet it is heavier so it shouldn't be more agile than a medium mech. The Summoner is in a good position as it Is right now. Provided you're a half capable pilot you shouldn't have any problems doing well in it.

OP states everyone who disagrees with him is wrong, perhaps OP is wrong and just a bad player to be able to pilot his mech well.

your lack of reading comprehension, or actually reading the OP, perhaps, is truly pathetic. Such a poor eye for detail would mark you as the poor pilot. Myself, I'm an actual warrior of CGB, with more than enough drops and brother Bears to vouch.
The Summoner, is mediocre. As my OP states, it is better than the Griffin, by the slimmest of margins, and few I have fought in combat, had the skill to take advantage of it.

GRiPSViGiL, on 11 July 2014 - 08:26 PM, said:

Great comparison Bishop.

I really like my Summoner and have no regrets that I went Gold with it but I would love it to be buffed some. Don't get me wrong I do very well in a 2 PPC 1 LBX5 loadout. The high flying mobility suits my playstyle very well and that is because I play it like my GRF-1N.

So please, PGI, make my favorite mech a little better.

Been considering the LB-5X on it. Got an experimental Nova build that DONTOR and I sort of collaborated on, using one. Doesn't sound like you got room for any extra DHS. You use the arm ballistic or go "meta" and use the torso?

[Karamarka]

I like my summoner, i've got 3 distinct builds for it. With the new JJ change, it's 3 chassis built JJ will be nerfed and you cant even remove them.

Food for thought. Now it's a real shadow under the TImberwolf.

[GRiPSViGiL]

Bishop Steiner, on 11 July 2014 - 09:25 PM, said:

Been considering the LB-5X on it. Got an experimental Nova build that DONTOR and I sort of collaborated on, using one. Doesn't sound like you got room for any extra DHS. You use the arm ballistic or go "meta" and use the torso?

I run the 2 PPC in the right arm and LBX in the right torso.

[Bishop Steiner]

GRiPSViGiL, on 12 July 2014 - 01:01 AM, said:

I run the 2 PPC in the right arm and LBX in the right torso.

bouncing

across the landscape

like

a toaster pastry

too hot to handle?

or toe to toe

circles of death

man to man

as it's meant to be?