sneeking, on 27 July 2014 - 07:11 AM, said:
it aint click and forget, unless match maker unbalance has seen fit not to put at least one ecm on the other team then I am in there right up front switching ecm mode to joust that mofo for cecm at same time as blocking lrm from the spammers while doing so I will try to surface long enough to tag laser and fling an lrm5 burn some mL and stream some srm4 out of my 3L's nark port.
you will fail to convince me ecm is broken and unskilled
the fault is with match maker if ecm isn't fairly distributed to each team, if each team has at least one then the fault is with the pilot.
im sorry for my opinion but you won't change it with any argument.
Perhaps the counter argument hasn't been the correct one.
My argument is the ECM feature is a bad mechanic.The current ECM mechanics have caused a number of side effect issues that are in general unhealthy for the game's future.
Firstly: MWo already has a very steep learning curve that makes it difficult for many players to ease into playing.Generaly speaking only players with some patience and resolve stick it through.Learning the "rules" is hard enough for a new player but then we toss in some ECM and many of the basic rules the new guy just learned are out the window and the new guy is left with a total WTF happened experience.The new player's LRMs won't lock...WTF I can't get sensor locks on the enemy ...WTF Why did my NARC stop working...WTF...you get my point.
Next we have the problem with poor choices made for the release schedual of other features that tie directly to ECM.
ECM (Electronic Counter Measures) as it pertains to Battletech and MWo is a purpose built device to prevent the functioning of support electronics on the battle field.
At the time ECM was under development for MWo we had yet to see fully realized support electronics.We had no Artemis a BAP that was pretty much useless for the tonnage and most of the BAP's functions were distributed to sensor enhancement modules anyhow so..doubly useless BAP. No one bothered with the original NARC system it was terrible and TAG was only seen with any amount of frequency in premades with an LRM theme and command consoles were door stops until very recently.
To put it simply the purpose of ECM was not present when ECM was being developed.As such ECM was given functions that were well beyond the scope of what was needed to fill the role ECM was designed for.There was no need to deploy a counter measure for support electronics because we had no real deployment of those items.
The resulting development cycle for information warfare and support electronics became reversed.All the devices ECM was suppose to be a countermeasure for became counter measures for ECM.As a result all the support electronics that should have wide reaching impacts on information warfare and enhancements to combat effectivness were only developed as far as being a counter ECM feature.
Third: As a result of the mad scramble to make ECM's square peg fit into MWo's round hole we ended up with some pretty weird effects that are counter intuative and still even today most of the players can't concieve of how these inter relations effect the game as a whole.
An ECM is counterd by a BAP but only if that BAP is not also mounted on a mech with ECM if this occurs then ECM counters ECM and BAP is pretty much 1.5 tons of ballast. Why? just because ! it was the wholey artificial arbitrary solution to counter counter measures that resulted from BAP being altered to suit the ECM feature.
Inner Sphere Streaks have a 270m max range except when effected by ECM they have no range because ECM magicaly turns Streak launchers into dead weight.But,you can plug in a BAP and counter the ECM and everything is now fine.
Wrong.
ECM still effects the streaks in an adverse way even when "countered" with a BAP.The ECM will prevent any streaks locking on anything within 180m of the ECM unless that ECM is within 150m of the BAP.
So say you are trying to attack a mech 200m away (inside streak range yet outside BAP counter range) and that mech is 100m from a friendly ECM that is opposite the attacking streak launchers.The BAP would need in excess of a 300m counter range to allow the streaks to effect a lock.
So streaks + BAP = useless streaks in this scenario.The player has "paid" the ECM tax by equiping a BAP yet ECM is still "winning"
Or,this example.
Streak + BAP equiped mech is attacking a mech with ECM on board.
I.S. streak range is 270m hostile ECM is 180m BAP counter ECM range is 150m.Doing the math on this example is easy.Even with a BAP installed the ECM has the effect of reducing the streaks max range from 270m down to 150m.The ECM equiped mech is home free if they can get 151m away it doesn't matter if the streaks have a 270m range it's the BAP that is dictating the range because of ECM.
But it gets even weirder.If the ECM equped mech gets to 181m but under 201m the streaks can still lock on because the ECM only prevents detection of a mech by reducing enemy sensor detection ranges by 75%.
The end results are the normal streak range of 0-270m become 0-150m in range 151-200m no locks 201-270 in range.Kinda stupidly convoluted if you ask me.
Sensor range and sensor enhancing modules are another interesting interrelation when exposed to ECM.
Default sensor range on a mech is 800m
Advanced sensor range module adds 25% for a total rang of 800+25%= 1000m or 1 kilometer.
ECM reduces sensor detection range by 75%
ECM effected standard sensors = 200m detection range
ECM effected advanced sensors = 220m detection range.
So let's look at what this means.
ECM+ unaugmented sensors uneffected by ECM = 800m detection range while an opponent attempting to detect this ECM covered mech with advanced sensors has a 220m detection range.
In compareson the ECM grants the best detection ranges rather than the purpose built advanced sensor range module.ECM negates any advantage granted by the module since the detection range differences are 580m in favor of the ECM over the advanced sensors.
NEXT!
LRMs anyone? ask yourself how can we balance LRMs if there is always the random factor of how many if any ECMs are available to each team along with how many if any LRMs are available to each team then look at what map what Elo range what mechs in use Inner Sphere or Clan tech LRMs how much AMS per team is it the solo queue or group queue....No other weapon system has this many outlaying factors determining how effective the weapon system is.
Ultimatley ECM has done more to obfuscate useful data collection than it has helped balance LRM features.
Next..
ECM has a disproportionate effect on puggies as opposed to effects for teams using comms.Any feature that has differing effects based on team format is probably poorly designed.
If a puggie sees an ECM mech moving in a particular direction they need to type all the intel like mech type,location and heading.Typing kitfox in B3 heading B4 takes more time and attention than simply saying it.
In the solo queue ECM is super potent with groups the ECM is a powerful tool that needs to be used correctly.You can DERP around in the solo queue with an ECM mech and still significantly contribute to a victory simply because you showed up.Because of this I feel ECM is a poorly designed feature as it stands now.
So,as you can see my argument isn't ECM is OP! NERF NERF NERF
It is based on use of the feature reflection on it's function and realization that it's clumbsy counter intuative and lacks quality of design compared to other areas of the game.
We stand to gain a great deal of depth if ECM was properly designed with a interlated information warfare mechanic that reinforces role warfare and enhances aspects of mech and community warfare.
Edited by Lykaon, 27 July 2014 - 04:48 PM.