199 replies to this topic

[Hobgoblin I]

XX Sulla XX, on 17 July 2014 - 10:52 PM, said:

Truth is ghost heat has worked. Not the most elegant wayt do it but its worked and its easy to adjust. The already have a limit on Gauss so you can only fire 2. Really I not see where this is going to introduce something bad or hurt game play. And its not something we are asking them to code. It is coded and done.

You already had someone mention not allowing 2 PPC's to be fired with AC 10's in this thread...what comes next? "ZOMG...I got hit by 4 med pulse lasers at once...NERF" If alpah damage is a problem to PGI the need to lower the heat threshold and increase dispensation. If pinpoint damage is the problem they need to fix convergence. If front loaded damage is the problem, along with the others, well...they designed the game...

[badaa]

more worthless buffs and nerfs fix pinpoint and they can stop wasting time on this ****

[XX Sulla XX]

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You already had someone mention not allowing 2 PPC's to be fired with AC 10's in this thread...what comes next? "ZOMG...I got hit by 4 med pulse lasers at once...NERF" If alpah damage is a problem to PGI the need to lower the heat threshold and increase dispensation. If pinpoint damage is the problem they need to fix convergence. If front loaded damage is the problem, along with the others, well...they designed the game...

On the podcast and on this thread we mentioned the limit they shoot for of having front loaded pinpoint damage at about 30. The exceptions to that will have enough drawbacks to balance them out. There is nothing really that new here.

[xXBagheeraXx]

XX Sulla XX, on 17 July 2014 - 10:57 PM, said:

Well you will do 50 over time not at the same time. Thats enough of a change. I want the Dire Wolf to be a good mech.

How long will the firing delay be between the Gauss and ppcs? what 1 second? 2 seconds? Its not going to affect me (or any other player with his grit) at all. My shots are always against targets not playing attention so im almost always going to land both of those in the exact same section. Heck with the current system ive gotten 3-4 alphas off in one target before he realized he was in an unhealthy position. Most pugs have horrible situational awareness or forget the number 1 rule of mechwarrior.

Shooting, maneuvering, and being a good pilot are all well and good, but the best skill to have is knowing when to run like a scared little girl. Most pugs I see will sit and have staring contests with me at 800 meters when I run that build, or simply rush out over open ground and let me constantly hammer thier center torso. This nerf will do nothing to fix that stupid and probably wont affect my games in my DW prime at all.

And like I said, I can easily move to 2 larges and 4 mediums and have 80 point alphas. Its easy to clear 1k damage with that build.

Edited by xXBagheeraXx, 17 July 2014 - 11:19 PM.

[XX Sulla XX]

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more worthless buffs and nerfs fix pinpoint and they can stop wasting time on this ****

Again the thing is this is done has a small effect on the game and just needs to be turned on.

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How long will the firing delay be between the Gauss and ppcs? what 1 second? 2 seconds? Its not going to affect me (or any other player with his grit) at all. My shots are always against targets not playing attention so im almost always going to land both of those in the exact same section. Heck with the current system ive gotten 3-4 alphas off in one target before he realized he was in an unhealthy position. Most pugs have horrible situational awareness or forget the number 1 rule of mechwarrior.

Shooting, maneuvering, and being a good pilot are all well and good, but the best skill to have is knowing when to run like a scared little girl. Most pugs I see will sit and have staring contests with me at 800 meters when I run that build, or simply rush out over open ground and let me constantly hammer thier center torso. This nerf will do nothing to fix that stupid and probably wont affect my games in my DW prime at all.

If some one gets hit with a duel gause and waits for you to hit them with the next shot of PPCs they deserve it.

[xXBagheeraXx]

XX Sulla XX, on 17 July 2014 - 11:20 PM, said:

Again the thing is this is done has a small effect on the game and just needs to be turned on.

If some one gets hit with a duel gause and waits for you to hit them with the next shot of PPCs they deserve it.

THEY DO. THEY ALWAYS DO. Why i say this nerf is pointless.

My alt A runs 2 gauss and 4 er larges. I always cycle my weapons the same gauss, 2 larges, then 2 larges, then by that time the gauss is reloaded...a constant stream of damage downrange ...There have been players that let me run though enough cycles to overheat IN ALPINE with that build before they go "HMMMM most of my armor is gone PERHAPS I should DUCK!" Go test out clan large laser duration and see how long it takes me to cycle though all those weapons. This nerf is going to wind up just like the Original gauss desync nerf and good players will still work with it and wreck face as always. I just hope it doesn't apply to 1 gauss and 2 ppc builds.

[XX Sulla XX]

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THEY DO. THEY ALWAYS DO. Why i say this nerf is pointless.

My alt A runs 2 gauss and 4 er larges. I always cycle my weapons the same gauss, 2 larges, then 2 larges, then by that time the gauss is reloaded...a constant stream of damage downrange ...There have been players that let me run though enough cycles to overheat IN ALPINE with that build before they go "HMMMM most of my armor is gone PERHAPS I should DUCK!" Go test out clan large laser duration and see how long it takes me to cycle though all those weapons. This nerf is going to wind up just like the Original gauss desync nerf and good players will still work with it and wreck face as always. I just hope it doesn't apply to 1 gauss and 2 ppc builds.

Only 1 gauss and one PPC together or 2 gauss or two ppc. Cant fire three of any combo.

[YueFei]

xXBagheeraXx, on 17 July 2014 - 11:17 PM, said:

How long will the firing delay be between the Gauss and ppcs? what 1 second? 2 seconds? Its not going to affect me (or any other player with his grit) at all. My shots are always against targets not playing attention so im almost always going to land both of those in the exact same section. Heck with the current system ive gotten 3-4 alphas off in one target before he realized he was in an unhealthy position. Most pugs have horrible situational awareness or forget the number 1 rule of mechwarrior.

Shooting, maneuvering, and being a good pilot are all well and good, but the best skill to have is knowing when to run like a scared little girl. Most pugs I see will sit and have staring contests with me at 800 meters when I run that build, or simply rush out over open ground and let me constantly hammer thier center torso. This nerf will do nothing to fix that stupid and probably wont affect my games in my DW prime at all.

And like I said, I can easily move to 2 larges and 4 mediums and have 80 point alphas. Its easy to clear 1k damage with that build.

I'm more scared of the 2xcERPPC and 2xcGauss. If I slip up for just a moment I am half dead.

I'm alot less scared of Clan Lasers. Lasers, by their DoT nature, and the nature of human reflexes of the shooter not being, you know, instantaneous, means that simply waggling the mech around will spread the damage.

When I fight people using lasers I usually end up losing armor all over my HBK, including my arms. Yes, those tiny toothpick arms actually help absorb some damage for me. Yeah, those lasers will eventually kill me, but not with the same efficiency as PP FLD weapons.

When I fight people with PP FLD, sometimes my shoulder just disappears. If I'm lucky I manage to catch it with the arm. So the arm disappears in 1 shot. 60 laser damage wouldn't be able to do that if I'm half awake. It's much more challenging to avoid getting snap-shotted by 35+ PP FLD.

[xXBagheeraXx]

YueFei, on 17 July 2014 - 11:27 PM, said:

I'm more scared of the 2xcERPPC and 2xcGauss. If I slip up for just a moment I am half dead.

I'm alot less scared of Clan Lasers. Lasers, by their DoT nature, and the nature of human reflexes of the shooter not being, you know, instantaneous, means that simply waggling the mech around will spread the damage.

When I fight people using lasers I usually end up losing armor all over my HBK, including my arms. Yes, those tiny toothpick arms actually help absorb some damage for me. Yeah, those lasers will eventually kill me, but not with the same efficiency as PP FLD weapons.

When I fight people with PP FLD, sometimes my shoulder just disappears. If I'm lucky I manage to catch it with the arm. So the arm disappears in 1 shot. 60 laser damage wouldn't be able to do that if I'm half awake. It's much more challenging to avoid getting snap-shotted by 35+ PP FLD.

I always lead with the gauss rifles, so you ARE going to lose a chunk of that shoulder anyway. And I rarely if ever see anyone rolling damage in pugs. Especially not assault mechs. I always see mechs like blackhawks doing it and I just laugh and blow thier arms off, or leg them. I gun for other assaults first and most atlas drivers or the like that I see just STARE.

[Ursh]

Deathlike, on 17 July 2014 - 10:43 PM, said:

No... it's coming from the instant-gib action on the Light pilots... however many that exist in the queues.

I've been playing Kit Foxes the past week, and I've lost a torso to a DireWolf once. If the 150kph IS lights are getting instagibbed, it's because they were hovering behind some other assault, maniacally laughing at their elite backshooting skills, when the Dire Whale caught them out. GG close.

[XX Sulla XX]

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I always lead with the gauss rifles, so you ARE going to lose a chunk of that shoulder anyway. And I rarely if ever see anyone rolling damage in pugs. Especially not assault mechs. I always see mechs like blackhawks doing it and I just laugh and blow thier arms off, or leg them. I gun for other assaults first and most atlas drivers or the like that I see just STARE.

Well thats all good and all but it comes down to pugs and pugs you are playing. It says nothing against turning on this code.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Here is the million dollar question, Will the nerf apply to 2 gauss 1 ppc builds? Because if that isnt the case than the simple workaround will be to have your ppcs on chainfire. the first shot will be 2 Gauss rifles and 1 ppc immediately followed by the second. Aint even nerfed yet and ive got a workaround. XD

Ursh, on 17 July 2014 - 11:33 PM, said:

I've been playing Kit Foxes the past week, and I've lost a torso to a DireWolf once. If the 150kph IS lights are getting instagibbed, it's because they were hovering behind some other assault, maniacally laughing at their elite backshooting skills, when the Dire Whale caught them out. GG close.

Yep, every light ive killed has been sitting in the open thinking ECM makes them miraculously invisible or they keep peeking after ive shot them once or twice from the same location. I think ive only outright drilled a light moving full speed once.

[XX Sulla XX]

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ere is the million dollar question, Will the nerf apply to 2 gauss 1 ppc builds? Because if that isnt the case than the simple workaround will be to have your ppcs on chainfire. the first shot will be 2 Gauss rifles and 1 ppc immediately followed by the second. Aint even nerfed yet and ive got a workaround. XD

Yes I already confirmed this you can only fire 1 gauss and 1 PPC. It treats them as being in the same pool. ANd you can only fire 2. They did not say what the delay would be but of course it can be adjusted as needed.

[YueFei]

xXBagheeraXx, on 17 July 2014 - 11:30 PM, said:

I always lead with the gauss rifles, so you ARE going to lose a chunk of that shoulder anyway. And I rarely if ever see anyone rolling damage in pugs. Especially not assault mechs. I always see mechs like blackhawks doing it and I just laugh and blow thier arms off, or leg them. I gun for other assaults first and most atlas drivers or the like that I see just STARE.

Nah, if there's a half second delay between your weapons fire, I might even make it back into cover before the second volley. Or adjust my twist and arm angle to try to catch the next shot on the arm. Or at least twist around to take the next hit on the other shoulder. There's a bit more margin for error and reaction time on my part if your volley is spaced out.

I don't know why you keep bringing up examples of people who never twist or take cover?

We're talking about a volley of fire that, even against moving, twisting targets, focuses alot of damage into one spot. As you yourself pointed out, those Nova pilots doing their best to keep themselves alive, and yet get nearly half their weapons loadout ripped off in a single blast. I dunno why you think that's dumb of the Nova pilot to twist, because the alternative is to eat it to the CT and basically lose all CT armor. The next 30+ PP FLD shot to the CT would likely be a kill shot.

[xXBagheeraXx]

XX Sulla XX, on 17 July 2014 - 11:38 PM, said:

Yes I already confirmed this you can only fire 1 gauss and 1 PPC. It treats them as being in the same pool. ANd you can only fire 2. They did not say what the delay would be but of course it can be adjusted as needed.

Eh, fine with me. Even more deadly 80 damage alpha build it is!

[Mcgral18]

xXBagheeraXx, on 17 July 2014 - 11:40 PM, said:

Eh, fine with me. Even more deadly 80 damage alpha build it is!

And DoT is less deadly than PP FLD.

It's the nature of things. It doesn't mean it isn't deadly, just not quite as efficient. Your damage scores will go up.

[xXBagheeraXx]

YueFei, on 17 July 2014 - 11:40 PM, said:

Nah, if there's a half second delay between your weapons fire, I might even make it back into cover before the second volley. Or adjust my twist and arm angle to try to catch the next shot on the arm. Or at least twist around to take the next hit on the other shoulder. There's a bit more margin for error and reaction time on my part if your volley is spaced out.

I don't know why you keep bringing up examples of people who never twist or take cover?

We're talking about a volley of fire that, even against moving, twisting targets, focuses alot of damage into one spot. As you yourself pointed out, those Nova pilots doing their best to keep themselves alive, and yet get nearly half their weapons loadout ripped off in a single blast. I dunno why you think that's dumb of the Nova pilot to twist, because the alternative is to eat it to the CT and basically lose all CT armor. The next 30+ PP FLD shot to the CT would likely be a kill shot.

Half second isn't enough to even hit the "s" key and get back into cover for most decent snipers. Thats more than enough for me to land a follow up shot.

My point in mentioning nova pilots was that the only mechs I see actually trying to twist damage are mechs that lose most of thier armament or mobility by doing so. Nova arms have NO armor whatsoever so rolling that damage in the arms will just get you stripped. and then ct killed from the side since your nose sticks out like nobodies business. The people that SHOULD be rolling it. Dont.

Pugs dont twist. Pugs dont utilize cover. Pugs keep peeking out and getting alphaed in the face. Then they go in the forums and whine and moan about clan mechs being OP. Clan mechs arent op. Stupidity is. Not saying you are stupid, but im going by what I see when I solo drop.

My entire point is The nerf isnt going to do anything. and even if it makes the 50 point alpha build unusable, There are much nastier alternatives with even high alpha.

[XX Sulla XX]

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Half second isn't enough to even hit the "s" key and get back into cover for most decent snipers. Thats more than enough for me to land a follow up shot.

My point in mentioning nova pilots was that the only mechs I see actually trying to twist damage are mechs that lose most of thier armament or mobility by doing so. Nova arms have NO armor whatsoever so rolling that damage in the arms will just get you stripped. and then ct killed from the side since your nose sticks out like nobodies business. The people that SHOULD be rolling it. Dont.

Pugs dont twist. Pugs dont utilize cover. Pugs keep peeking out and getting alphaed in the face. Then they go in the forums and whine and moan about clan mechs being OP. Clan mechs arent op. Stupidity is. Not saying you are stupid, but im going by what I see when I solo drop.

My entire point is The nerf isnt going to do anything. and even if it makes the 50 point alpha build unusable, There are much nastier alternatives with even high alpha.

The game is more than you and your Elo and pug games.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

How many band aid systems are required to "fix" a "problem"?

IF your going to roll with energy draw limitations, this is fine, but remove some of the other band **** like the gauss charge up time, and the energy limitations should apply across the board not just to one or two weapon subsystems.

[xXBagheeraXx]

XX Sulla XX, on 17 July 2014 - 11:49 PM, said:

The game is more than you and your Elo and pug games.

My elo likely sucks. I dont even bother checking my stats and could hardly care. I'm just an average player. I solo most of the time unlike all the big wig competitive players who would be scorned to be in a smaller than 4 man group. I just use a bit of grey matter when i play. That is all. Grey matter seems to be at a premium when i pug.