88 replies to this topic

[Apnu]

Like the subject says: What are the issues in MWO. List them here concisely. I'll take that list and make a poll and lets see what the community thinks is the biggest issue in the game that the community would like the devs to look at.

So list out, briefly what you think the issues are.


On Edit: Here is a list of items I have collected from this thread so far:

• IS v Clan weapon balance
  
• Heat Scale (Ghost Heat) & heat sink operation
  
• Meta/alpha pinpoint damage (coring mechs with one blow) AKA "Low time to kill" AKA "Time to Kill"
  
• Jump Jets (to be used for movement, not poptarting)
  
• Obsoleting mechs with newer ones
  
• C-bill grind
  
• Skill trees & skill system improvement
  
• 3pv
  
• Consumables
  
• Modules
  
• Role warfare
  
• Info. warfare
  
• ECM
  
• Game modes (more of them)
  
• Maps (size, variation, age, clean up of defects such as being stuck on small objects)
  
• Weapon nerfs (gauss charge, PPCs, LRMs)
  
• Mech nerfs (Victor)
  
• More story / universe immersion / pilots & pilot skills (gunnery and driving levels)
  
• New player experience / training noobs
  
• 10v12 (AKA clans operating in "stars" of 5, and a "binary" being 2 stars. IS using the three lances formation)
  
• Customization (being able to remove a mech from its intended role, like the SRM Trebuchet)
  
• Leveling mechs (having to buy 3 variants instead of one with some kind of unlock paths for other things -- related to immersion and pilot skills?)
  
• Lobby system
  
• 3/3/3/3 class restrictions / flexible class limits for a match
  
• Hit Boxes
  
• UI improvements
  
• Weapon slots (being too "generic", related to customization?)
  
• Match Maker

(Community warfare not mentioned because PGI is already working on it)





Community wishes

• more mechs
  
• New weapons
  
• Subscription option
  
• community run events
  
• More MC and c-bill purchase items

Edited by Apnu, 17 September 2014 - 08:02 PM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Inner Sphere v Clan Weapon balance.
I think Clans are to weak, most feel the Opposite. Either way, this is core to the game being successful.

[Apnu]

Bump. Anybody else?

[Turist0AT]

Ghost Heat is a big issue for me

[TopDawg]

I haven't played seriously in ~1.75 years or so (and only a handful of matches since then (including wasting C-Bills on a Summoner as it turned out), but:

• Have they finally fixed the poptart sniping meta/alpha strike meta being much better than damage over time + general balance, which also relates to map design, including spawn placements;
  
• Scrapped ghost heat in favor of something that makes sense and doesn't ruin some stock designs of Mechs;
  
• Stopped obsoleting past Mechs when new Mechs are released, which is likely directly related to adding role warfare (something other than 3/3/3/3 which only causes the best in a weight class to be taken, or you're gimping your team);
  
• Likely inextricably related to the previous, but having new Mechs that have more than only one viable variant, if they even have any at all (i.e. are not DOA), or a reason to actually use them other than 'I have to in order to get the Mech I want to pilot maxed out';
  
• The amount of C-bills earned per match in relation to buying new Mechs that come out (having to spend ~$60-$120+ every time a new set of Mechs comes out is ridiculous; I didn't realize the $75 I already gave them would be meaningless if I wanted to continue to play at another point in time);
  
• Putting in better skill trees to promote role/specialization (but not necessarily something concrete, in case one might want to change it at a later point in time; but aren't able to just flip back and forth at a moment's notice - or perhaps maybe you grind each individual role separately, thereby allowing people to specialize, and those who play a lot/have a lot of Mechs to be able to fulfill any role, but importantly not all roles at once, i.e. in a match at the same time);
  
• Making it so 3rd person view is not exploitable in matches to look around/over terrain that they wouldn't otherwise be able to;
  
• Making it so consumables (mostly referring to artillery here, but coolant flush to some degree) is not a necessity for the highest levels of play, i.e. everyone has to take them in order to stay competitive (although if Cbill earnings were higher, it probably wouldn't be a huge deal - and also in the same regard forcing premium time just to make money (the equivalent of a subscription really) isn't really desirable when people are spending full box prices + on a F2P game), also related to artillery, but when it was mocked up that maybe the artillery strikes would be linked to command specializations;

That's all I can think of off the top of my head. There might have been more, but it's been a while since I seriously played (but for reference I did play a fair bit, like 3k matches or something before the stats reset, and however many more before that in closed beta).


Edit: Ooo it seems they kept the archived stats (via a little dropdown menu). I have almost 4,500 wins/losses (which might included closed beta I guess?).

Edited by TopDawg, 16 September 2014 - 11:39 AM.

[Horusv2]

lack of mechs

we need more mechs

[Destructicus]

The lack of true role warfare
Heavy handed clan nerfs
Ghost heat

[DocBach]

right now mostly lack of the Zeus as a playable chassis

[Xanquil]

The reasons I stopped playing were for so long were;

1: Prefect instant pinpoint converged alpha strikes. This is the biggest problem this game still has, ad the core of a lot of other problems.
2: Ghost heat. This is in part a result of #1, and fear of heat neutral mechs.
3: ECM this is one of those things that needed an overhaul from the get go, and the fact that it is going to be worked on is part of the reason I'm back playing.
4: Heat scale, and heat sinks. The problems with the heat system were brought up by myself and others during beta and have yet to have anything done to fix it. most of it revolving around the fear of heat neutral mechs and lack of thinking about the future.


That is my short list of the major issues without going into page long details on each, or the ways that were put forward to fix them.

[Kraven Kor]

1. Delays in delivery of promised content.
2. Pushing through of unpopular content / changes despite player outcry.
3. Focus on monetization over delivery of a quality product.
4. Lack of faith from player community in the integrity of the developer due to #1 through #3
5. PR issues involving PGI's handling of many player complaints or commentary.
6. Perceived randomness and ineffectiveness of balance changes made to address "meta" builds and tactics.

I think that covers my list.

[Luminarium]

Xanquil, on 16 September 2014 - 11:59 AM, said:

The reasons I stopped playing were for so long were;

1: Prefect instant pinpoint converged alpha strikes. This is the biggest problem this game still has, ad the core of a lot of other problems.
2: Ghost heat. This is in part a result of #1, and fear of heat neutral mechs.
3: ECM this is one of those things that needed an overhaul from the get go, and the fact that it is going to be worked on is part of the reason I'm back playing.
4: Heat scale, and heat sinks. The problems with the heat system were brought up by myself and others during beta and have yet to have anything done to fix it. most of it revolving around the fear of heat neutral mechs and lack of thinking about the future.


That is my short list of the major issues without going into page long details on each, or the ways that were put forward to fix them.

This.

Weapons convergence is the #1 source of balancing issues.

If MWO had a bloom like system (think WOT), where your shots will hit or miss depending on how long you aim at a spot / movement / simple random shot spread - (just like TT), we wouldn't need the gauss charge up mechanic / ghost heat / gauss 2 shots limit - everything would be balanced around re-fire times and heat.

For whatever reason PGI is either ignoring / not willing / not capable of the simplest solution.
There is no shame in admitting they got a mechanic wrong, but they keep trying to make the game something it's not meant to be.

[Malleus011]

The issues, IMHO.


Major Issues:

• Ghost Heat: A widely hated solution to the boating of PP FLD weapons. It partially fixed the problem, but really pushed players to other combinations to do the same thing. A complex issue which will likely require a comprehensive solution.
  
• Low Time-to-Kill: Nearly unlimited customization of IS 'mechs and PP FLD weapons have created very low time-to-kill in most matches. This is very discouraging for new players and doesn't fit the desired 'feel' of giant robot battlefield combat.
  
• Weak Jump Jets: 'Pop-tarting' - using JJ's to perform a low jump and firing at the apex with PP FLD weapons provoked the change that severely under-powered Jump Jets. Current JJ's are far, far short of Canon jump distances and are really only useful for climbing hills and low obstacles. Restoring JJ's to full tactical mobility while not reintroducing pop-tart sniping would be desirable.
  
• ECM: This 1.5 ton module is quite powerful for its weight, and a 'no brainer' to always take when possible. Though not as important in elite team play, lack of ECM in the general que can be a serious issue. Extremely confusing for new players.
  
• Lack of Community Warfare: a reason to keep playing.
  
• Lack of Role Warfare: all 'mechs are essentially combat 'mechs. There is minimal scouting, skirmishing, or other tasks to complete in matches.
  
• Lack of Game Modes/Mission types: We effectively have three flavors of Deathmatch.
  
• Lack of Maps: We have a very small number of maps, many plagued with errors like invisible walls and movement blockers.

Minor Issues:

• Gauss Charge: Nerfed because the combination circumvented Ghost Heat and was extremely powerful. Seriously penalizes 'mechs which rely on a single Gauss. While many players adapted to the charge mechanic, a significant portion of the player base simply abandoned the Gauss rifle entirely. Gauss boating become a problem with Clans and led to a limit of two GR's charging at once. The charge is not canon and faintly ridiculous to 'charge' a weapon which explodes when critted because it is holding a charge ...
  
• PPC speed nerf: Again, imposed because of PP FLD optimization. Seriously penalizes 'mechs which rely on a single PPC.
  
• Victor and Highlander agility nerfs: Imposed due to pop tart meta, now merely makes the chassis sluggish. A minor issue, but should be reverted or at the very least cut in half.
  
• LRMs: MWO struggles with LRM implementation, because general que LRM boating can be extremely effective. Inexperienced players have difficulty coping with the indirect fire mechanic, while elite players rarely bother with such a 'weak' weapons system.
  
• Obsolete Skill system: Many of the Elite skills don't even work. Ideally, this should be reworked with mutually exclusive trees and smaller, more numerous benefits.
  
• The Grind: Buying three chassis of a single type to allow mastery creates a long, expensive grind. Removing the 'three chassis' requirement would make the game more friendly to new players.
  
• High Prices: Many players feel that the prices of Hero 'mechs and cosmetic items such as paints and patterns are too high, and that there are no true 'micro-transaction' options.

Personal Gripes:

• I don't like the modules system; it isn't canon. Why can't we have manufacturer quirks for various parts and pilot/technician skills instead?
  
• Lack of soul/character: The game treats itself like a game. I don't feel like a mechwarrior dropping into missions, I feel like a gamer loading up a deathmatch.
  
• Lack of insignia and canon skins: Why can't I paint and mark my 'mech properly? I'm part of the 10th Skye Rangers, AFFC, but there's no Skye Rangers skin, no LCAF or AFFC insignia, no Ranger's badge ...
  
• No Urbanmech!

And the single biggest issue which MWO struggles with:

• Pinpoint accuracy and front-loaded damage: As can be seen by the above topics, PP FLD has driven many of the nerfs in the game. There have been dozens of good suggestions for alternatives - reticle sway, cone-of-fire, convergence, etc. Many of which could work; but which one? And how to win over the die-hard players who like PP FLD gameplay? This is probably the single biggest root cause of MWO's balance troubles. Fixing THIS issue could easily allow the REMOVAL of most of the above list.

Edited by Malleus011, 16 September 2014 - 12:17 PM.

[TopDawg]

Luminarium, on 16 September 2014 - 12:08 PM, said:

This.

Weapons convergence is the #1 source of balancing issues.

If MWO had a bloom like system (think WOT), where your shots will hit or miss depending on how long you aim at a spot / movement / simple random shot spread - (just like TT), we wouldn't need the gauss charge up mechanic / ghost heat / gauss 2 shots limit - everything would be balanced around re-fire times and heat.

For whatever reason PGI is either ignoring / not willing / not capable of the simplest solution.
There is no shame in admitting they got a mechanic wrong, but they keep trying to make the game something it's not meant to be.

Well, convergence isn't quite the same thing as a COF (cone of fire). In closed beta (and presumably for a while in open beta) there used to be a ~.5-1 second time it would take for the gun to actually aim where you were pointing. This means that if you were aiming at something 500 meters away, and then instantly put your crosshair over something only 50 meters away, it would take that little bit of time to make sure that it would 'converge' and hit your new target. This could also be minimized/mitigated if you were good enough that you could 'lead past' where you were aiming in order to simulate (so to speak) that convergence.

To be honest I was not aware that they removed this.

[Clit Beastwood]

1. Lack of training/mandatory qualification for weight classes. If pilots *had* to take training before they could drop, the quality of piloting on the field would go up and then the only threads we'd have on the forums would be complaining about the mandatory training and qualification. It worked wonders in America's Army. Can't snipe until after sniper school. Can't pass sniper school? Here's training and practice!

TopDawg, on 16 September 2014 - 12:13 PM, said:

Well, convergence isn't quite the same thing as a COF (cone of fire). In closed beta (and presumably for a while in open beta) there used to be a ~.5-1 second time it would take for the gun to actually aim where you were pointing. This means that if you were aiming at something 500 meters away, and then instantly put your crosshair over something only 50 meters away, it would take that little bit of time to make sure that it would 'converge' and hit your new target. This could also be minimized/mitigated if you were good enough that you could 'lead past' where you were aiming in order to simulate (so to speak) that convergence.

To be honest I was not aware that they removed this.

Delayed convergence being removed is one of the reasons dual gauss jagers work again. With delayed convergence there was thread after thread that only one gauss was hitting. Honestly, I'd like to see delayed convergence come back.

[Luminarium]

TopDawg, on 16 September 2014 - 12:13 PM, said:

Well, convergence isn't quite the same thing as a COF (cone of fire). In closed beta (and presumably for a while in open beta) there used to be a ~.5-1 second time it would take for the gun to actually aim where you were pointing. This means that if you were aiming at something 500 meters away, and then instantly put your crosshair over something only 50 meters away, it would take that little bit of time to make sure that it would 'converge' and hit your new target. This could also be minimized/mitigated if you were good enough that you could 'lead past' where you were aiming in order to simulate (so to speak) that convergence.

To be honest I was not aware that they removed this.

Cone of fire mechanic could be a fix in MWO. It wouldn't even have to bloom out, they could make it so the more weapons you fire at the same time, the higher the "cone of fire" gets or give it a random number generator that doesn't always hit in the same spot. Not necessarily missing the target, but at least spreading the shot over a larger area, they could make that apply to certain weapons like PPC / Gauss.

That way if you fire 4 ppc at the same time, 2 would hit CT, 1 would hit an arm, 1 would hit a leg. Combined that with a huge heat spike, you no longer have an instant kill scenario. Similarly with gauss, 1 would hit CT the other one would hit LT / RT. You still do 30 dmg just not in the same tiny area.

[Clit Beastwood]

Luminarium, on 16 September 2014 - 12:19 PM, said:

Cone of fire mechanic could be a fix in MWO. It wouldn't even have to bloom out, they could make it so the more weapons you fire at the same time, the higher the "cone of fire" gets or give it a random number generator that doesn't always hit in the same spot. Not necessarily missing the target, but at least spreading the shot over a larger area, they could make that apply to certain weapons like PPC / Gauss.

That way if you fire 4 ppc at the same time, 2 would hit CT, 1 would hit an arm, 1 would hit a leg. Combined that with a huge heat spike, you no longer have an instant kill scenario. Similarly with gauss, 1 would hit CT the other one would hit LT / RT. You still do 30 dmg just not in the same tiny area.

Eh - nerfing the ability to aim sucks. If I spend time in testing grounds using it as a practice range, it should matter. It makes sense at that point that I can place all my shots on a specific body section, whereas a new guy in a trial mech is light sabering. I could see some COF for ballistics, but it wouldn't make any sense for energy weapons. At least with ballistics other than gauss you could pretend it's recoil. Gauss won't kick due to the magnetically accelerated nature of the weapon.

Edited by Fierostetz, 16 September 2014 - 12:23 PM.

[Khobai]

these are what I consider the three biggest issues with the game:

1) poor new player experience/player retention (the lack of tutorials, long grind, fast time to kill, etc... all contribute to this)
2) nothing to spend money on that I actually want (last thing I need is more mechs)
3) poor mech/weapon balance and lack of role warfare/proper skill trees

the game obviously has other problems but those three problems are seriously hampering the game financially.

[DocBach]

Khobai, on 16 September 2014 - 12:23 PM, said:

3) poor mech/weapon balance and lack of role warfare/proper skill trees

the pilot trees suck. I hate having to own three of the same mech and level the exact same skills for them.

[EvilCow]

Without writing a wall of text:
- ecm
- ghost heat
- convergence
- generic slots
- 3pv
- coolant
- heat scale
- some remaining balance issues
- long standing bugs
- lack of maps
- lack of game modes

Except for the above, it is a great game.

[Wolfways]

For me personally:

Memory Allocation Error: Mostly every other match, but sometimes can go half a dozen matches or two in the same match.

ECM: It's not ECM.

Mad Dog Prime invasion variant: I want to buy one.

Maps: Too small for role warfare.

Clan v IS: No 10 v 12. Even if clans and IS were balanced first i still want 10 v 12.

Stock mechs usually are not viable because of the small ammo/ton and the heat system (and no trueDubs).

LRM's: They suck and can't be balanced properly because new/bad players can't handle indirect-fire, and ECM.

Customization: Full customization removes the point of some mechs due to others being better at the role after being customized.

Edited by Wolfways, 16 September 2014 - 12:41 PM.