81 replies to this topic

[IraqiWalker]

Strap an XL 350, max armor, ENDO and DHS, plus some snap fire weapons, add a hillclimb module along with radar deprivation, and you are on your way to being the most annoying thing on the map since raven 3Ls could go 200+KpH, and were unkillable.

[Rear Admiral Tier 6]

I forgot to add that Cute Foxes and Battleturtles(adders and kit foxes that is) absolutely hate fast Dragons with decent high dps ballistics(LBX,AC10,gauss),nothing says better i love you than couple of shotgun blasts to the legs or ecm arm.Leg them early in the match and watch them being focus fired.Works also with IS lights,but is less effective due to their superior speed.

[BOWMANGR]

My Dragon 1C with 4xMPL, SRM4 and AC10 performs really well. The only thing that can make me sad is the op Timber Wolf because it is annoying to see a heavier mech carry all that firepower and still move almost as fast as my Dragon, turn almost as fast as my Dragon, carry Jumpjets AND have superior armor protection. Its ridiculous.

Otherwise, the Dragon sits in a nice place. When 10vs12 hits I believe that it will shine even more as its skirmisher gameplay style fits perfectly when you have others draw fire a thing made way easier when the other team starts with two less mechs to worry about.
worm4981's post in the previous page is spot on when describing some situations that Dragon pilots sometimes face.
You rely on your team's ability to draw fire so that you can go out there and do your thing. If your team is incompetent, cowardly or just unlucky you may just have to sit there waiting for an opportunity that will never come. At that moment you may feel that your mech doesn't have an impact on the map but this is normal. Your role is NOT to tank, or brawl. If your team didn't gave you a chance to perform your role, it's not the mech's fault.

This situation is comparable to an Atlas for example that has no Medium/Light mech support and gets rear torso cored by a Spider. Assaults need protections from Lights as much as Dragons need flanking opportunities. When PUGing it is entirely possible that you will get matches where you wait for that opportunity for 5 minutes and then it either happens, you get out and seriously wreck some mechs or it doesn't happen and you are forced in a brawl or in a tanking position where the Dragon crumbles.

It is this dependance on other people's actions that may make you feel that the Dragon doesn't perform but in reality the Dragon pilot is to blame only when he miscalculates his flanking maneuvers and the timing of his charge NOT when the rest of your teammates cannot make a basic frontline so that you can flank it properly.

[Bigbacon]

BOWMANGR, on 12 August 2014 - 08:17 AM, said:

My Dragon 1C with 4xMPL, SRM4 and AC10 performs really well. The only thing that can make me sad is the op Timber Wolf because it is annoying to see a heavier mech carry all that firepower and still move almost as fast as my Dragon, turn almost as fast as my Dragon, carry Jumpjets AND have superior armor protection. Its ridiculous.

please show me this build as I don't know how you fit that on there and still have ammo.

I can build that on my flame but only with a XL340, endo, ferro, and I get 1 ton srm ammo and 2 tons ac10 ammo.

Edited by Bigbacon, 13 August 2014 - 03:58 AM.

[BOWMANGR]

As you are only trying to flank and finish up mechs you dont need too much ammo. The Dragon loses almost all staring contests. Use your pulse lasers for all around combat and only shoot AC10 ammo when it counts not all the time. 30 rounds of ammo is plenty to do your job in a Dragon.

You can also use half a ton of SRMs as those are only used while cooling down from the MPL shots in order to secure a kill.

Your speed will protect your legs, shave some armor of there too. If you feel uncomfortable with all these points, you may do well in my previous build, which had UAC5 instead of AC10. The extra tonnage will give you room to add more comfortable ammo counts if you so desire.

If you don't mind spending some C-Bills, you also need both coolshots for extended exposure to combat.

Modules are:
Hill Climb {the Dragon can do some unexpected maneuvers with a good top speed and this one}
Target Info Gathering {to put your 30 AC10 rounds where they hurt instead of just spreading them around}
Radar Deprivation {AMS wastes tonnage on a Dragon and gives away your position, R.D. is perfect as your first 3 minutes of a match are spend hiding and waiting.}

Until PGI bothers to release some useful Role Warfare modules, ignore the Weapon modules, they are not worth it at all.

If you don't enjoy playing in such an unorthodox way, just go with the usual 4xML, AC10 build. I find that the MPLs allow me to send my 4MPL+AC10 shot way faster downrange and then torso twist and get out of there. The longer burn time of the Medium Laser really shows when piloting a Dragon.

I'm trying the LBX10 right now to see if I can gain 1 more ton to play with but I highly doubt that it fits the Dragon playstyle compared to the AC10pinpoint damage.

I should mention that right now, the Dragon underperforms when met with Clan mechs mainly because the Stormcrow and especially the Timber Wolf can actually keep up with your speed and they put out way more damage. It's ridiculous actually.

[Trevor Belmont]

I often run my Dragon 5N with an LB-10X, 2 LPL and an XL325 with a top speed of 96 KPH. Makes a good hunter.

[Trevor Belmont]

Is the Ballistic hard point on the Flame's left torso high mounted?

[gunghoblazes]

Trevor Belmont, on 13 August 2014 - 05:43 AM, said:

Is the Ballistic hard point on the Flame's left torso high mounted?

Yes

[Trevor Belmont]

gunghoblazes, on 13 August 2014 - 06:04 AM, said:

Yes

Thanks

[DONTOR]

Thats why I prefer the flame high mounted ballistic torso, although the highmounted dual energy point on the 1C is nice for 2xPPC or 2xERLL.

[Ngamok]

IraqiWalker, on 27 July 2014 - 01:05 AM, said:

I would like you to modify the builds I suggested, or post some of your own builds.

Here's mine.

DRG-1C

This was the first mech we got with high mounted energy points. Those 2 PPCs sit on top of the shoulder at cockpit height. So it was my peek a boo sniping mech. The LRM10 for added long range harassing. Was enough for 36 volleys. And the 2x ML for brawling when the time came. I could probably add a MG.

DRG-5N

Little slow for todays standards but it worked back then. Can put in an XL320 + 1 Heat Sink now to make it 95.0 KPH.

DRG-1N

Again the ER PPC is at cockpit height. More of a brawler though but can fight at longer range as well with the AC/5 and ER PPC. Could always drop it to a reg PPC for heat savings.

FLAME

Back when the Quickdraw came out, couple of guys in the unit were running theirs with an XL360. I didn't buy any but to keep up with them, this is what I did. They were also able to jump I couldn't. Fast little hitter though.

Edited by Ngamok, 13 August 2014 - 07:39 AM.

[Bigbacon]

been having odd luck with a 3 AC2 + 2ML + SRM 4 5N with a 300xl

[BOWMANGR]

OK, after trying to assess the Dragon's viability with the game's current state I believe that I can safely confirm some things:

1}
I used Dragon1C mainly. The builds that I checked were all using XL engines, Hill Climb, Radar Deprivation and Target Info Gathering except the last one which had Advanced Zoom instead of Hill Climb

a} 4xML, AC10 - Solid build but feels underpowered. Most of the time you either have to choose between delivering full ML damage and get shot back hard or more wisely spread the damage all over because you have to start torso twisting faster than the ML beam duration is over. Didn't like it.

b} 4xML, AC10, SRM4 - Essentially a slower build but more hard hitting. I believe it performed even better because it has a higher alpha which suits hit & run tactics.

c} 2xML, 2xMPL, AC10, SRM4 - played with Ferro Fibrous, ammo counts and leg armor. Still fast enough, higher alpha but although you can have the MPLs in the arms for faster combat situations and the ML on the torso to use along the SRMs in head on fights, it requires to utilize too many weapon groups. I found that I fiddled with my controls a bit too much {I have a gaming mouse and keyboard though} and in the end when you are piloting a hit & run mech you want the weapon controls to be easy so that you can focus on piloting and maneuvering. The two types of lasers conflicted with this.

d} 4MPL, AC10, SRM2 - It performed well as a support mech with 40+ alpha which is concentrated enough to hit the same spot most of the time. Unfortunately, the situations that allowed this mech to perform aren't common in PUG queue so I couldn't utilize it well. It sacrifices too much armor and ammo count to just hope that your PUG team will do their job properly so that you can do yours. It has no staying power in a fight. You need teammates and comms for this to work.

e} 4ML, LBX10 SRM4 - Nope. Spreads the damage all over and then you die.

f} 4xMPL, LBX10 - The concentrated firepower of the AC10 along with 24+ damage from the MPLs is waaay better than this configuration, although this one allows you to shoot more. I can see this setup to work great as a Light hunter but unless PGI starts nerfing Heavies/Assaults and buffing Lights/Mediums the Light Hunter role is worthless right now.

g} 3xML, TAG, LRM5, AC10 or AC5 - meh. Both sucked.

h} 2xSL, 2xERLL, Gauss - It works but it is slow and if the IS lights, a Stormcrow or a Timber Wolf decide to give you a hard time, you are screwed. You can stand and delived damage all match long but anything fast comes at you, you are dead. Maybe an LRM boat is better? I don't know. It performed solid numbers though. Definitely a revisit is needed for this one.


And after all that finally I returned to my old time-tested build of 4xMPL, SRM6, UAC5, XL340. It still kicks ass. Only the OP clan mechs can make you feel bad because as things are right now you are essentially gimping yourself compared to a Timber Wolf and even the Stormcrow. The balance right now is way off.

I believe that right now its not worth it to pilot a Dragon {and the Dragon IS my favorite mech but we need to face the truth}. Things need to change. The Dragon's unique playstyle will shine {and I really cannot wait to try it} when 10 vs 12 matches start happening. When you don't have to worry that after turning a corner you'll end up in front of 3 Clan mechs all shooting OP dps numbers on you then you can pilot this mech properly. Right now the collective power of the Clan mechs have lowered the Dragon's survivability too low to be really effective when emerging from cover. You simply do not have enough endurance to emerge, hit and hide with the amount of damage the Clans are putting out.


Note that all of the above observations are about PUG matches and not teams. Teams will usually want to min/max and suck the fun out of the game. In the min/max -ing world a mech like the Dragon will always be considered a bad choice. Always.

Let's just hope that 10 vs 12 and a few more Clan nerfs later, will put the Dragon back to its niche as a useful mech. Right now it CAN perform but it won't do so as brilliantly as before the Clans arrived.

P.S. As a sidenote, I also tried the 5N with 3xAC2s, SRM6 and 2 Medium Lasers. It performs well. It can even try to stand and fight for a bit more because the screen shake makes most enemy pilots nervous and they lose their concentration thus allowing you to wreck them even further. The only Dragon that I haven't tried experimenting with is the 1N but this is because I have OCD about filling all hardpoints in all of my mechs. It just feels wrong to know that I've unused hardpoints. The 1N simply doesn't have the weapon tonnage required to fill all hardpoints with really useful weapons it seems. I'll try it someday but at least in theory it seems too bad to even try.

Edited by BOWMANGR, 13 August 2014 - 11:18 AM.

[Werewolf486 ScorpS]

Only the most crazy or capable pilots run The Dragon. It takes great builds and awesome skill to make the Dragon perform well, but when it's the right build it's crazy good!!

[gunghoblazes]

Werewolf486, on 13 August 2014 - 11:35 AM, said:

Only the most crazy or capable pilots run The Dragon. It takes great builds and awesome skill to make the Dragon perform well, but when it's the right build it's crazy good!!

Thought i would post this here. You can do well in the dragon it just takes time learning your setup and the mech. You are going to have some bad games though, just gonna have to face it. Think i had a game yesterday where i died and did 97 damage, it happens.

Edited by gunghoblazes, 13 August 2014 - 05:50 PM.

[The Gruntmaster 6000]

I'm really late to the party and I'll keep my review of this mech brief.

It was some Drac's idea of a joke. Easily the simplest mech in game the game to kill. It has a CT that is worse than the Timber Wolf's and Mad Dog's combined. This mech IN MY OPINION, is not worth the amount of MC (for the hero) or C-Bills that they want for it. I can make a 10 times better mech out of a Jenner.

My review discard if you wish.

[gunghoblazes]

The Advisor, on 13 August 2014 - 06:08 PM, said:

I'm really late to the party and I'll keep my review of this mech brief.

It was some Drac's idea of a joke. Easily the simplest mech in game the game to kill. It has a CT that is worse than the Timber Wolf's and Mad Dog's combined. This mech IN MY OPINION, is not worth the amount of MC (for the hero) or C-Bills that they want for it. I can make a 10 times better mech out of a Jenner.

My review discard if you wish.

You could but it would not be as fun

[The Gruntmaster 6000]

True. Dragon is good for entertainment value. You know just going out knowing you will die, for the sake of it.

[gunghoblazes]

The Advisor, on 13 August 2014 - 06:20 PM, said:

True. Dragon is good for entertainment value. You know just going out knowing you will die, for the sake of it.

Not totally true of the last 175 matches I died in 105 and of those 81 were losses.

Edited by gunghoblazes, 13 August 2014 - 06:24 PM.

[The Gruntmaster 6000]

Not bad. Especially for Dragon. Nice job.





Jenner still my baby (In my past 25 matches I only died when I overheated myself on accident aka Terra Therma+Lava+Lasers+Fellin)