45 replies to this topic

[FindersWeepers]

To all who read this original post, congrats


Allow me to be real.

Stop paying/playing

if the devs truly only want money, this ought to do it.

Edited by Sep, 12 August 2014 - 03:45 PM.

[CocoaJin]

Spend money

[Davers]

Too bad PGI considers it's 'core player base' to be the ones interested in Esports instead of the players who want a military based CW campaign.

[Zervziel]

Sep, on 12 August 2014 - 03:30 PM, said:

1. Give good feedback, positive and negative.

Kinda hard to remain postive when they pull BS supernerfs like the ClanERLL nerf that noone ever asked for.

Quote

2. encourage an atmosphere of respect and politeness, one that creates incentive for devs and players to communicate and work together

Quote

3. Realize that the Devs may choose to ignore or pay attention to our feedback, and be able to accept both choices.

Except the devs only listen to feedback when the most enraged players swim over from the island to complain about the state of the game.

Quote

4. Avoid non-productive forum posts, and ones that blatantly insult the devs/other players.

Avoid K-town at all cost then

Quote

5. play the game, and give feedback based on PERSONAL experience.

The last time I did, it was to discover firing four large laserssimultaneously basically gave my Dire Whale a heart attack.

Quote

But you may say, Sep! why should we listen to your scrub a**?
While I haven't played this game for a long time, I have played
a LOT of games, free to play and otherwise. Over the
course of time, I have found that the respect and feedback
that the community and the devs show and give to each other will make
or break a game.While PGI has had a checkered past (Understatement)
I believe that with some goodwill on both sides, and the interests of the
core player base in mind, we together can make this game great!

Thank you for your time!.
-Sep

Don't worry. Soon the whiteness of your armor will become a nice green as you get more and more jaded with PGI's and other forumite's shenanigans.

[pwnface]

History has shown that the developers of this game don't read these forums. I envy your optimism and naivete regarding the direction of this game and the chance our feedback will even be heard.

CocoaJin, on 12 August 2014 - 03:35 PM, said:

Spend money

Actually, probably the opposite of this so certain PGI staff wake up and realize they are doing something wrong.

[FindersWeepers]

Zervziel, on 12 August 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

Kinda hard to remain postive when they pull BS supernerfs like the ClanERLL nerf that noone ever asked for.







Except the devs only listen to feedback when the most enraged players swim over from the island to complain about the state of the game.



Avoid K-town at all cost then



The last time I did, it was to discover firing four large laserssimultaneously basically gave my Dire Whale a heart attack.



Don't worry. Soon the whiteness of your armor will become a nice green as you get more and more jaded with PGI's and other forumite's shenanigans.

I've been here a while, and know about the disrespect that has been shown to the playerbase. I am simply asking people to be polite and respectful. and if the devs decide to continue throwing s*** at us, then they will watch their game die. It's that simple.

[-Natural Selection-]

quit complaining every time something kills you 2 times.

[Sandpit]

stop paying them for something you don't agree with if you don't. that will help them know what direction to take MWO in order to make money

[Henree]

Quote

Foster says, "For me, the key to crowdfunding is that there are gamers out there who want to engage with content creators. They want to engage with developers. They have good ideas themselves. They want to be a part of this process. Right now, they're going in through mechanisms like Kickstarter. At IGP, we've demonstrated that an independent company can also run a program that can be very successful. This is the next level, if you like, of customer engagement. The closer you can get to your customers, the more they're willing to embrace your products and invest in them."

Quote

It will involve demonstrating to your potential players or customers that you are able to make that product, that you have a track record. Then it will involve treating the customers as if they are investors in your product. At that point, that's what they are. To some extent, the companies that can manage those steps are also likely the groups that are going to be successful with the funds that they raise."

http://www.gamasutra...Kickstarter.php

[verybad]

Can't do anything to either help or hinder them. They're making the game they want to make, and more than enough good ideas have been ignored here for it to be a waste of time to thing they would care.

[pwnface]

This is my favorite part:

"At IGP, we've demonstrated that an independent company can also run a program that can be very successful. This is the next level, if you like, of customer engagement. The closer you can get to your customers, the more they're willing to embrace your products and invest in them."

IGP bought an IP that has a particularly loyal fanbase which is the only reason this game is still alive. Their "next level ... of customer engagement" is IGNORE.

[TLBFestus]

Quote

But you may say, Sep! why should we listen to your scrub a**?
While I haven't played this game for a long time, I have played
a LOT of games, free to play and otherwise. Over the
course of time, I have found that the respect and feedback
that the community and the devs show and give to each other will make
or break a game.While PGI has had a checkered past (Understatement)
I believe that with some goodwill on both sides, and the interests of the
core player base in mind, we together can make this game great!
Thank you for your time!.
-Sep

The underlying problem with this statement is the PGI had tons of Goodwill with the community back in the day, but then they burned it all to the ground by making controversial decisions, letting an idiot insult the community (well, more than one actually), and mining for cash to the detriment of content.

I'm not about to "forgive and forget" 18 months of BS because they have had a 6 month stretch of relative competence. Talk to me in a year, and if they are exemplary we will be back to "zero".

Edited by TLBFestus, 12 August 2014 - 04:29 PM.

[CocoaJin]

pwnface, on 12 August 2014 - 03:36 PM, said:

Actually, probably the opposite of this so certain PGI staff wake up and realize they are doing something wrong.

Sadly, if their income shrinks the simplest and easiest path executives come up with to save the ship is to try and increase sales. Fear tends to think and operate very short term. PGI will be pushed to put more resources into revenue generating activities, leaving other development on the back burner. Not until they've satiated their fear of where the next dollar will come, will they take a deep breath, exhale, clear their minds and begin to think more long term.

If we punish PGI too severely with our dollars...especially long-term, the execs will eventually shut the project down. Then we've basically cut off our nose to spite our face because we allowed our paranoia to assume PGI only wants our money and has no intention of developing this game as they initially stated as a desire. PGI doesn't just want our dollars, but they have to reach a certain comfort zone of regular income before they can really spread their wings and develop this game like we all want...player and developer.

We have to support these guys, emotionally and financially...or we lose em and our beloved MechWarrior gaming for years yet again...maybe a decade or more. We have to continue to communicate with them, voice our concerns, but also remain patient and mature about the realities of game development in a business environment and accept that the success of the game is inherently based on where and how the game develops for years to cone, not just were we see it today. We can't let fear of what ever cause us to operate on the same short-sighted level such that we sabotage the very thing we want by creating a cycle of self-destructive behavior.

So yeah, we need to spend money. Spend money on what we like. Let them know what we won't spend money on, and advise them where the game needs to go to get more money out of us.

[CocoaJin]

verybad, on 12 August 2014 - 04:13 PM, said:

Can't do anything to either help or hinder them. They're making the game they want to make, and more than enough good ideas have been ignored here for it to be a waste of time to thing they would care.

I don't think ideas are outright ignored. We've seen that they actually act on some ideas, but it takes time...a long time. This isn't due to a lack of trying or desire...no more than the desire of a captain of a super-tanker who would love to turn his ship around to save a person in distress...the issue is that for something so big and complex, it takes miles and lots of time to deviate from course.

Just because it took 3miles and 30mins to make the turn, doesn't mean the crew wasn't doing everything they could to make the change. So we shouldnt be too hard on the devs and then ignore the fact they have made changes based on our suggestions, just because it takes 6months or mores for it to come to fruition...that's just how long it takes to turn the ship.

[verybad]

I've seen much larger games turn quicker. Believe me, I've been mroe than willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, but the game simply moves forward at a pace that almost feels backwards. It no longer feels exciting.

The most terrible thing I feel abotu this game is that the developers don't seem to be enjoying themselves. It's not exciting to them, and that feeds over to us.

It's a job for them, not a passion. Now I can't blame anyone for feeling that way about their job, hell knows I feel that way about my job, but if you're dealing with the public, well it is visible.

The IP is something many here have been with for 20+ years (I certainly have) It's a part of our lives. This thing is quite frankly, STILL feeling half baked.

That new hero Aniki or whatever, look at it, it looks like someone got a project they had to do by a certain time, it got done, and ...no excitement. We're not involved at all, and I really think the developers could find their excitement back if they DID get more involved with us.Includign letting us develop content (they could chouse to use it or not)

[Spike Brave]

It's not the devs. Blaming them is like yelling at a cashier a fast food place over price or policy changes.(This isn't meant as an insult, I just can't think of a better comparison right now.) They don't have any control over what happens. They are just following the directives of the owners.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Sandpit, on 12 August 2014 - 03:47 PM, said:

stop paying them for something you don't agree with if you don't. that will help them know what direction to take MWO in order to make money

Won't work unfortunately.

Soon as people stop paying them, they are just going to shut off the servers and call it a day. They will say that it just isn't worth spending further money on development without a sufficient player base. Never in a million years will they think, "Gosh, maybe we should have listened to the community. Let's start doing that now, invest another 10-20 million dollars, redesign the game and see how it goes".

Eventually if we are lucky, PGI will give up the license and maybe, just maybe another publisher/developer will come in and design us the Mechwarrior/Battletech game we have all been waiting for.

[Henree]

not with MechWarrior tactics being such a huge success!

https://www.mwtactics.com/

[TLBFestus]

CocoaJin, on 12 August 2014 - 04:27 PM, said:

We have to support these guys, emotionally and financially...

No, no NO, 1000x NO.

It's this "support them at all costs" stupidity that is driving the game over a cliff. People afraid to lose the franchise throw money at them despite the fact they are wrong, offensive or just plain misguided.

When had rewarding poor performance ever improved a product? Pretty much never, but people still trot out this asinine proposal that we can somehow teach them to be better by giving them money, albeit "Money with a frowny face" on it.

Well, guess what? They don't notice the frowny face, all they see is the denomimation, and they take it to the bank where the teller doesn't see it either.

What they do notice is a decline in sales, especially if it's continued over several cycles. If that were to happen, then you'd see them suddenly "follow" the money.

Why didn't CW "happen in 90 days"? Because, they didn't want to spend money on it until they secured a longer license, but they didn't share that with us BECAUSE they wanted to keep pulling in money even if they couldn't extend their license. The money flow was OK, and they didn't want to interupt it.......they were following the money.

Suppose that at some point the whole thing burns to the ground. Well then, I'm a MW fan, but I'd move on. Still, there would be this game idea and code lying about, and it would still be valuable. Do you thing for a minute PGI/IGP would just throw it all in the trash? Not likely. Someone better, more competent is likely to notice it's there, think, "Wow, these Dumb-bells almost made this work" and take it over, buying the rights, code etc. from the appropriate vendors.

This theory is at least as valid as the Stockholm Syndrome Like theory that the "support them at all costs" groups seems to be suffering from.

Quote

Stockholm Syndrome can be seen as a form of traumatic bonding, which does not necessarily require a hostage scenario, but which describes "strong emotional ties that develop between two persons where one person intermittently harasses, beats, threatens, abuses, or intimidates the other."

Edited by TLBFestus, 12 August 2014 - 07:26 PM.

[TOGSolid]

Henri Schoots, on 12 August 2014 - 07:12 PM, said:

not with MechWarrior tactics being such a huge success!

https://www.mwtactics.com/

I'm surprised that game is still standing. The devs for it are just absolutely incompetent without any real sense of how to build a solid game. When I pressed them in person about how their stupid monetization scheme would avoid dillution problems as more and more **** was added to the RNG, they had no clue at all. From what I hear, it's still just a giant, buggy as **** mess.