39 replies to this topic

[Aidan]

Here is a video from Cloud Imperium Games the creators of the newly emerging Space Sim Star Citizen. CIG will include dynamic time of day on all of their planet side maps!

Why does MWO not include Dynamic Time of Day on at least some of their maps? Does CIG know something MWO does not?

[Joseph Mallan]

Cool.

[cSand]

****, I'd be happy if they just slammed out a bunch of the maps we already have but at a different time of day / different weather.

INSTANT VARIETY

[LawDawg]

cSand, on 28 July 2014 - 12:02 PM, said:

****, I'd be happy if they just slammed out a bunch of the maps we already have but at a different time of day / different weather.

INSTANT VARIETY

Yes this! Please STOP working on HERO and CHAMPION mechs along with patterns and colors. Focus on the COREl IE.Maps,CW, etc; that's been a long time coming.

[Clit Beastwood]

SLDF LawDog, on 28 July 2014 - 12:20 PM, said:

Yes this! Please STOP working on HERO and CHAMPION mechs along with patterns and colors. Focus on the COREl IE.Maps,CW, etc; that's been a long time coming.

They're different teams. One doesn't affect the other.

[Jabilo]

We know that no resources have been given to maps for a long time.

Russ announced in the last VLOG that they would rush out a couple of half finished maps, but we will not get any truly innovative maps for a long while.

However in the FAR future (if the game runs that long) I think we have the potential to see some very exciting maps. For example, dynamic weather and time of day, destructible terrain etc.

[CeeKay Boques]

Fierostetz, on 28 July 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

They're different teams. One doesn't affect the other.

Trim one, buff the other.

[Aidan]

I may be wrong in this assumption but because MWO is a Free to Play game, the design approach for PGI is to design the game so computers that are multiple generations behind the tech curve can still play MWO. This means designing the game for Core 2 Duo systems and the associated outdated GPU cards.

The additional load of calculating dynamic shadows on an MWO map would cause older systems to bog down. This would, in PGI and more influentially IGP (aka the publisher of MWO) eyes be a bad thing for the corporate bottom line profit.

But is this fair to the players investing in the most recent technology? They would love to see some more of the amazing graphical things CryENGINE can do!

This profit oriented publisher/design studio relationship tends to not deliver the best game as the publisher must weigh Return On Investment or ROI versus the cost of creating game features.

[Henree]

Fierostetz, on 28 July 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

They're different teams. One doesn't affect the other.

there doesn' t appear to be a map team. hell until two and a half days ago there was no community warfare team.

Aidan, on 28 July 2014 - 01:14 PM, said:

I may be wrong in this assumption but because MWO is a Free to Play game, the design approach for PGI is to design the game so computers that are multiple generations behind the tech curve can still play MWO. This means designing the game for Core 2 Duo systems and the associated outdated GPU cards.

The additional load of calculating dynamic shadows on an MWO map would cause older systems to bog down. This would, in PGI and more influentially IGP (aka the publisher of MWO) eyes be a bad thing for the corporate bottom line profit.

But is this fair to the players investing in the most recent technology? They would love to see some more of the amazing graphical things CryENGINE can do!

This profit oriented publisher/design studio relationship tends to not deliver the best game as the publisher must weigh Return On Investment or ROI versus the cost of creating game features.

I would say the ROI of star citizen is quite good, you just need balls and not cater to the masses. Like any great artist, specialize in yourself until you are so unique that you attract many fans.

[DaZur]

If I remember correctly MW:O originally had dynamic shadowing but it apparently had too many draw-calls and taxed the budget too harshly... I believe we run with baked shadows now and as such, Dynamic TOD would not be possible...

That said, IMHO cycling TOD would make every map feel different with every TOD iteration... Would be cool.

Edited by DaZur, 28 July 2014 - 03:15 PM.

[Corbenik]

aren't the maps constant not like 11 minute matches meaning they are always on and available to land whenever you feel like and stay there for however long?

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

Considering that most if not all battles happen within a 15 to 20min time span, having any reference to perceived movement of light or shadows is a moot point.

This is in reference to what we see in our 24hr day span only, if a location (planet or other) had a rather faster spin ratio this may be something to consider in the future. (possible asteroid or orbital location)

Now with this in mind I would still like to see the time of day/night altered for the locations we have now. Set up 3 or 4 random day and night sky changes, depending on the systems sun colour, early morning, evening and mid day should be some of the changes that can be altered for each map. (they are all available within the CryEngine)
- Adding overcast, clear, storm weathers may have some effects on in game 'atmosphere' for the Pilots and reduce visibility from the current 'all seeing' maps we have now.
(fog is a really big hit for some lower end machines, but Dx11 has some really great effects for this.)
- Changing the skyline to (what we know) early morning pink/orange and evening reds could add some 'immersion' for the players, an alter the same old repeated maps we have now.

- Still hard to believe that PGI has not introduced a persistent map setting that reduces the visibility below 500mtrs and requires Pilots to actually use there sensors and tactics during battles.
- We have at least 3 maps that are on the waters edge yet never any fog, mist, or smoke produced from thermal inversions, temperature changes, or very hot Mech's fighting in or around this material.

Tactically, two of the best times to conduct an attack or assault is 'first and last light', when the eyes are adjusting between colour and grey (night) vision. Vision sensors now start to play key roles in who see's whom first.

Side note:
PGI (Karl) has stated they have a complete set of above normal graphics designed for this current game, we currently only have 1K levels, they have 4K assets available. These should be made available for those that can run them, call it a 'high definition pack'.

9erRed

[Bhael Fire]

DaZur, on 28 July 2014 - 01:56 PM, said:

If I remember correctly MW:O originally had dynamic shadowing but it apparently had too many draw-calls and taxed buget... I believe we run with baked shadows now and as such, Dynamic TOD would not be possible...

Yep. All environment lights in MWO are baked into the level to improve frame rates. The only dynamic lights are on the characters (i.e. mechs) and certain fx (i.e. like lasers).

Also, given that matches are only 15 minutes or less in public matches, there's no point in having day-night cycles.

[Vassago Rain]

Cryengine can do this natively.
It's just for whatever reason, PGI's turned it off.

[Clit Beastwood]

Technoviking, on 28 July 2014 - 12:24 PM, said:

Trim one, buff the other.

That's... what... she... said?

[DaZur]

Bhael Fire, on 28 July 2014 - 02:47 PM, said:

Also, given that matches are only 15 minutes or less in public matches, there's no point in having day-night cycles.

I don't think a TOD cycle for the duration of a match is necessary... That said, a random TOD for the maps we have would at least make them feel slightly different...

You know... when we get the luxury of dropping on Tourmaline 5 times in a row... It might be nice if they all weren't "mid-day".

[kuangmk11]

I want a map with a 5 minute day!

Seriously though bake the shadows in for 3 or 4 different times of day (night, twilight, day) have 3 or 4 different sets of spawns, bases, turrets, caps etc and put in some weather variation. Then make some with different brush tweaks (pull the boat back out of forest, collapse the deck in crimson, bomb out river city more, flood canyon etc. That would go a long way to make the game fell less stagnant.

[Creovex]

cSand, on 28 July 2014 - 12:02 PM, said:

****, I'd be happy if they just slammed out a bunch of the maps we already have but at a different time of day / different weather.

INSTANT VARIETY

My memory may be off but this was suppose to happen in closed beta.... they did it for River City and Forest and stated night / day and weather we're going to be put in but it seemed like they fizzled out on their rush to go live.

Edited by Creovex, 28 July 2014 - 03:39 PM.

[verybad]

Fierostetz, on 28 July 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

They're different teams. One doesn't affect the other.

Except they took the Map people off maps while they were concentrating on clan mechs...so, not really.

[RedDragon]

kuangmk11, on 28 July 2014 - 03:31 PM, said:

I want a map with a 5 minute day!

Seriously though bake the shadows in for 3 or 4 different times of day (night, twilight, day) have 3 or 4 different sets of spawns, bases, turrets, caps etc and put in some weather variation. Then make some with different brush tweaks (pull the boat back out of forest, collapse the deck in crimson, bomb out river city more, flood canyon etc. That would go a long way to make the game fell less stagnant.

This idea is as old as Closed Beta. I remember opening a Thread back then titled "Dynamic maps". The idea was to have versions of existing maps with small changes, like a bridge that is destroyed in one version, altering the routes while retaining the original feel of the map. Ideally, the players would only know that they dropped on the map, but not on which version, giving scouts a reason for existence because they would have had to determine which routes were passable etc. before the main host could advance.
The feedback on that thread was immense and positive and it seems the Devs were influenced through it (Garth hinted at this), but the only thing that came off it was Frozen City Night (or was it Forest Snow? Can't remember which one came first).
So yeah, it gave us at least some variation, but not nearly as much as could have been, sadly.