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Wave 2 Speculation


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#81 Kael Posavatz

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:05 AM

There are criteria that some people are not taking into consideration.

-Timeline (the Fire Falcon, for a previously mentioned example, is not in deployment until 3052)
-No IIC. This logically extends to mechs that have been called something else (Conjurer) are IIC in name, but lost to the Inner Sphere (Hoplite), or are Clan designed and built BattleMechs (long list, but includes the Kodiak).
-What mechs have already been released? The Clans already have a 30-ton mech in the Kit Fox, so we are likely not to see the Arctic Cheetah.
-How prevalent is it, both among the Clans, and seen in the invasion forces. The Ebon Jaguar was in service in 3049, but it was at best extremely uncommon in the Smoke Jaguar touman.
-How iconic is it? I maintain that this is the reason for including the Dire Wolf the first time around since it was an extremely rare mech, even in Clan Wolf. I think there is a grand total of SIX listed in the mech-by-mech breakdown in the CW Sourcebook.
-Viability. The Viper (Dragonfly) is notoriously undergunned for its mass. I doubt PGI would be willing to court the rage that would accompany it. Likewise the Annihilator (if it was not excluded for other reasons) would be unlikely to make the list due to its extreme low speed.
-Is there an ECM variant. They have to be looking at giving the Clans another ECM unit, preferably in a different weight class than light, if only to make the Adder a viable choice.

My own list is

Mist Lynx
Ice Ferret
Mad Dog
Hellbringer
Gargoyle

In this list the Hellbringer would most likely be the 'bonus' mech since the Mad Dog is the more iconic. The Helbringer Prime would be included, with the anti-personnel pods sacrificed for increased armor since this mech is notoriously under-armored.

Edited by Kael 17, 11 September 2014 - 07:11 AM.


#82 Grey Black

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:11 AM

View PostKael 17, on 11 September 2014 - 07:05 AM, said:

There are criteria that some people are not taking into consideration.

-Timeline (the Fire Falcon, for a previously mentioned example, is not in deployment until 3052)
-No IIC. This logically extends to mechs that have been called something else (Conjurer) are IIC in name, but lost to the Inner Sphere (Hoplite), or are Clan designed and built BattleMechs (long list, but includes the Kodiak).
-What mechs have already been released? The Clans already have a 30-ton mech in the Kit Fox, so we are likely not to see the Arctic Cheetah.
-How prevalent is it, both among the Clans, and seen in the invasion forces. The Ebon Jaguar was in service in 3049, but it was at best extremely uncommon in the Smoke Jaguar touman.
-Viability. The Viper (Dragonfly) is notoriously undergunned for its mass. I doubt PGI would be willing to court the rage that would accompany it. Likewise the Annihilator (if it was not excluded for other reasons) would be unlikely to make the list due to its extreme low speed.


Your Timeline and Prevalence points are both undermined by the existence of the KFX-S, NVA-S and TBR-S. These mechs should not be seeing service yet, and yet they have been introduced in game.

#83 Pariah Devalis

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:16 AM

The S variants were retconned into 3050 by the Battletech writers. Not undermined at all.

Meanwhile I'm still trying to wrap my head around someone saying the arctic cheetah is undergunned compared to the mist lynx....

#84 TibsVT

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:26 AM

I don't know how many times I've said it but you are not getting a Kodiak in the forseeable future.

Get used to the idea.

Unless PGI have resolved the MASC problems they will be the readily available Omni's:

Mist Lynx
Ice Ferret (or possilby Viper [albeit unlikely])
Mad Dog + Hellbringer
Gargoyle

Edited by KelesK, 11 September 2014 - 07:42 AM.


#85 Hawk819

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:27 AM

Under gun? I'd like to know how. Comparing the two, the Arctic Cheetah aka Hankyu has more pod space than the Mist Lynx (Koshi) and more firepower.

Edited by Hawk819, 11 September 2014 - 07:28 AM.


#86 Pariah Devalis

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 07:42 AM

Agree. Which is why I am confused. Arctic Cheetah is a tiny monster of a mech.

#87 TibsVT

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:07 AM

View PostPariah Devalis, on 11 September 2014 - 07:42 AM, said:

Agree. Which is why I am confused. Arctic Cheetah is a tiny monster of a mech.
Perhaps they're just getting their Mechs mixed up.

#88 Xavier

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:38 AM

Well Personally I think that what you are going to see is mechs that currently fill missing tonnage gaps so lets just go ahead an eliminate any other 100, 85. 75, 70, 55, 50, 35, and 30 ton mechs from this timeline which is quite a large chunk

I will choose one mech from each tonnage that I think will be filled through the second package. I beleive the mechs in the package will be any of the following I have highlighted my likeliest choices in bold.

Assault Possibilities:
Gladiator(Executioner) 95 Tons
Supernova 90 Tons
Gargoyle(Man O War) 80 Tons

Heavy Possibilities:
Ebon Jaguar(Cauldron-Born) 65 Tons
Mad Dog(Vulture) 60 Tons

Medium Possibilities:
Ice Ferret(Fenris) 45 Tons
Viper(Dragonfly) 40 Tons

Light Possibilities:
Mist Lynx (Koshi) 25 Tons
Fire Moth(Dasher) 20 Tons

I believe that the Mad Dog will be the bonus mech given out since I heard that it was already in the design process and since this Mech will be available on the 23rd it would have already been in production.

Just My Thoughts

#89 Darwins Dog

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:40 AM

View PostIraqiWalker, on 11 September 2014 - 06:57 AM, said:

BTW, when they say both packs, do they mean Wave 1 and Wave 2? or Masakari pack wave 1, and full wave 2?

I'm not sure; it wasn't very clear from the descriptions. I also didn't really pay attention because I was/am too broke to buy a clan pack lol.

#90 TibsVT

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:47 AM

As much as I would enjoy seeing some Mechs from outside of left field I doubt we will see anything not in the TRO book.

Also I'd argue the Hellbringer and Mad Dog are an immediate given since the Mad Dog has been hugely requested by the community and the Hellbringer will bring some much needed Clan ECM alternatives rather than relying on the Kit Fox.

Edited by KelesK, 11 September 2014 - 08:49 AM.


#91 Alaskan Nobody

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 08:52 AM

View PostXavier, on 11 September 2014 - 08:38 AM, said:

............
Gladiator(Executioner) 95 Tons
..............
Fire Moth(Dasher) 20 Tons

MASC makes those tricky

View PostXavier, on 11 September 2014 - 08:38 AM, said:

..............
Supernova 90 Tons
.............

And if I remember right, that one is not an omni-mech.
(Could be wrong though, not very familiar with the Super)

#92 Pariah Devalis

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:02 AM

You are correct. As fun as the Supernova would be, it is a second line battlemech. Essentially the King Crab IIC.

#93 Gas Guzzler

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:13 AM

View PostGrey Black, on 11 September 2014 - 06:50 AM, said:

I'm calling it now, the mechs will be:

LIGHT: Mist Lynx - Prime, B, C - We need a fast light, and the Dasher is straight out due to MASC. The Arctic Cheetah is an option, being produced in 3037, but not as powerful and outside of the current PGI methodology for mech division (IS - guerilla tactics, Clan - deathball and kill).

MEDIUM: Ice Ferret - Prime, B, D - While the Viper is an option, the Ice Ferret is an answer to the Cicada. The variants I chose are certainly the most varied and can provide some excellent options.

HEAVY: Ebon Jaguar - Prime, A, C - Produced in 3049, it's a newer mech, but certainly a more likely option than the Hellbringer, due to the use of A-Pods in the Hellbringer's Primary variant. Also, the Ebon Jaguar is a truly beautiful machine, with several variants possible.

BONUS HEAVY: Mad Dog - Prime, A, B - The most iconic of the heavies, this will be the mech given to the people who bought the first Clan packages. The Mad Dog can provide some very interesting options, such as the B variant with 6 SRM6.

ASSAULT: Gargoyle - Prime, A, C - The Executioner cannot be used due to MASC and I cannot find a proper Clan omnimech that would be used in this context.

I would like to bring up the option that, perhaps, Wave 2 will be second line mechs from the Clans, which will give us options like the Jenner IIC, Hunchback IIC, Grizzly, and Kodiak or Blood Kite, which will be a more interesting option than the current Clan omnis.


They will just put a place holder in for the A-Pods. Read: Prime Variant + bonus 2 tons of armor :D

Either way, I could see us getting a Cauldron-Born later but we are very likely going to get Mad Dog and Hellbringer in this pack. They are both highly sought after, and were both already half done with the Timber Wolf and Summoner.


Also, Gargoyle C has Anti-personnel pods....

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 11 September 2014 - 09:34 AM.


#94 DoctorDetroit

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:38 AM

Gargoyle initially sounded amazing to me, but I changed my mind after thinking about it it for awhile. I mean it has the speed of a timber wolf, with just a little more armor and far less room for weapons (with low mounts). Maybe, for an all clan blitzkrieg-like drop deck?

Mad Dog has about as much weapons room as a timber wolf, same speed, but sits with lower armor. It will probably be amazing if tonnage is an issue for drop decks.

#95 TibsVT

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:38 AM

View PostGas Guzzler, on 11 September 2014 - 09:13 AM, said:

Also, Gargoyle C has Anti-personnel pods....

Shh.. Don't ruin the surprise. :P

#96 Gas Guzzler

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:41 AM

On a side note, when we do get the Cauldron-Born, is it going to have the quirk that it gets to use an IS style AC20 slug for its UAC20? I mean.... lore and all...

#97 TibsVT

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:43 AM

View PostGas Guzzler, on 11 September 2014 - 09:41 AM, said:

On a side note, when we do get the Cauldron-Born, is it going to have the quirk that it gets to use an IS style AC20 slug for its UAC20? I mean.... lore and all...
Given that PGI have been planning to alter the IS AC's to the same manner as the Clan ones I doubt it.

#98 Gas Guzzler

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 09:47 AM

View PostKelesK, on 11 September 2014 - 09:43 AM, said:

Given that PGI have been planning to alter the IS AC's to the same manner as the Clan ones I doubt it.


They were thinking about it but I think they have since decided to leave them as is. I hope so anyway...

#99 CyclonerM

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 10:00 AM

View PostGas Guzzler, on 11 September 2014 - 09:41 AM, said:

On a side note, when we do get the Cauldron-Born, is it going to have the quirk that it gets to use an IS style AC20 slug for its UAC20? I mean.... lore and all...

It would be fitting..

#100 Grey Black

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Posted 11 September 2014 - 11:14 AM

View PostGas Guzzler, on 11 September 2014 - 09:13 AM, said:

Also, Gargoyle C has Anti-personnel pods....


Fair point. Then the D variant is more likely.

View PostGas Guzzler, on 11 September 2014 - 09:41 AM, said:

On a side note, when we do get the Cauldron-Born, is it going to have the quirk that it gets to use an IS style AC20 slug for its UAC20? I mean.... lore and all...


In lore, it entered production in 3049, meaning it is a candidate (and a more likely candidate to my mind than the Hellbringer), but nonetheless.





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