41 replies to this topic

[masterstranger]

G'day guys. New pilot reporting in. So far I'm having a blast (although im more than slightly terrible, averaging at 100 damage a game in my 17 matches thus far) Still having fun and try all the trial mechs out. Also spent a few hours watching/reading/getting my head around all the helpful guides in this forum. Some of its already come in handy, and im sure i'll pick up more of it on my second read through.

As i'm up to my cadet bonus 17, i'll probably have the money for my first mech tomorrow and i wanted to ask for a little help in some of the options.

If im honest im not an entirely new player, as i played for several weeks when the open beta first launched ( right at the time with LRM boats won everything, i don't think there was even an AMS yet). At the time i remember really enjoying the Hunchback and the Dragon (cannot remember the varients for the life of me, I think DRG-1C and the 4sp for the hunchy.)

Anyway, out of the currently available trial mechs, the ones i've enjoyed the most have been the cataphract and the orion. Reading up on all four of them, it seems i have a liking for a slower armoured all rounder, a jack of all trades. I feel most comfortable in a "second line skirmisher" role, sitting in the middle of the PUG pack and helping the assault mechs where i can, taking some damage in return. I don't particularly like the light mechs at all, nor did i enjoy the grat big hulking assault mechs (I panic in the cockpit and fall to peices.)

Anyway, sorry about the big giant wall of text there, i guess what im asking is, what would you guys reccomend as a "solid all rounder" mech. Something i can try a few different things on would be a huge bonus, so a mix of Hardpoints would be good. And probably more towards the armour over the speed , as i'd rather be a little slower and able to take a couple more hits, than be faster and get knocked over with those same two hits.

Any help would be appreciated, i hope i've made sense with my post (when im excited i tend to type/talk faster than my brain can track haha). If you need any more info or clarification i'd be happy to answer.

Thank you very much in advance, all suggestions will be looked into.

[Lucky Noob]

As your Playstyle sugests i woud recomend the Orion, hes not the fasterst but he cn take an Punch.

As he has an great varity of different Hardpoints, ( Missles, Lasers, Balistics ) hes great for testing all different Kinds of settings .

Also his Different Models add even more Options, ( Va with 4 Srm6 in the arms ).

I think its an soild Mech to start with.

[The Great Unwashed]

The Hunchback was my first mech and was a great exercise, however, I think the (newer) Shadowhawk is an excellent mech for both starters and experts. Durable, great weapon loadouts, jumpjets if you like, and fast enough to team up when you find yourself alone all of a sudden (these things tend to happen).

Edited by The Great Unwashed, 15 July 2014 - 03:54 AM.

[Kmieciu]

Try the Thunderbolt - it's the most newbie-friendly heavy mech.

Edited by Kmieciu, 15 July 2014 - 03:57 AM.

[masterstranger]

Kmieciu, on 15 July 2014 - 03:57 AM, said:

Try the Thunderbolt - it's the most newbie-friendly heavy mech.

What are the strengths and weaknesses of the Thunderbolt? Which model (and this goes for all suggestions) would you guys suggest? Why?

Thank you very much for the quick replies.

[The Great Unwashed]

As far as model go: you need to run at least three to unlock all skills of a chassis. Life after unlocking both basic and elite skills is really so much easier. This means that you need to like at least 3 variants of each mech.

I'd suggest the SDS-2D or TDR-9S, for reasons of a good hardpoint layout.

BTW, lighter mechs are cheaper and you also have to buy endo-steel and double-heatsink upgrades... choices choices...

Edited by The Great Unwashed, 15 July 2014 - 04:18 AM.

[Redshift2k5]

Not a big fan of the Thunderbolt. Hard to go wrong with the Cataphract or Jagermech, especially if you want ballistics. Orion is not bad(slower but more armor) but it's loadouts tend to require lasers + ballistics + missiles and don't let you focus on one main weapon.

Shadowhawk is a really solid all-rounder although less armoured than the Heavies, of course.

[Kmieciu]

The Great Unwashed, on 15 July 2014 - 04:16 AM, said:

I'd suggest the SDS-2D or TDR-9S, for reasons of a good hardpoint layout.
BTW, lighter mechs are cheaper and you also have to buy endo-steel and double-heatsink upgrades... choices choices...

TDR-9S gets you the most durable 65-tonne mech with Dual Heat Sinks as standard (1.5 million C-Bills right there) that can mount every IS weapon available (except AC20). All this for a low low price just under 6 million C-Bills. You don't need much more to equip it properly. In fact, it works best if you strip some weapons for ammo and heat sinks.

Light mechs might seem cheap, but since they require a big XL engine, DHS upgrade, endo and ferro the total cost quickly rises to about 8-9 million per mech.

Thunderbolt is the new Hunchback. And the TDR-9SE is even better than HBK-4SP, since it can mount 5 Medium Lasers, 2xSRM6 and Jump jets.

Edited by Kmieciu, 15 July 2014 - 05:07 AM.

[Denolven]

masterstranger, on 15 July 2014 - 01:53 AM, said:

what would you guys reccomend as a "solid all rounder" mech.

Allrounders are all mechs that have all types of weapon hardpoints (energy, ballistic, missile).
The most common ones that match this requirement are:

Mediums: Shadowhawk, Centurion, Hunchback
Heavies: Jagermech, Orion, Dragon
Assaults: Victor, Highlander, Atlas

Due to your preferences of armor and versatility, we can filter that to: Centurion, Orion, and possibly Victor.
Centurion and Orion are the toughest in their weight class, and Victor is the most nimble assault in the game, effectively making it a heavy on drugs. They are all humanoids, which means they are more a wingman than a second line support.

Classical second line mechs have high mounted weapons and use terrain/allies to protect large parts of their body. The most common ones are Jagermech and Stalker. If you don't mind the lack of ballistic hardpoints, the Stalker might be what you are looking for. It's really tough and has tons of weapons for mid and long range (can be equipped for short range as well, if you really want).
Stay away from XL engines to keep your survivability high. Makes you slower, but you said that's not a problem.

For further information and future requests, please consider using this thread: Which Mech you should buy
(Contains a list of commonly recommended mechs according to role)

Edited by Denolven, 15 July 2014 - 05:34 AM.

[SnagaDance]

Seems to me that you galaxy's in Orion's belt!

[SethAbercromby]

In agreement with Denolven here. Jagermechs are all about dakka, while the Stalker runs hot with is energy-focus, but has a lot of staying power in return. And I can totally get why you're a bit intimidated when sitting in an Assault. There's a lot of responsibility the team expects you to take while you're also a big hulking target for your enemies to shoot at. But at the other hand, that experience teaches you a lot about staying calm when combat goes all over the place, rules of engagement and team responsibility. Heavies also use similar rules of angegement and you'll need to know more about movement patterns and tactics, but you're carrying less of a burden for your team (in comparison).

Contrary to what most newcomers believe, the Heavy class is the primary offensive force of the team. Assaults are bigger and carry equivalend fire power, but also much slower. Their main responsibility shifts to shielding the Heavy and Medium 'Mechs with their superior armor to keep them alive for as long as possible.

Edited by SethAbercromby, 15 July 2014 - 06:05 AM.

[Denolven]

masterstranger, on 15 July 2014 - 04:09 AM, said:

What are the strengths and weaknesses of the Thunderbolt?

The Thunderbolt is average in everything. It's a decent first heavy experience but doesn't do anything particularly well. If you want to go speed/agility, go Dragon. If you want to go armor, go Orion. All of them have the hardpoint versatility, just move at different speeds and have corresponding survivability. The Victor would be the next step towards armor (plus it comes with jump jets). And nobody expects a Victor to lead an army, everyone knows they are more heavy than assault.

Edited by Denolven, 15 July 2014 - 06:38 AM.

[MouldyBread]

come back again in 2 months and get a stormcrow

[Koniving]

masterstranger, on 15 July 2014 - 01:53 AM, said:

G'day guys. New pilot reporting in.
what im asking is, what would you guys reccomend as a "solid all rounder" mech.
Thank you very much in advance, all suggestions will be looked into.

Orions are solid, affordable mechs that bridge the gap between Heavy and Assault while maximizing the strengths and minimizing the weaknesses of the two. Unlike the assaults, the Orion can be fast enough to get away from danger, bad positioning, general bad situations and mistakes. Unlike the heavies, it can take abuse worthy of an assault mech.

Another new player, Alexander Home (I think it was), used similar advice to pick an Orion. He chose a K before I could put my input in, but he liked it despite its tendency to be hotter than other Orions. You may note that every variant has different hardpoints, which creates different limitations. Some variants of mechs (such as Cataphracts and Banshees) have engine limits on certain models as well.

The Orion K has the most energy hardpoints, as such it will inevitably run the hottest. It may be my least favorite Orion, but interestingly it is the one I have the most gameplay videos of. These are the best ones I have to offer at the moment.

Spoiler

Orion K pugging (pug means pick up gamer, playing by yourself, casual play)

You'll note in the first match (with amazingly abnormal cooperation from the other players), I got them to charge with a non-verbal hand gesture (this like..never normally happens) and used them as a front line to keep enemies busy while I flanked. You'll also see some climbing tricks for mechs without jumpjets.

In the second match you'll see the common pack mentality that keeps large mechs alive. Note: Once LRMs enter the picture, the pack mentality changes from aggressive to "everyone for themselves" or "huddle in a ball until they run out of ammo even if we're completely screwed if we do so), which is a bit of a problem that you will face.

Another Orion K set of builds. The first uses a Gauss Rifle to mitigate high heat issues. The second uses some semi-incompatible weapons to reduce my firing frequency and enhance my range.


In this last one, I'm using a Protector (the Orion hero mech) with an Atlas mock-build (identical to some older atlas designs I have but more limited on ammo and faster despite the same size engine). At one point I had a very bad position and a bad situation. Where any assault greater than 80 tons would be screwed, and even a Victor might not make it, I chose to U-turn and get out of the situation to go for more opportune targets even with half my weapons destroyed.

When using an Orion it's important to use Standard engines; XL engines bring risk. This is great because unlike other mechs such as Catapults which require XL engines to bring out their true potential, any mech using standard engines will be a LOT cheaper to load up and send into battle. Many decent-sized XL engines cost more than most medium mechs. Back in the repair and rearm days, they were also much more costly to repair (the risk versus the reward of a very weight-saving engine).

masterstranger, on 15 July 2014 - 04:09 AM, said:

What are the strengths and weaknesses of the Thunderbolt? Which model (and this goes for all suggestions) would you guys suggest? Why?

Thank you very much for the quick replies.

Thunderbolts.

Advantages:

• One variant can jump.
  
• Two variants can use all 3 weapon types.
  
• Two variants have shoulder-mounted energy weapons (on eye level, makes it easy to crest hills as a sniper).
  
• All variants have arm weapons, allowing for skilled players to track enemies for lock-ons, advanced aiming techniques as well as better vertical and horizontal range of aim for situations when you otherwise cannot shoot at the target.
  
• These mechs come stock with strong armor.
  
• Lots of hardpoints for lots of weapon variety.
  
• Cockpit is on the left torso and not the center, with the middle of the cockpit being a divider for torsos. (This is good because anyone going for a headshot with a beam weapon is going to split their damage between 3 sections).
  
• The general hitbox shape makes the center and left torsos very Clan mech resistant. (IE good resistance against laser fire due to tendency to spread damage without effort. Don't expect it to help against ballistics or missiles).
  
• Bloated body shape (done because the stock has lots of armor; pity stock armor doesn't mean much) has a lot of front torso surface area and very little rear; while not always a good thing here it means you can focus more than 95% of your armor on the front and tank like a beast. Just don't let things get behind you.
  
• The side torsos are huge. When one is destroyed, it reduces all damage done to it by 50% before transferring it to the center torso. Get them hitting your destroyed shoulder space to reduce it by 75% (50% from arm hitbox to ST, 50% of that from ST to CT).

Disadvantages:

• A large number of hardpoints with only 65 tons to work with means it is difficult to fill them and design ideas tend to go awry when they feel they must fill every hardpoint. Balanced, mixed loadouts can use them all just fine, but many people like to carry the biggest bangs for their buck and as many of said bangs as they possibly can.
  
• Some builds have most of the hardpoints on the left torso, this draws attention and fire to the left torso.
  
• Most hardpoints are mounted on the torsos.
  
• Regardless of launcher size, the missile pods tend to have only 2 sizes on some variants, large and huge. Other variants only have medium and large. There's always the option of removing them entirely though.
  
• Thunderbolt cockpits are off-center, though it doesn't feel that way. This makes convergence a little awkward and depth perception as well.
  
• Thunderbolts normally have a great view, unless you're in one with two left torso missile launchers then you can't see to your left.
  
• Thunderbolts are fat targets with huge side torsos, they are not XL engine friendly unless at very high speeds of more than 81 kph. And even then it's a nasty risk.

Thunderbolts are a favorite of mine.

Spoiler

Very recent: Thunderbolts versus Clan mechs.


Skip to 3 minutes. Support fire battle while under heavy return fire and multiple artillery strikes. Skip to 9 minutes for the end-game urban brawling.


Hit and run Thunderbolts


Cover using thunderbolts.

And I know, vid overload. But it never hurts to watch things in moderation over time. Some variety videos. Contains multiple mechs; one to a match, shorter matches.

Spoiler

Edited by Koniving, 15 July 2014 - 08:07 AM.

[SethAbercromby]

MouldyBread, on 15 July 2014 - 06:44 AM, said:

come back again in 2 months and get a stormcrow

You do realize that the entire design philophy of Clan 'Mechs is geared towards veterans or rather players that already have a good understanding of the underlying principles of 'Mech design?

"But Clanners are OP! Nerf nerf nerf" no, they are no. They perform very well right now because the people who currently use them are either hardcore BattleTech fans or MWO veterans, likely both. They don't perform better on average simply because they are Clan 'Mechs but because most of them are in the hands of players that would do better than the others regardless.

Clan Teach is in a very delicate state of balance and overall tweaked very well. Of course it's obvious that they will recieve some tweaks here and there as the developers observe what works well and what doesn't, but overall I think they are very similar to LRMs. people are screaming bloody murder for either nerfs or buffs, while they are in truth only a minimal tweak away from being balanced perfectly.

[Turist0AT]

You cant go wrong with the cataphract line, solid machines. 4xAC5 CTF-4X; 3xAC10 ILYA; 2xGauss ppc jj CTF-3D;5LPL or 5LL CTF-1X. Love em.

[VixNix]

Kmieciu, on 15 July 2014 - 04:59 AM, said:

TDR-9S gets you the most durable 65-tonne mech with Dual Heat Sinks as standard (1.5 million C-Bills right there) that can mount every IS weapon available (except AC20). All this for a low low price just under 6 million C-Bills. You don't need much more to equip it properly. In fact, it works best if you strip some weapons for ammo and heat sinks.

Light mechs might seem cheap, but since they require a big XL engine, DHS upgrade, endo and ferro the total cost quickly rises to about 8-9 million per mech.

Thunderbolt is the new Hunchback. And the TDR-9SE is even better than HBK-4SP, since it can mount 5 Medium Lasers, 2xSRM6 and Jump jets.

I have over 20 million c-bills in my Raven 3L, that is counting modules, and the modules took tons of GXP.

[Koniving]

Turist0AT, on 15 July 2014 - 08:12 AM, said:

You cant go wrong with the cataphract line, solid machines. 4xAC5 CTF-4X; 3xAC10 ILYA; 2xGauss ppc jj CTF-3D;5LPL or 5LL CTF-1X. Love em.

Most Cataphracts can't use missiles though.

And honestly when faced with an Orion and a Cataphract, I'd shoot the Cataphract first. Much more likely to have an XL engine and easier to kill. I confess the other reason is typically Cataphracts are more dangerous regardless of the hands using it. But an Orion in even mildly capable hands (that's not common by-the-by) is definitely much more dangerous.

People still use the 5 LL CTF-1X? Thought that went extinct after ghost heat. Might give me a reason to get the dust off of my CTF-1x.

I think the thing that a Cataphract has over the Orion is it's shorter (and the jumpjet variant).

[DrSlamastika]

Welcome here, I dont know about hunchies or dragons, cose I dont have anyone of them.

But you will not go wrong if you choose Cataphracts if you like it. Great ballistic platform, maybe jaggers even better cose they have higher mounted slots. But I donl like their design.

I also think heavy mech are best for begginers, not so slow, (after speed tweak), decent armor and good firepower, but dont forgen, you will need 3 variants for greater benefits in your skill tree.

There is a lot of differences between mastered and basic mechs.

Take a look on builds when you choose your first chassis, in forum - GUIDES AND STRATEGIES - BATTLEMECHS.

But dont forgot, this is skill based game, so take your time for learning and be patient

Edited by DrSlamastika, 15 July 2014 - 08:49 AM.

[Nik Reaper]

I'm personally not sold on the Orions, they are a good idea, but unless JJ become much less desirable ( they might , but it's questionable ) the orions is a large tall target , and has no use in comp play, and yes he is a new player and will take time till he gets there ( if ever ) but he might as well start on something that is easy and effective with the option to progress.

Please put an emphasis that unless he is an devoted player ( many hours in a week ) or unless he plans to pay for mechs or premium time, it takes a pretty long time to get and deck out a new mech, so if you find one isn't what you expected it will be a bit of a pain to grind out for the next thing.

My advice is always Cataphract , it's everything exept a LRM boat , + divine mech model ( small and short, thin with some high mounted hardpoints, and "gorilla" arms used to protect the torso like the atlas )

Here's a high alpha brawler http://mwo.smurfy-ne...425cb96cdd3a799 , don't use the lasers when you get hot , just use the AC and srms.
Here's a more sustained brawler http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4c946bdffe2bfc2 , chain mediums as you get hot.
Here's a more mid range fighter http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9ac68ae671ee096
Here's a fun dakka boat http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b92901d845581c8

And a bunch more options ( the meta jump sniper ) to play with , Love my 3D and have 2 of 'em .