162 replies to this topic

[FatYak]

Harsh title, but it has some truth in it

Basically it works like this... most of the people here did not play table top, they do not care about the ins and outs of lore, they have not read every novel that was produced regarding battletech. We play with a mouse and a keyborad (most of us). This this is not a turn based tabletop game with a 2D6 roll with modifiers or whatever the battletech vernacular is/was.

It goes like this... either they get the clan / IS balance to a reasonable level or community warfare is dead. If you end up with one side of the fight with excessively powerful mech's as you guys constantly state lore dictates they should be you will end up with a community warfare group where the only players playing IS will be those with a long involvement with BT

• Anyone without an affiliation with lore will not sign up for a side where they are destined to lose most fights most of the time
  
• New players without an affiliation with battletech lore will want to have a chance at winning and therefore jump on clan tech which makes the idea of clan v's IS in community warfare pointless
  
• This is essentially a first person shooter in big stompy robots, like most other mechwarrior games before it. if you wanted strictly battletech lore this was never going to be it, and if you really thought that i think you had some wishful thinking going on there
  
• If you want strictly battletech lore, play tabletop
  
• where are all the threads in these forums asking for inclusion of any battletech rules/lore that made no sense in TT (im sure they were there, all TT games have them)
  
• If the clan v;s IS balance is not achieved, community warfare is dead before it starts, and MWO will remain what it is now. A15 minute robot shooting fest on limited maps and a few hardcore battletech guys complaining that its not TT rules and another bunch of casual players who really dont care, they just want to shoot things and have a chance of winning some matches

no one is going to play for a side that is destined to lose most of the time....

Edited by FatYak, 06 September 2014 - 04:47 AM.

[Lily from animove]

No, they were the wrong nerfs totally. Balance is needed but they did it wrong.

[The Basilisk]

Since all those players who have too just 'suck it up' are mostly also those players that are wearing the founders tag and are responsible for the mere existence of this game your statement is a bit rude at least bordering to kick into the face for all those founding this game because it was advertised as *Battletech game* ( see the title on the very top of this page It reads Mechwarrior Online a Battletech game ).
What those ppl wanted to see was Battletech.
Not some other mech arcade shooter stealing from a franchise that was violated and extorted for some quicky flash sales over and over again.
If you say there is a majority of ppl who are just not intrested in the way Battletech lore ( everything in this game...the game itself comes from battletech ) functions, I'm completely fine with that.

JUST

LEAVE

GO AWAY

Play Battlefield, Hawken or Titanfall or what ever but leave Battletech alone.

I'm fine with waiting an other year till pgi got the full CW up and running with segregated Clan and IS queues and 12 vs 10 IS vs Clan maps.
That will be the point where IS vs Clan gameplay gen be balanced.
The whole point about Claninvasion and Clan tech is that it is 300 years more advanced than anything the IS can field.
The very nature of the Claninvasion gameplay should be the desperate attemp to stop an army genetically bread for war, driving mechs that are able to defeat IS units twice their size.

That this can only function with separated IS Clan rosters and asymetric drop and mission profiles was obvious to everyone but pgi just lacks the recources and technical know how to advance this features fast enough. ( also something ovious to anyone who observed MWO from beta up to now)

Take Battletech and MWO as its decendant as it is or just go away.
You won't get anything successfull out of something that just looks like BT but only viotates and perverts its nature.

Edited by The Basilisk, 06 September 2014 - 05:10 AM.

[FatYak]

The Basilisk, on 06 September 2014 - 05:08 AM, said:

Since all those players who have too just 'suck it up' are mostly also those players that are wearing the founders tag and are responsible for the mere existence of this game your statement is a bit rude at least bordering to kick into the face for all those founding this game because it was advertised as *Battletech game* ( see the title on the very top of this page It reads Mechwarrior Online a Battletech game ).
What those ppl wanted to see was Battletech.
Not some other mech arcade shooter stealing from a franchise that was violated and extorted for some quicky flash sales over and over again.
If you say there is a majority of ppl who are just not intrested in the way Battletech lore ( everything in this game...the game itself comes from battletech ) functions, I'm completely fine with that.

JUST

LEAVE

GO AWAY

Play Battlefield, Hawken or Titanfall or what ever but leave Battletech alone.

I'm fine with waiting an other year till pgi got the full CW up and running with segregated Clan and IS queues and 12 vs 10 IS vs Clan maps.
That will be the point where IS vs Clan gameplay gen be balanced.
The whole point about Claninvasion and Clan tech is that it is 300 years more advanced than anything the IS can field.
The very nature of the Claninvasion gameplay should be the desperate attemp to stop an army genetically bread for war, driving mechs that are able to defeat IS units twice their size.

That this can only function with separated IS Clan rosters and asymetric drop and mission profiles was obvious to everyone but pgi just lacks the recources and technical know how to advance this features fast enough. ( also something ovious to enyone who observed MWO from beta up to now)

Take Battletech and MWO as its decendant as it is or just go away.
You won't get anything successfull out of something that just looks like BT but only viotates and perverts its nature.

So...somehow your more important than the rest of us then??? anyone who spent money supporting this game but does not have a founder badge does not count?

I actually want mwo to survive!

Its very simple, this is not marketed at strictly battletech players, therefore, you will not get strictly battletech

this game will live and die on balance or lack of

Edited by FatYak, 06 September 2014 - 05:11 AM.

[Lyoto Machida]

5/10...would read again.

[Diablobo]

This is not a first person shooter. It's an action simulator game that has fairly faithful modeling of the vehicles being simulated. Not all mechs are created equal, and to make them that way would completely eliminate the fun and challenge of the mechlab.

[Lily from animove]

The Basilisk, on 06 September 2014 - 05:08 AM, said:

genetically bread

sry i totally had to xD

[oneproduct]

10 v 12 is a terrible idea. People don't play a game to lose. In tabletop it's okay, because you're one person controlling all 12 IS mechs, so if one of your 12 IS mechs dies but your whole 12 mech team wins out in the end, you're still happy. But when each mech is a person, the IS pilots won't be happy that some of them had to be cannon fodder to soften up the enemy so that their friends could win.

And in reality, trying to get 12 weaker people to coordinate to take down 10 stronger people doesn't work. People already shout at pugs for being bad, imagine if you absolutely needed the help of another person to kill a clan mech as an IS mech. People don't play the game with the kind of military attitude they'd need in order to make 10 v 12 work. As soon as there's a few IS pilots running around doing their own thing the plan fails. And in some maps due to the nature of the peeking game we have where shooting over ridges or turning around corners for quick shots is how to play the game, there simply aren't enough good hill spots or corners to shoot from to accommodate one team needing more spots than the other.

Edited by oneproduct, 06 September 2014 - 05:24 AM.

[FatYak]

Lily from animove, on 06 September 2014 - 04:58 AM, said:

No, they were the wrong nerfs totally. Balance is needed but they did it wrong.

every nerf end's up being the wrong nerf

The Basilisk, on 06 September 2014 - 05:08 AM, said:

Take Battletech and MWO as its decendant as it is or just go away.
You won't get anything successfull out of something that just looks like BT but only viotates and perverts its nature.

The only people who actually care about that are BT fans...how many people here...now..are BT fans??? ill wager its a fair minority.

How many people here played MW games but never TT???

How many people are first times to MW?

Face it, battletech lore is not what a large group of people hold dear in this game

Diablobo, on 06 September 2014 - 05:09 AM, said:

This is not a first person shooter. It's an action simulator game that has fairly faithful modeling of the vehicles being simulated. Not all mechs are created equal, and to make them that way would completely eliminate the fun and challenge of the mechlab.

They will never be equal...weapons aside, the basic chassis will never be equal. Some are great, some have weird hardpoints, some just suck

The Basilisk, on 06 September 2014 - 05:08 AM, said:

Play Battlefield, Hawken or Titanfall or what ever but leave Battletech alone.

This might be battletech inspired but its not battletech

[CyclonerM]

The Basilisk, on 06 September 2014 - 05:08 AM, said:

Since all those players who have too just 'suck it up' are mostly also those players that are wearing the founders tag and are responsible for the mere existence of this game your statement is a bit rude at least bordering to kick into the face for all those founding this game because it was advertised as *Battletech game* ( see the title on the very top of this page It reads Mechwarrior Online a Battletech game ).
What those ppl wanted to see was Battletech.
Not some other mech arcade shooter stealing from a franchise that was violated and extorted for some quicky flash sales over and over again.
If you say there is a majority of ppl who are just not intrested in the way Battletech lore ( everything in this game...the game itself comes from battletech ) functions, I'm completely fine with that.

JUST

LEAVE

GO AWAY

Play Battlefield, Hawken or Titanfall or what ever but leave Battletech alone.

I'm fine with waiting an other year till pgi got the full CW up and running with segregated Clan and IS queues and 12 vs 10 IS vs Clan maps.
That will be the point where IS vs Clan gameplay gen be balanced.
The whole point about Claninvasion and Clan tech is that it is 300 years more advanced than anything the IS can field.
The very nature of the Claninvasion gameplay should be the desperate attemp to stop an army genetically bread for war, driving mechs that are able to defeat IS units twice their size.

That this can only function with separated IS Clan rosters and asymetric drop and mission profiles was obvious to everyone but pgi just lacks the recources and technical know how to advance this features fast enough. ( also something ovious to anyone who observed MWO from beta up to now)

Take Battletech and MWO as its decendant as it is or just go away.
You won't get anything successfull out of something that just looks like BT but only viotates and perverts its nature.

You sir

FatYak, on 06 September 2014 - 05:09 AM, said:

So...somehow your more important than the rest of us then??? anyone who spent money supporting this game but does not have a founder badge does not count?

I actually want mwo to survive!

this game will live and die on balance or lack of

I want MWO to be interesting. If surviving means it being uninteresting and ruining the franchise, better have it die and go back playing MWLL...

And to be honest.. If i was playing a Star Trek game, i would say that Star Trek fans are obviously more important than me, because, unless the universe caught my interest, and so far it has not, i would just be a more or less "casual" gamer. Besides, not knowing much about the universe a game is based on always diminishes my enjoyiment, at least for me. Indeed, this game revived in me the passion for BattleTech, born when i played MW2 in my childhood, and now it is one of my favourite fictional universes, togheter with Game of Thrones and its fictional world.

oneproduct, on 06 September 2014 - 05:20 AM, said:

10 v 12 is a terrible idea. People don't play a game to lose. In tabletop it's okay, because you're one person controlling all 12 IS mechs, so if one of your 12 IS mechs dies but your whole 12 mech team wins out in the end, you're still happy. But when each mech is a person, the IS pilots won't be happy that some of them had to be cannon fodder to soften up the enemy so that their friends could win.

Exactly! People do not play a game to lose.

If being 2 players down proves to be a great disadvantage for the Clan team, then it would achieve its goal. Clan warriors would have a challenge for them, IS players would have the numbers to favor them and thus an easier victory.

After all, almost everyone agrees that when a team has a 2 'Mechs advantage over the other, the chance of victory is much higher, quiaff?

[Nauht]

OP is right - we do need to suck it up cos PGI chose the easiest path than rather try to work out something that would be better for the game in the long term.

It's all about $$ to them, so do the one thing you can control - don't give them anymore $$. Use and abuse the F2P system but don't keep encouraging them by handing them money. They'll listen then.

[Dirkdaring]

The clans are supposed to be far more powerful. Thats why they rolled the IS for a damn long time when they arrived.

Nerfs aren't needed because the clans are doing exactly what they are supposed to do. If anything, they are too weak right now. My jager can take on nearly any madcat and kick the you know what out of it 9 times out of 10.

[Bobzilla]

BT lore is what makes this game. I'm not saying that balancing isn't needed, but if you are playing a battle tech game, it has to resemble battle tech.

Why you like this game, OP, is the fact that said lore exsists and the game was built around it.

You can't see the forest cause all the trees have ECM.

[FatYak]

Bobzilla, on 06 September 2014 - 06:36 AM, said:

BT lore is what makes this game. I'm not saying that balancing isn't needed, but if you are playing a battle tech game, it has to resemble battle tech.

Why you like this game, OP, is the fact that said lore exsists and the game was built around it.

You can't see the forest cause all the trees have ECM.

No, that's why you like this game. Plenty of great games exist without an extensive lore behind it.

[KhanCipher]

as a BT lore nutter, i have to say this.

I'd rather a balanced game than a game that's balanced around "muh lore".

[FatYak]

Dirkdaring, on 06 September 2014 - 06:31 AM, said:

The clans are supposed to be far more powerful. Thats why they rolled the IS for a damn long time when they arrived.

Nerfs aren't needed because the clans are doing exactly what they are supposed to do. If anything, they are too weak right now. My jager can take on nearly any madcat and kick the you know what out of it 9 times out of 10.

Thats entirely the problem! this isnt a novel. if you want community warfare to work then people have to get away from this "they are supposed to lose" bit. no one is going to voluntarily sign up to lose. Or did you pick clans so you could win?

[Ahja]

Well I stopped reading at "or community warfare is dead". Well without the lore it already is. Why have Mechs that are called Clan or Mechs that look like BT/MW Mechs at all? The harsh reality is poster PGI is using lore to keep the people that love the franchise on the hook and that this game is not BT or MW more and more with each patch. The sad thing is when they loose those players. Then we will see a turn back to the lore you think is not important. So by all means get all that useless lore out of this game so PGI came make the game they want to make and let BT/MW fans move on.

[Monkey Lover]

I really dont care what they do. The problem I have is they keep changing thier mind. First I bought a summore because it was the only one pisted with jj. Turns out its a pos mech and should have got a timber. Next I upgrade to the dire so I could snipe and get some use of the clan mechs. Then they nerfed ppc. Then they nerf the lasers on the nova i bought.Now theyre telling me more clan nerfs are coming and im already not happy with the mechs I have. I would sell them all for 50% mc if I could.

[Piney II]

All of the rage and QQ is really pointless. The nerfs are a done deal. You can adapt to them and press on, or you can quit.

[Monkey Lover]

Piney, on 06 September 2014 - 06:57 AM, said:

All of the rage and QQ is really pointless. The nerfs are a done deal. You can adapt to them and press on, or you can quit.

Companies dont last very long when your business model is adapt (spend more money) or quit.