49 replies to this topic

[IlleLorem]

Hey guys! I'm fairly new to the game/bad at it, but that's not for debate here. Anywho.

I am currently wondering if any single Direwolf battlemech variant is available in the Mech Store for C-Bills or Mech Credits. (Currently reinstalling the game, so I figured I would look at mechs while waiting.)

Edit: Looking for an assault mech that is a good weapons platform, but still fairly tanky. (Like the Atlas, but I would rather just missiles and lasers.)

Aside from that, does anyone have any general tips for the game?

Edited by IlleLorem, 23 August 2014 - 06:47 AM.

[Stickjock]

CLAN 'MECH RELEASE SCHEDULE

[Heydiddly]

As stated above, Direwolves won't be available for a while yet. However, tanky, lasers and missiles sound like a perfect fit for a Stalker to me!

[IlleLorem]

Heydiddly, on 23 August 2014 - 06:50 AM, said:

As stated above, Direwolves won't be available for a while yet. However, tanky, lasers and missiles sound like a perfect fit for a Stalker to me!

From what I can see, the Stalker carries ~100-200 less armor than the Atlas, but far more weapons. I get that this is for balancing, but how much of a difference does this make in the survivability of the mech?

[Modo44]

The Dire Whale will be available for Cbills in a month.

The Stalker (3F especially) is a very good IS assault for missile/energy builds. Despite only having 85 tons, its shape and hitboxes make it very hard to kill. It allows the pilot to easily choose which side gets hit for near perfect damage spreading. It can also fire over ridges with minimal exposure using its arm hardpoints. It sounds like PGI made the current sale just for you.

[Heydiddly]

IlleLorem, on 23 August 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

From what I can see, the Stalker carries ~100-200 less armor than the Atlas, but far more weapons. I get that this is for balancing, but how much of a difference does this make in the survivability of the mech?

It fares surprisingly well. The Stalker has huge side torsos, which is both a blessing and a curse. It means it's prone to losing one side and half it's loadout very often, but it also means the enemy will have usually have to go through two side torsos plus your centre to kill you. Most other mechs are much more likely to just die to CT coring straight away, even with more armour. So ultimately, it is generally harder to kill than an Atlas!

Edited by Heydiddly, 23 August 2014 - 07:03 AM.

[IlleLorem]

Sounds good.

New question: Does anybody know what the hardpoints on the two Direwolf variants are?(Assuming they are obtained through the clans package)

[Heydiddly]

Meet your new best friend: http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab!

You can experiment with builds and see stats for every mech, weapon system and piece of equipment currently in the game. Enjoy!

Edit: Also, every mech in the game will always have at least 3 variants available so as to support the mech efficiencies system. In the DireWolf's case, it has the Prime, A and B variants.

Edited by Heydiddly, 23 August 2014 - 07:12 AM.

[IllCaesar]

Take a look at that release schedule. The Dire Wolf should be available on September 23rd for C-Bills, and they'll cost somewhere around 20-25 million C-Bills. Buying it with MC will be extremely expensive - so much so, that you'd be better off getting one of the Clan Packages for three Dire Wolves for about $55 than buying one Dire Wolf with MC. A single Dire Wolf is going to cost more than the Boar's Head - the most expensive Mech in the game, that costs about $35. Get them for C-Bills, or just get the Clan Package, but don't buy them for MC.

www.mwomercs.com/mercs

If you decide for C-Bills, the Stalker is a great assault mech in the meantime. I don't own one myself, Assault is generally not my taste, but I've used it on a friend's account, and I personally though that they were pretty good. You can usually outperform an Atlas with a Stalker, and they are tough to take down.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Reiterating, Stalkers have great hitboxes and excellent hardpoint flexibility. (Many builds don't need to fill all hardpoints)

Direwolves have so-so hitboxes and plenty of hardpoints for build flexibility plus more Omnipod Options.

The Atlas have so-so hitboxes and more restricted hardpoints, but can still create fewer effective builds (Variant is most important for build preference).

smurfys and mechspecs.com are excellent sources to cross check builds. And here is a third great offline option Li Song's

[Koniving]

IlleLorem, on 23 August 2014 - 06:56 AM, said:

From what I can see, the Stalker carries ~100-200 less armor than the Atlas, but far more weapons. I get that this is for balancing, but how much of a difference does this make in the survivability of the mech?

Actually it's not so much for balancing, but for what the nature of the mech is from Battletech (tabletop).

Atlases tend to be very expensive mechs associated with a balance of offense and defense (in fact the center torso lasers on Atlases are mounted on the BACK to fire backwards in tabletop). Typically an Atlas can carry its own.

Atlas lore.

A Stalker is an offensive weapons platform, meant to be supported by other mechs. The arms, due to their lack of lower arm actuators, could flip backwards and shoot behind them. Sadly anything associated with shooting behind you is not included in this game much to my sadness.

Stalker lore.

As far as the mech's ability to tank, ironically due to hitbox design the Stalker actually tanks a LOT better. This is due to a few reasons, which includes large side torsos (making it XL unfriendly; this is why the Stalker trial mech is so easy to kill, the XL engine makes it a glass missile launcher) and a very skinny center torso. The side torsos, when destroyed, cut all damage by 50%. This significantly improves the mech's ability to tank. Especially since the ideal angles to attack a Stalker are from the side, where the center torso cannot possibly be touched.

On the other hand, an Atlas while its center torso isn't huge, is still very easy to focus on the center torso. Its ideal angles to be attacked are in front of it (with another very big mech) or from behind. Attacking from the side is just a waste of time, those arms have more armor than some mechs have on all 3 torsos.

This video is running a joke build on a Stalker. It has some support in the first match but in the second match despite having a team, it's acting far more independently. In both cases, it takes an immense beating and just keeps on ticking.

IlleLorem, on 23 August 2014 - 07:08 AM, said:

New question: Does anybody know what the hardpoints on the two Direwolf variants are?(Assuming they are obtained through the clans package)

B: 5 ballistics, 5 energy.
A: 3 energy, 1 AMS, 2 missiles, 1 ballistic.

Here's a program to find out. Do note: Omni-mechs (all the Clan mechs currently available are Omni-mechs) can't change engines, structure, heatsink type, armor type, etc. They can change weapon hardpoints, however.

Battlemechs (all the IS mechs currently available are Battlemechs) can change engines, structure, heatsink type, armor type, etc., but cannot change hardpoints.

Both sides will eventually have both kinds of mechs.
--------
Back on the stalker...

Stalker as a tanking front line mech, alternating positions with an Atlas. (Misery, the hero mech which actually has less protection than most Stalkers due to a lack of missile doors, which add a 10% resistance to damage when closed).

Alternating front line mechs help improve the durability of the front line, keeping the enemy from being able to focus on specific mech.

Edited by Koniving, 23 August 2014 - 09:27 AM.

[IlleLorem]

Koniving, on 23 August 2014 - 09:18 AM, said:

Actually it's not so much for balancing, but for what the nature of the mech is from Battletech (tabletop).

Atlases tend to be very expensive mechs associated with a balance of offense and defense (in fact the center torso lasers on Atlases are mounted on the BACK to fire backwards in tabletop). Typically an Atlas can carry its own.

Atlas lore.

A Stalker is an offensive weapons platform, meant to be supported by other mechs. The arms, due to their lack of lower arm actuators, could flip backwards and shoot behind them. Sadly anything associated with shooting behind you is not included in this game much to my sadness.

Stalker lore.

As far as the mech's ability to tank, ironically due to hitbox design the Stalker actually tanks a LOT better. This is due to a few reasons, which includes large side torsos (making it XL unfriendly; this is why the Stalker trial mech is so easy to kill, the XL engine makes it a glass missile launcher) and a very skinny center torso. The side torsos, when destroyed, cut all damage by 50%. This significantly improves the mech's ability to tank. Especially since the ideal angles to attack a Stalker are from the side, where the center torso cannot possibly be touched.

On the other hand, an Atlas while its center torso isn't huge, is still very easy to focus on the center torso. Its ideal angles to be attacked are in front of it (with another very big mech) or from behind. Attacking from the side is just a waste of time, those arms have more armor than some mechs have on all 3 torsos.

This video is running a joke build on a Stalker. It has some support in the first match but in the second match despite having a team, it's acting far more independently. In both cases, it takes an immense beating and just keeps on ticking.



B: 5 ballistics, 5 energy.
A: 3 energy, 1 AMS, 2 missiles, 1 ballistic.

Here's a program to find out. Do note: Omni-mechs (all the Clan mechs currently available are Omni-mechs) can't change engines, structure, heatsink type, armor type, etc. They can change weapon hardpoints, however.

Battlemechs (all the IS mechs currently available are Battlemechs) can change engines, structure, heatsink type, armor type, etc., but cannot change hardpoints.

Both sides will eventually have both kinds of mechs.

In your opinion, for a newer player, would a Direwolf be a bad choice or a good one? (I'm not really sure what good structure or armor types do atm, either)

Edit: A build I pieced together for a Direwolf Prime, if I ever get my hands on one.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...103ba8625bd0933

Edited by IlleLorem, 23 August 2014 - 09:30 AM.

[Koniving]

Added stuffs. That should be it for right now.

If you're curious though here's one more. Using a specific setup of rules to make it more like Battletech than MWO, a Dire Wolf versus an Atlas.

Dire wolf perspective.

Atlas perspective.

[Quick n Fast]

@ illeLorem

Plz don't run that build... you are missing 20tons of wepns n ammo on it..

[IlleLorem]

Kahnawake MechMaster Prime, on 23 August 2014 - 09:42 AM, said:

@ illeLorem

Plz don't run that build... you are missing 20tons of wepns n ammo on it..

What exactly would you recommend I change?

[Quick n Fast]

well you have 20ton free ton to put more stuff on... maybe something like this just to fillthe room
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d995cb089563f63

also put some coolshots cool shots on it the 6 n 9by9

Edited by Kahnawake MechMaster Prime, 23 August 2014 - 09:54 AM.

[Koniving]

^that Dire Wolf is stock btw.

What should happen when said Dire Wolf fires everything...

Spoiler

Weapons Phase
------------------------
(Fired everything; it's a long list so truncated/cut.)

Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) must make 1 piloting skill roll(s) (20+ damage).
The base target is 4 [4 (Base piloting skill)].
Roll #1, (4 (Base piloting skill) + 1 (20+ damage)); needs 5, rolls 7 : succeeds.

King Crab KGC-010 (Koniving) must make 1 piloting skill roll(s) (20+ damage).
The base target is 5 [5 (Base piloting skill)].
Roll #1, (5 (Base piloting skill) + 1 (20+ damage)); needs 6, rolls 9 : succeeds.

Heat Phase
-------------------
Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) gains 73 heat, sinks 44 heat and is now at 29 heat.
Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) needs a 5+ to avoid shutdown, rolls 9 : avoids successfully!
Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) needs a 8+ to avoid ammo explosion, rolls 5 : fails to avoid explosion.
*** LRM 10 Ammo EXPLODES! 110 DAMAGE! ***
Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) takes 110 damage to LT.
SECTION DESTROYED,
LIMB BLOWN OFF Left Arm blown off.
remaining 89 damage prevented by CASE.
Critical hit on LT. Roll is 6; no effect.

Pilot of Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) "Bryan Otsuka" takes 2 damage.
Pilot of Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) "Bryan Otsuka" needs a 3 to stay conscious. Rolls 6 : successful!

Pilot of Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime (Lordred) "Bryan Otsuka" needs a 5 to stay conscious. Rolls 7 : successful!

Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime needs a 6+ for coolant failure, rolls 8 : fails.
Daishi (Dire Wolf) Prime's coolant is now less effective.
King Crab KGC-010 (Koniving) gains 25 heat, sinks 20 heat and is now at 5 heat.
King Crab KGC-010 needs a 10+ for coolant failure, rolls 5 : avoids successfully!

Heat mattered so much more in tabletop.

IlleLorem, on 23 August 2014 - 09:28 AM, said:

In your opinion, for a newer player, would a Direwolf be a bad choice or a good one? (I'm not really sure what good structure or armor types do atm, either)

If you wait for the cbills, you won't be a newer player by then.

If you were to do it right now, I suppose it depends. I honestly have an easier time in a Warhawk (which is ironic as lots of people say it's garbage, but I'll tell you why. The large number of LRMs it can carry proves very useful for nailing enemies without having to get close. The 64.8 kph is much more manageable than the Dire Wolf's 48.6 kph. It has less armor and its potential firepower is significantly less, however).

You will want to keep track of a few important things. Where you are. Where your allies are. Your minimap (it can help a lot). I suppose what it requires most of all is situational awareness.

Lets see... This rig was more of a joke than anything. Very powerful but it's actually one of the weakest and most problem-prone rigs you can possibly make. Great pinpoint damage, but each rifle is very likely to explode shortly after you lose your armor.

Spoiler

This first one shows some of the bad things that can happen to you.

Here, great start. But I wound up missiled and didn't have the speed to get away, lost a leg. (Not much happens after I lose the leg, not enough speed to get into the action).


And then these two worked great.
Again in Caustic Valley, this time I've taken nest in the center and begin behaving like an Inner Sphere King Crab (a 100 ton area of denial mech, nicknamed a Hangar Queen because so long as it's there you won't get near).


My joke build versus another Dire Wolf. Thank god that rotation animation glitch finally got fixed.

Getting trapped/isolated/flanked are very similar to the troubles you'd have as a Stalker, but a Stalker has a lot more speed.
Since I'm finally getting around to levelling up the other Dire Wolf variants (I was fortunate in that someone bought all the Clan mechs for me), I'll try to have more variety. I did wind up retiring the Dire Cow, 4 Gauss is more trouble than benefit.

Kahnawake MechMaster Prime, on 23 August 2014 - 09:42 AM, said:

@ illeLorem

Plz don't run that build... you are missing 20tons of wepns n ammo on it..

He didn't post a build. But I'm assuming you're talking about the stock Dire Wolf prime?
Definitely no, don't run anything stock in this game. All stock builds are broken due to PGI liberties and alterations in weapon design.

Though there isn't any reason to run much more ammo in a Dire Wolf with only 2 UAC/5s. They jam too often to really exploit their ammo consuming needs.
--------
(Since I mentioned the Warhawk...)

Stock Warhawk Prime [since I showed Stock Dire Wolf Prime]. (vid; includes a reading from the Charger Battlemech; an 80 ton scout mech armed with 6 small lasers whose main concept was that it could catch up to any enemy scout mechs or larger threats and beat them to a pulp). (Hilarious.)

Warhawk's final stand. I don't have many Warhawk vids up, this was from a group queue against an organized force. A Dire Wolf would have died here, unable to keep these pesky lights back. 3 against 6 became 2 against 6, became 2 against 5, became 2 against 4, 2 against 3, 1 against 2 and finally 1 against 1 before tying.

Edited by Koniving, 23 August 2014 - 10:03 AM.

[Redshift2k5]

Don't forget the other IS Assaults, like the Banshee. The Banshee generally can bring even more direct fire than either an Atlas or a Stalker, such as multiple ballistics plus PPCs or Large lasers while still loading 95% as much armor as an Atlas. The Banshee is outmatched for ballistic slots (on an assault) only by the Dire Wolf.

Dire Wolf is lots of fun so I don't blame you for wanting to drive one But if you want it for C-bills you have a bit of a wait ahead of you still.

[Modo44]

The Banshee is pretty bad for energy or missile-heavy builds. There is not enough room for decent weaponry with good cooling. The best variant works mainly because you can stick (U)AC5s on it to keep heat in check.

[Quick n Fast]

Quote

He didn't post a build

he posted this on post #12 :
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...27ed132ec144f5b