90 replies to this topic

[Pjwned]

Gyrok, on 29 July 2014 - 10:11 PM, said:

Because you like them...because they are fast...because they scout better...because it takes FAR more skill and you like the challenge,...

Pick a reason...but they should not be equal...EVER.

They need to be fast because they have so little armor, if you're saying they should be 40 KPH slower and that you apparently want a tier system where assault mechs are just better then that seems silly and a little out of place for this game.

Of course light mechs should have less armor and firepower than an assault mech, but if they weren't just as viable in the right hands then why bother playing them? You say that light mechs should just be worse than assault mechs and then ignore how little sense that makes because nobody would play light mechs then.

I'm not saying that light mechs should excel even in the hands of a poor pilot, but if they didn't even have the potential to be as good as every other mech then, again, there wouldn't really be much reason to play them.

[TB Freelancer]

Pjwned, on 29 July 2014 - 08:55 PM, said:

I would like to see clan gauss rifles toned down slightly, whether it be more explosion damage when critically hit or a very slight increase in charge time or something like that, because as of now it's just objectively better than IS gauss rifles.

They perform exactly the same and PGI balanced them by limiting their use to certain mechs by locking crit spaces on clan mechs.

Khobai, on 29 July 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

Then theres no reason to play a light or medium mech. Ever. So your reasoning is obviously flawed.

Light and medium mechs should be as good as heavies and assaults, because they all occupy an equal spot on the team.

I can dig up dozens, dozens upon dozens of screenshots where I scored several hundred damage and racked up 5 to 7 kills and I'm not all that great a light pilot. Count the truly great pilots who've done it in matches I've been in and I can produce hundreds if not thousands of examples of a light pilot being one of the best players in a match.

Lights have a much higher skill requirement but they have fantastic potential IN THE RIGHT HANDS.

Thing is a lot of really awful pilots are in them . They shouldn't stand in front of a Dire Wolf directly facing it to engage. I swear I've easily killed a hundreds ECM spiders who did exactly that before they ever lined up their shots. They like to pop out of cover, stand stock still a few hundred meters out, take a second to line up their shot and BAM. free kill for me if he pops out in the same location more than once because I'll be watching and charging up in anticipation of him popping out again.

A good light pilot is damned near impossible to hit at range, even tough to hit close up. They know how to keep moving, stay erratic, fire while moving, twist like crazy while their weapons are cooling or the mech is. I know when I'm had and if a good light gets me in the open in the wrong mech/build, I'm done and they know it....

...bad light pilots are absolutely awesome for padding my stats.

Edited by TB Freelancer, 29 July 2014 - 10:31 PM.

[Pjwned]

TB Freelancer, on 29 July 2014 - 10:31 PM, said:

They perform exactly the same and PGI balanced them by limiting their use to certain mechs by locking crit spaces on clan mechs.

They perform the same while being lighter and taking up less space than their Inner Sphere counterpart, and I don't agree that mech quirks balance it out because to me it seems pretty clear that's an attempt to balance the mech itself that might otherwise be too powerful, the clan gauss rifle should have a small drawback and not just "oh this is better" which also breaks the theme of other clan balancing factors such as longer beam duration for lasers.

[Wispsy]

Gyrok, on 29 July 2014 - 10:11 PM, said:

Because you like them...because they are fast...because they scout better...because it takes FAR more skill and you like the challenge,...

Pick a reason...but they should not be equal...EVER.

Well that is stupid when PGI is trying to enforce 3/3/3/3 on the population...

Balance is important when each individual only gets a single slot and a single life. If they should not be equal give lights and mediums multiple respawns or greater numbers on the battlefield. Else it is just a dumb mechanic. Like literally, not intelligent or thought through to any extent at all. Any one of the most successful pvp games will tell you this without a moments hesitation.

I mean if you are the first to say they should not be equal...I think you should be the first one who has to play a light mech for the majority of your games because it does not matter right? That is just how it is meant to be?
Oh right...you would not do that...because you can only play assaults....I wonder why that is........

Edited by Wispsy, 30 July 2014 - 01:12 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

It's the combination of Gauss (two or more together) or Gauss and other high alpha weapons like PPCs fired together that makes the weapon seem overpowered.

I have run just one Gauss rifle in a mech before. It is not any more crazy then any other weapon.

[Willard Phule]

TB Freelancer, on 29 July 2014 - 10:31 PM, said:

They perform exactly the same and PGI balanced them by limiting their use to certain mechs by locking crit spaces on clan mechs.



I can dig up dozens, dozens upon dozens of screenshots where I scored several hundred damage and racked up 5 to 7 kills and I'm not all that great a light pilot. Count the truly great pilots who've done it in matches I've been in and I can produce hundreds if not thousands of examples of a light pilot being one of the best players in a match.

Lights have a much higher skill requirement but they have fantastic potential IN THE RIGHT HANDS.

Thing is a lot of really awful pilots are in them . They shouldn't stand in front of a Dire Wolf directly facing it to engage. I swear I've easily killed a hundreds ECM spiders who did exactly that before they ever lined up their shots. They like to pop out of cover, stand stock still a few hundred meters out, take a second to line up their shot and BAM. free kill for me if he pops out in the same location more than once because I'll be watching and charging up in anticipation of him popping out again.

A good light pilot is damned near impossible to hit at range, even tough to hit close up. They know how to keep moving, stay erratic, fire while moving, twist like crazy while their weapons are cooling or the mech is. I know when I'm had and if a good light gets me in the open in the wrong mech/build, I'm done and they know it....

...bad light pilots are absolutely awesome for padding my stats.

This. Right here. And it doesn't just apply to Lights.

If you're one of those pilots that simply can't shoot without stopping and zooming in, then every weapon in the game is OP to you. Mobility is life....even if that mobility is rather slow. A moving target is MUCH harder to hit than a stationary...especially when you have to hold a laser on something or you're trying to lead it with a PPC or Gauss rifle.

[meteorol]

Gyrok, on 29 July 2014 - 10:06 PM, said:

and they should be 40 kph slower.

Khobai, on 29 July 2014 - 10:08 PM, said:

Of course they should be as good they occupy an equal slot on the team.

If theyre not as good why play them?

Gyrok, on 29 July 2014 - 10:11 PM, said:

...because they are fast...

[Wolfways]

Pjwned, on 29 July 2014 - 08:55 PM, said:

I would like to see clan gauss rifles toned down slightly, whether it be more explosion damage when critically hit or a very slight increase in charge time or something like that, because as of now it's just objectively better than IS gauss rifles.

Erm...it's supposed to be better.
You can't compare clan and IS weapons individually, you need to take the whole mech into account. The clan chassis were nerfed senseless but their weapons were left slightly better than IS weapons...if you can use them well enough.

[DarthPeanut]

I wish we could stop trying to nerf everything into us all running around with machine guns.

The gauss is not OP. It is a huge crit risk and explodes when damaged. Has the charge mechanic to fire. Heaviest weapon in game and uses a large number of slots. It does 15 dmg and requires a steady shot with limited ammo supply... risk/ reward type weapon just like it is supposed to be.

Edited by DarthPeanut, 30 July 2014 - 05:16 AM.

[Lala Satalin Deviluke]

Actually regarding to it's projectile speed+accuracy G00ss Rifle is UNDERPOWERED, it should have more chance to bring critical inner damage than any other ballistic weapon or even PPC/ERPPC.

[John1352]

@OP: Averaging 3 kills per match, in the correct ELO bucket, means your mech/weapons are OP.

If everyone on your team gets one kill, you win. In fact, you should be going UP in ELO any time you're getting 3 kills per match, unless you're just finishing off mechs, as your kills make your team more likely to win.

[Khobai]

Quote

. In fact, you should be going UP in ELO any time you're getting 3 kills per match, unless you're just finishing off mechs, as your kills make your team more likely to win.

haha i wish. you have no idea how many games i play where I get like 5 kills and my idiot team still finds a way to lose.

[Ngamok]

Jazzbandit1313, on 29 July 2014 - 07:16 PM, said:

P.S. that was only partially sarcastic

Well well, what happened to all the Gauss charge up mechanics means this weapon is horrible threads? Yea, all those people who kept complaining about it are now thinking, OMG nerf Gauss + PPC Dire Wolfs now.

[B E E L Z E B U B]

im a very big fan of the GAUSS, im also a very big fan of the DW.

easily one of the best builds in game is the dual ppc dual gauss build for the DW.

its so easy and so good that ive decided not to use it anymore.
i may be a bit odd, but i dont get much satisfaction knowing that im beating everyone using an insanely OP build.
i mean.. 50 damage on pinpoint??? really? then why cant stalkers shoot 5 PPCs at once?

the only nerf id like to see, possibly, is an insane ghost heat penalty for firing 2 PPCs with 2 GAUSS at the same time.

other than that... leave the poor thing alone.

too much nerfing nowadays.

Edited by Karma Police, 30 July 2014 - 06:28 AM.

[Lala Satalin Deviluke]

Karma Police, on 30 July 2014 - 06:26 AM, said:

too much nerfing nowadays.

[Angel of Annihilation]

The Charge Up makes them pretty awful. I tried adding a Gauss to one of my Timber Wolf builds and I found myself so distracted by trying to charge, hold and fire the gauss rifle, that I forgot to use the 5 MLS and 3 SRM6s that made up the bulk of my firepower. I ended up removing it from my build and have not looked back other that wistfully wishing Gauss Rifles worked like the used to.

Anyway, since that godawful mechanic was introduced I have pretty much removed all the Gauss Rifles from my builds though I will likely try a dual gauss build on my Dire Wolf just because it is one of the few mechs that it might make sense on and only then due to heat. I would much perfer UAC/20s for the weight but when your trying to cool 50 tons of weapons, you can't mount enough DHS to cool them without using Gauss Rifles as your primary weapons.

Actually that brings up a good point. It isn't the gauss rifle that is an issue because in general they kind of suck right now. Rather it is the fact that for the Dire Wolf, there really is no other option but Gauss Rifles due to the heat mechanics currently in game. Basically you can mount a semi-sucky weapon and have decent heat management or you can mount a bunch of other weapons and either can't fire half of them or overheat every 5 seconds, your choice.

[Jazzbandit1313]

All you people saying that the charge mechanic makes the gauss terrible clearly haven't used the weapon enough to get used to it and learn to love it like i have. WE HAVE BECOME UNFOCUSED.

WE NEED ENERGY WEAPON NERFS DURING AND AFTER CHARGING AND FIRING A GAUSS RIFLE OR TWO. this will solve all pinpoint gauss+PPC problems IMO. like i said in original post, during and 2 seconds after charge and fire, nerf energy weapon damage by 25%-50% This makes sense, as the gauss rifles pull so much energy from the reactor, there is less energy for other weapons to function. I mean heck, even a SLIGHT SPEED DECREASE OF THE MECH WOULD BE GREAT.

[Xyroc]

No the Gauss is not OP.

Jazzbandit1313, on 30 July 2014 - 07:06 AM, said:

All you people saying that the charge mechanic makes the gauss terrible clearly haven't used the weapon enough to get used to it and learn to love it like i have.

Very true

Jazzbandit1313, on 30 July 2014 - 07:06 AM, said:

nerf energy weapon damage by 25%-50%

No way ... it has been said time and time again its convergence not the weapons.

Edited by Beliall, 30 July 2014 - 07:17 AM.

[DONTOR]

There a more cons than the ones ou thought of and they arent as straight forward or obvious. When you bring clan mechs into consideration you cant simply lose 10-15KPH and apply dual gauss, you have to make SERIOUS sacrifices to do it on a clan 75 ton mech, and is impossible on every chassis lighter (Summoner) and less. So my clan 70 ton mech cant have dual gauss but any of your I.S. 65 ton and up mechs can easily get dual gauss + backup weapons.

[process]

The gauss rifle is in a good enough place right now.