950 replies to this topic

[Smargl]

Grayson Pryde, on 08 August 2014 - 02:49 AM, said:

Well i couldnt laugh more about the whinning clan-purchasers here. Thats why i N.O.P.E.ed. Seriously guys, if you cry this hard about 2 weapon changes there must be an issue with the weapons. Yes, the changes are dumb and PGI knows **** about balancing but you realise this now? I mean - comon, the game isnt out since yesterday. There are still plenty of weapons left. If 2 weapon-changes realy woudl affect you so much you should think about your approach to the game.

It's not about weapon changes, it's about how PGI make them. This nerfs looks kinda childish, as they don't want to think at all.

[Grayson Pryde]

Smargl, on 08 August 2014 - 02:53 AM, said:

It's not about weapon changes, it's about how PGI make them. This nerfs looks kinda childish, as they don't want to think at all.

ANd as i said, its not since yesterday that they screw up the balance and dont listening to the community. I am not a fan of ghost heat at all but all other approaches to "boating" were constantly ignored.

[Jakob Knight]

WintermuteOmega, on 08 August 2014 - 02:15 AM, said:

PPC-Nerf was Long overdue and i appreciate the changes.
Ever been hit by Dual-Gauss/Dual PPC? No fun.

Every weapon should have pros and cons, and pinpoint weapons were always much more dangerous than DOT-weapons.

Here's a news bulletin in case you simply didn't actually understand the weapons system you are talking about.

PPCs - Pros: long range, no ammo requirement, low crit space requirement.
Cons: Unbalancable heat generation to the point of shutting down any mech in a few uses, only medium damage, projectile speed allows long-range targets to avoid the shots, standard version has minimum range.

There -were- checks and balances. Now, the projectile speed allows -mid- range targets to avoid the shots, and the primary damage source in the configuration you cited (the Gauss Rifle) remains unchanged.

No, the PPCs were balanced where they should have been, and all this does is penalize units that weren't using them with other weapons in synch.

Edited by Jakob Knight, 08 August 2014 - 02:57 AM.

[Mister Blastman]

Not to defend PGI or anything... Because I stand by there being a better way to balance all this mess with re-coding broken systems... But if they had left the CERLL the way it was after the PPC nerf, the Clans would primarily use the CERLL to slaughter the IS.

Basically the only thing worthwhile the IS has to bring to the table vs. Clan is PP FLD and if the main component of delivery is nerfed pretty hard like the PPC just has been (they're a good bid more dodgeable now), the IS stood to be in big trouble.

BUT--it isn't the best way to go about all this. The best way would have been to re-code the convergence system or up the number of torso hitboxes from three to eighteen or twenty seven. Also, adding in projectile weapons inheriting firing 'mech vector and velocity would be a big improvement, too.

Ah well, get ready for Gauss... lots of gauss and PPC + AC 10 / AC 20 spam.

[Galaxy Crusader Puppeteer]

Adapt. Its been the way of online games mmo's to go trough many balance changes.

[Jacob Side]

In Conclusion

We've made two Weapon Systems pointless

Edited by Jacob Side, 08 August 2014 - 03:07 AM.

[Noth]

CL7K20, on 08 August 2014 - 02:59 AM, said:

Adapt. Its been the way of online games mmo's to go trough many balance changes.

People will adapt, that does not mean it is not a heavy handed or poor change though.

Edited by Noth, 08 August 2014 - 03:10 AM.

[Frodo1911]

Fine....keep it and watch how short a time it takes to find a match....wont be long because no one will be there any more.

[Vehemens]

Just remember guys,

LRMs carry 180 missiles a ton of ammo, arc over 8/10 game structures, anymore than 5 in one volley is guaranteed to get through even triple AMS, and we're nerfing weapons that require line of sight and aiming.

PGI just nerfed the first effective counter to LRM boats they've had for years.

[sizz0r]

I guess people will adapt to the new ppc speed, we need to wait and test it (still don't like it).

The thing is that this will change nothing at close range battles for gauss/ppc. People will still get killed by high pin point daishi alpha's. The desync will fail this way, in my opinion that mechanic every body hates is still the better solution to avoid the high alphas on every range. 1-2 sec cd between this weapons should work if there really is the need to desync them. (also don't like it )

[N E R E V A R]

ReXspec, on 07 August 2014 - 08:32 PM, said:

This is a sick joke.

There was a metric f**k-ton of intelligent, positive, and intuitive feedback given here and you're telling us that you guys up at P.G.I. decided to go with your own decision with the supposed blessing of "competitive" players?

So who, pray tell, were the players, Niko? The clowns up in CSJ? Or your white-knights in NGNG?

Wow... well, I guess I'll be getting my money back this coming week.

Us clowns in csj do not support the nerf. But it might be our fault that they're getting nerfed.

[Nebelfeuer]

The speed of the ppc "projectile" was allready to slow - this is........
How about fixing weapon convergence or preventing pinpoint builds by limiting customisation options for a change instead of breaking working weaponmechanics? That would make to much sense I guess...

Edited by Nebelfeuer, 08 August 2014 - 03:13 AM.

[Flapdrol]

You forgot to nerf the clan lpl and medium laser paul.

more nerfs please.

And clan pack buyers, don't worry, pgi will eventually bring out something overpowered for real money again, like they did with the ilya, dragonslayer and ember.

[Vehemens]

We have ONE MECH IN THE ENTIRE GAME THAT CAN RUN DUAL GAUSS DUAL PPC AND NOT BE A GLASS CANNON.

Clearly we must nerf the weapons.

[The Bad Charlie]

Ok. I was all over the place regarding the CERLL too.

But then i did this numbers:

Currently:

2 CERPPC=30 Heat-->7.5 HPS
2 CERLL=17 H -->3.57 HPS
3 CERLL=30.09 H -->6.33 HPS
4 CERLL=46.2 H -->9.73 HPS

After the nerfmageddon:

2 CERLL=26.64 H -->5.07 HPS
3 CERLL=46.44 H -->8.85 HPS
4 CERLL=68.4 H -->13.03 HPS

Bad, but not unusable.

But charlie, the 2LL Kitfox is destroyed!!!

Is it? Lets see.

A common KFX build has a 2.09h/s dissipation rate. With the current lasers, you can be firing aprox. 60% of the time and stay neutral. After the change, you're gonna be able to fire 40% of the time. That scenario is not that terrible TBH.

[Flapdrol]

The Bad Charlie, on 08 August 2014 - 03:16 AM, said:

But charlie, the 2LL Kitfox is destroyed!!!

Is it? Lets see.

A common KFX build has a 2.09h/s dissipation rate. With the current lasers, you can be firing aprox. 60% of the time and stay neutral. After the change, you're gonna be able to fire 40% of the time. That scenario is not that terrible TBH.

Ghost heat only triggers if you fire the second laser within half a second, could do full damage in 2.5 seconds if you time it perfectly.

[Texas Merc]

Vehemens, on 08 August 2014 - 03:14 AM, said:

We have ONE MECH IN THE ENTIRE GAME THAT CAN RUN DUAL GAUSS DUAL PPC AND NOT BE A GLASS CANNON.

Clearly we must nerf the weapons.

thats behind a paywall

sperg much?

[Jin Ma]

good on you for listening to feedback about PPC speed.

what makes no sense what so ever is why the clan ERPPC is faster than the IS PPCs. when the clan one is the one being pared up with gauss.

It makes no sense to be nerfing the IS more than the clan at this point.

Edited by Jin Ma, 08 August 2014 - 03:22 AM.

[Iqfish]

[Naduk]

despite most the noise in this thread
these numbers look good

the cERLL was way way way to over powered in regards to its ability to be stacked up
ive seen way to many timber/dire-wolfs with 6-8+ cERLL getting around, a ripe target for flamers you might think, but no they ignore my fire starter with 3x flamers... flat out ignore it and continue firing, all the other hot weapon build mechs are forced to choose to take that next shot and over heat or try and evade when flamers are used

these changes make the cERLL more effective in the hands of skilled players that can hold a target and more in line IS LL heat ramps

i am looking forward to seeing how the meta evolves after this