196 replies to this topic

[Indomitus]

Let's break this down with more detail instead of "I want the urbie!" or complaints.

3050 brought us the clan invasion and the following mechs-

• Clan 'Mechs
  
  • Light 'Mechs
    
    • Fire Moth (Dasher)
      
    • Mist Lynx (Koshi)
      
    • Kit Fox (Uller)
      
    • Adder (Puma)
  • Medium 'Mechs
    
    • Viper (Dragonfly)
      
    • Ice Ferret (Fenris)
      
    • Nova (Black Hawk)
      
    • Stormcrow (Ryoken)
  • Heavy 'Mechs
    
    • Mad Dog (Vulture)
      
    • Hellbringer (Loki)
      
    • Summoner (Thor)
      
    • Timber Wolf (Mad Cat)
  • Assault 'Mechs
    
    • Gargoyle (Man O' War)
      
    • Warhawk (Masakari)
      
    • Executioner (Gladiator)
      
    • Dire Wolf (Daishi)

Taking away the mechs already in game that leaves us with-

• Light 'Mechs
  
  • Fire Moth (Dasher)
    
  • Mist Lynx (Koshi)
• Medium 'Mechs
  
  • Viper (Dragonfly)
    
  • Ice Ferret (Fenris)
• Heavy 'Mechs
  
  • Mad Dog (Vulture)
    
  • Hellbringer (Loki)
• Assault 'Mechs
  
  • Gargoyle (Man O' War)
    
  • Executioner (Gladiator)

Russ said they're not releasing mechs that would normally have MASC, listen to the town hall for reference.











This elminates the Executioner and Fire Moth.



That leaves us with-

Light 'Mechs
Mist Lynx (Koshi)

Medium 'Mechs
Viper (Dragonfly)
Ice Ferret (Fenris)

Heavy 'Mechs
Mad Dog (Vulture)
Hellbringer (Loki)

Assault 'Mechs

Gargoyle (Man O' War)

NOTE: If the following speculation doesn't apply, the list above is what we're left with.

Russ said he first wanted to do a Shadow Cat (first seen in Battle of Luthien (3052), first mentioned in Technical Readout: 3058) for the medium mech but it WILL NOT be released because of MASC. Mentioning the Shadow Cat as a potential mech jumps us up in mech potential from both TRO:3055 and TRO:3058...

Adding in all of the mechs available from these 2 TROs would be ridiculous because it's highly unlikely they're all in the pool (regardless of year produced) because TRO: 3058 includes both the Hunchback IIC and the Kodiak, both of which Russ said will NOT be in this wave.

So, if we combine the remaining 3050 mechs with all Clan mechs produced by Jan 3052 (first time the Shadow Cat was seen) that are front line mechs (there were very few cases of the IS seeing 2nd line clan mechs by this point), while ALSO eliminating mechs that the IS wouldn't really see until the Battle of Tukayyid (May 3052), then we have the following list available-

Light 'Mechs

Hankyu

Mist Lynx (Koshi)

Fire Falcon (doubtful, production started in 3052, wouldn't be common enough to bring to MWO before other lights)

Pouncer (not likely, too similar to the Adder... still possible though)

Medium 'Mechs

Viper (Dragonfly)
Ice Ferret (Fenris)


Nobori-nin
Phantom (torn here, was pushed into production "immediately prior" to the Refusal War (3057), but production date is listed as 3052.
Heavy 'Mechs
Mad Dog (Vulture)
Hellbringer (Loki)
Cauldron-Born (extremely rare, though they were on Luthien. Many in the IS saw it before clans outside of CSJ/Clan Nova Cat (who were also in the Battle of Luthien) did, hence other clans calling it by its IS designation instead of Ebon Jaguar, the CSJ name.. which is why it's unlikely over more common heavies)
Night Gyr (very CJF specific)
Linebacker (not likely, 3052 prodcution date and too wolf specific.... too CWiE tolerated at that... like the Cauldron-Born it's not likely to be in before more common heavies)


Assault 'Mechs
Gargoyle (Man O' War)
Kingfisher (torn on including this as many clanners consider it 2nd line)
Naga (not common, wasn't very successful until Tukayid, and not a very clan-like mech at all)

If you take out all the mechs that have reasons against them, you're ALMOST left with my second list of potential mechs.

Gooooo speculation!

EDIT: Clarification

2nd EDIT: The bullets and spacings are fighting me.

Edited by Indomitus, 11 September 2014 - 12:29 PM.

[Kibble]

Clans need a good light mech and the only one other then a Jenner IIC would be the Arctic Cheetah. It was produced in 3037 so it's around.

http://www.solaris7....nfo.asp?ID=2409

All other mechs I don't really care we just NEED a good light!

Edited by Kibble, 11 September 2014 - 12:29 PM.

[Pariah Devalis]

I agree, bout the arctic cheetah is almost too good. At least the mist lynx is a good, but imperfect mech. Fast, nimble, but not packing ad much firepower, armor or speed.

[Henchman 24]

All the wanton speculation always seems to not take into account previous hints, and the trollish nature of picked mechs by PGI.

I present you with another medium possibility...and don't discount it because you hate it, or it was a crap mech in TT....etc. This is fully within the realm of possibility here.

http://www.sarna.net...i/Hunchback_IIC

Yup, she's ugly, overheats, has no long range weps, and little armor to bear vs usage scenario...but I'd have to say...they've released equally crappy mechs so far...and I see nothing that would prevent this from being an option.

Chew on that...toodles.

[Pariah Devalis]

Henchman 24, on 11 September 2014 - 01:02 PM, said:

All the wanton speculation always seems to not take into account previous hints, and the trollish nature of picked mechs by PGI.

I present you with another medium possibility...and don't discount it because you hate it, or it was a crap mech in TT....etc. This is fully within the realm of possibility here.

http://www.sarna.net...i/Hunchback_IIC

Yup, she's ugly, overheats, has no long range weps, and little armor to bear vs usage scenario...but I'd have to say...they've released equally crappy mechs so far...and I see nothing that would prevent this from being an option.

Chew on that...toodles.

She is also a second line battlemech, and so not allowed. PGI stated they will not be putting out IICs (for now). Also lacking enough variants.

Want alternative mediums? Try the Huntsman (Nobori-nin). A thing of beauty. Technically seeing limited use now, though primarily by Nova Cat forces, with extremely, extremely limited use in other Crusader Clans. Fairly new mech. As in, production started as soon as the invasion began. Absolutely excellent all around mech, however, and has a very distinctive design, between the slightly digitigrade feet, the arms jam packed with guns each seemingly vying to overshadow one another, and the cooling fin on its back.

Unlikely, however, due to its newness. It was, just like the Shadow Cat, first encountered in the Battle of Luthien, which is 3051. However, if they wanted to release the Shadow Cat and were stopped by MASC, this opens up the opportunities to see the Arctic Cheetah and Huntsman, along with the Ebon Jaguar. However, do not count on it. All are fairly new machines.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 11 September 2014 - 02:28 PM.

[LiGhtningFF13]

Guys just have a (little) patience! And after that we will all see what's in the package or not. By the way will there be a add-on package or not?!

Edited by LiGhtningFF13, 12 September 2014 - 03:46 AM.

[Keeshu]

Oh we have patience. Just sometimes it's fun to speculate. It's just something fans do sometimes.

It's not like we're going "OMFG YOU GUYS R SO SLO! WHEN R TEH MEKS COMING OUT ND WHAT R THEY!?"

[Gas Guzzler]

Grey Black, on 11 September 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

In lore, it entered production in 3049, meaning it is a candidate (and a more likely candidate to my mind than the Hellbringer), but nonetheless.

Well, IMO I think if they wanted to they could just put in a placeholder for the A-PODs (they have 0 application in this game as there is no infantry, so they would never have a function anyway and we would just remove them) like they have done for the command console, and then we can just take them off and add armor and such.

I don't see why A-PODs would interfere with a Mech being released personally.

[IraqiWalker]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 September 2014 - 10:19 AM, said:

Well, IMO I think if they wanted to they could just put in a placeholder for the A-PODs (they have 0 application in this game as there is no infantry, so they would never have a function anyway and we would just remove them) like they have done for the command console, and then we can just take them off and add armor and such.

I don't see why A-PODs would interfere with a Mech being released personally.

The problem is that it's a hardpoint and weapon that doesn't exist in the system. On top of it, a LOT of A-Pods were placed in the legs. We still don't have leg hardpoints on any mechs in the game.

[Grey Black]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 September 2014 - 10:19 AM, said:

Well, IMO I think if they wanted to they could just put in a placeholder for the A-PODs (they have 0 application in this game as there is no infantry, so they would never have a function anyway and we would just remove them) like they have done for the command console, and then we can just take them off and add armor and such.

I don't see why A-PODs would interfere with a Mech being released personally.

Basically, it's problematic in the same way that releasing a mech with Triple Strength Myomer is: The item does not exist in game and releasing without the item breaks the stock configuration.

[Gas Guzzler]

Grey Black, on 12 September 2014 - 11:53 AM, said:

Basically, it's problematic in the same way that releasing a mech with Triple Strength Myomer is: The item does not exist in game and releasing without the item breaks the stock configuration.

I understand but the DDC was in the game long before the Command Console had a function... I'm thinking they could do the same thing for A-PODs without much of a fuss. All it is is an item with 1 crit slot and .5 tons, that doesn't do anything.

IraqiWalker, on 12 September 2014 - 11:35 AM, said:

The problem is that it's a hardpoint and weapon that doesn't exist in the system. On top of it, a LOT of A-Pods were placed in the legs. We still don't have leg hardpoints on any mechs in the game.

I'm not worried about it... see response above

[Pariah Devalis]

You know what else is problematic? The five ton hatchet the YLW has.

Oh. Wait. It id not an issue since they outright replaced it.

Likewise, it would be a very simple matter of replacing the four critical slots and two tons with two double heat sinks.

Erh mehr gehr. So difficult.

In case my sardonic reaction is not clear the A-Pod argument against the Hellbringer has been, and always will be, a bad one given the precedent set.

[Grey Black]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 September 2014 - 11:57 AM, said:

I understand but the DDC was in the game long before the Command Console had a function... I'm thinking they could do the same thing for A-PODs without much of a fuss. All it is is an item with 1 crit slot and .5 tons, that doesn't do anything.

And the community for a while was clamoring for blood so the Command Console would have a use. I don't foresee them doing that again, especially not for a piece of equipment that is literally useless in the context of this game.

Pariah Devalis, on 12 September 2014 - 11:59 AM, said:

You know what else is problematic? The five ton hatchet the YLW has.

Oh. Wait. It id not an issue since they outright replaced it.

Likewise, it would be a very simple matter of replacing the four critical slots and two tons with two double heat sinks.

Erh mehr gehr. So difficult.

In case my sardonic reaction is not clear the A-Pod argument against the Hellbringer has been, and always will be, a bad one given the precedent set.

Agreed on the hatchet, but that was a hero mech. Hero mechs can be fudged easier than standard chassis, IMNSHO.

[Pariah Devalis]

Grey Black, on 12 September 2014 - 12:07 PM, said:

Agreed on the hatchet, but that was a hero mech. Hero mechs can be fudged easier than standard chassis, IMNSHO.

Gonna need to disagree here, though technically both our opinions are equally valid, I am sure. When it comes to the YLW, we had a piece of equipment that served actual mech to mech combat purpose that could not be worked into the game. In the Hellbringer Prime we have a piece of equipment that serves very little to no actual purpose whatsoever in mech to mech combat, but could, in theory, be coded as a consumable weapon system.

Considering that a useful piece of tech was discarded, necessitating an increase to the engine and armor of the mech carrying it, the odds of them keeping the A-Pods, a useless piece of tech, and inventing code to make it work is slim. Especially since there would be zero impact to any other variant by simply swapping them with DHS.

Considering how under-sinked (and under-armored) the Hellbringer is, any help to either department would be fully embraced, IMO, by even the staunchest of grognards.

*bold, italics, and underlines used simply to more clearly link the logic points for clarity sake

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 12 September 2014 - 12:56 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Pariah Devalis, on 12 September 2014 - 12:52 PM, said:

Gonna need to disagree here, though technically both our opinions are equally valid, I am sure. When it comes to the YLW, we had a piece of equipment that served actual mech to mech combat purpose that could not be worked into the game. In the Hellbringer Prime we have a piece of equipment that serves very little to no actual purpose whatsoever in mech to mech combat, but could, in theory, be coded as a consumable weapon system.

Considering that a useful piece of tech was discarded, necessitating an increase to the engine and armor of the mech carrying it, the odds of them keeping the A-Pods, a useless piece of tech, and inventing code to make it work is slim. Especially since there would be zero impact to any other variant by simply swapping them with DHS.

Considering how under-sinked (and under-armored) the Hellbringer is, any help to either department would be fully embraced, IMO, by even the staunchest of grognards.

Yep. And really, adding an item in the Mechlab can't be that hard. It can even be under the guise that it would damage infantry, but since there is no infantry it won't damage anything. I really don't see why they couldn't code in a placeholder without function.

OR replace the tonnage with armor

OR replace the tonnage with heatsinks

OR release the mech with 63/65 tons used.

In any case, it doesn't matter. The mech should be in the game. They can't just not put in any mech with A-Pods because they aren't going to code a function for A-Pods. They HAVE NO FUNCTION. They ONLY damage infantry units and nothing else. There are no infantry in MWO, therefore no function for A-Pods will ever exist.

Unless CW Phase 3 is adding infantry combat to the game...

[DONTOR]

Either of those Mediums would be a God send to the Clan line up, we need an actually fast mech. Either one would help with those pesky IS lights. I would buy the pack for a fast medium alone...

[Hawk819]

Pouncer is a 40t medium.

[Odanan]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 September 2014 - 12:57 PM, said:

In any case, it doesn't matter. The mech should be in the game. They can't just not put in any mech with A-Pods because they aren't going to code a function for A-Pods. They HAVE NO FUNCTION. They ONLY damage infantry units and nothing else. There are no infantry in MWO, therefore no function for A-Pods will ever exist.

A-Pods could have an one-time blast that deals small damage to nearby mechs (maybe useful against light mechs?). That would be a weapon with a different mechanic, for a change.

Sure, the easier solution is to just release the Hellbringer with either 2 tons of armor or 2 extra DHS. No reason to keep this beast out of the game.

[Gas Guzzler]

Odanan, on 12 September 2014 - 05:40 PM, said:

A-Pods could have an one-time blast that deals small damage to nearby mechs (maybe useful against light mechs?). That would be a weapon with a different mechanic, for a change.

Sure, the easier solution is to just release the Hellbringer with either 2 tons of armor or 2 extra DHS. No reason to keep this beast out of the game.

Yeah, I thought about that but in TT they ONLY damaged infantry. In any case, I would rather they just released the Hellbringer with placeholders then put it off to build something like that into the game.

[Grey Black]

Odanan, on 12 September 2014 - 05:40 PM, said:

A-Pods could have an one-time blast that deals small damage to nearby mechs (maybe useful against light mechs?). That would be a weapon with a different mechanic, for a change.

Sure, the easier solution is to just release the Hellbringer with either 2 tons of armor or 2 extra DHS. No reason to keep this beast out of the game.

Well, technically speaking, the easiest solution is to not release the Hellbringer Prime, but that's neither here nor there.