353 replies to this topic

[ramjb]

Lynx7725, on 19 September 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

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Which bloody LRM spec give a toss about damage. I carry 1980 LRMs into combat, for a cap of 2178 damage. At current LRM accuracy level, I must do 650+ damage to be considered average. Kills doesn't matter, assists doesn't matter; if you are a LRM specialist helping the team to win is the only criteria that matters.

If you deal so much damage but still loses, then you aren't supporting the team properly.

I guess the 8 kills in three games doesn't count for anything. In one of the losses I destroyed one quarter of their team on my own. In the win, I killed a whooping 33% of their team, and had that Awesome not returned from the disconnected world, we'd lost aswell. That I guess also means nothing. I wasn't supporting my team properly.

That damage, btw is against big boys mostly, and those of course soak a lot of damage before dying.

AS for winning/losing, a single guy sometimes can't make a difference. My 8 kill achievement I got it... in a game I lost (Orion-P, 8 kills, game ended 11-12).



I guess I didn't support my team well in that one either.

Soooo, yeah, whatever you say, mate. Whatever you say.

Edited by ramjb, 19 September 2014 - 09:25 PM.

[Lynx7725]

ramjb, on 19 September 2014 - 09:21 PM, said:

I guess the 8 kills in three games doesn't count for anything. In one of the losses I destroyed one quarter of their team on my own. In the win, I killed a whooping 33% of their team, and had that Awesome not returned from the disconnected world, we'd lost as well. That I guess also means nothing. I wasn't supporting my team properly.

No. It doesn't count as anything.


Big damage numbers from a LRM boat is nothing. You get to fire from early in the match and you get to continuously do it. If a DF mech can do it without attracting undue attention they can do it too. Longer survival times means more time to do damage and that's fundamental knowledge.

Kills are not meaningful to a LRM boat because it can happen just because your missiles in flight already came down at the right time. It's nice to have, but not a critical judge.

WINS. The only measure worth talking about if you are doing LRM support. It doesn't matter if you kill 11 mechs and lose, because you didn't win. You can kill all 11 by getting to the big enemy push too late to support your teammates and get missiles randomly into Red locations and got the kills, but it's still a loss.

I have a game screenshot up where I scored 900+ damage and no kills. We won. That's what matters.

You want to know something? LRM Indirect can be easy to do. But that just means as a support your responsibility to use it to support your team increases accordingly. As a LRM Specialist you are not there to score kills or roll big damage, you are there solely to help your team to WIN.

[Ghogiel]

Lynx7725, on 19 September 2014 - 09:41 PM, said:

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No. It doesn't count as anything.


Big damage numbers from a LRM boat is nothing. You get to fire from early in the match and you get to continuously do it. If a DF mech can do it without attracting undue attention they can do it too. Longer survival times means more time to do damage and that's fundamental knowledge.

Kills are not meaningful to a LRM boat because it can happen just because your missiles in flight already came down at the right time. It's nice to have, but not a critical judge.

WINS. The only measure worth talking about if you are doing LRM support. It doesn't matter if you kill 11 mechs and lose, because you didn't win. You can kill all 11 by getting to the big enemy push too late to support your teammates and get missiles randomly into Red locations and got the kills, but it's still a loss.

I have a game screenshot up where I scored 900+ damage and no kills. We won. That's what matters.

You want to know something? LRM Indirect can be easy to do. But that just means as a support your responsibility to use it to support your team increases accordingly. As a LRM Specialist you are not there to score kills or roll big damage, you are there solely to help your team to WIN.

well to be fair, as they cannot pinpoint thier dam at all, high dam is the only thing lrms should be doing really.

[ramjb]

Lynx7725, on 19 September 2014 - 09:41 PM, said:

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You want to know something? LRM Indirect can be easy to do. But that just means as a support your responsibility to use it to support your team increases accordingly. As a LRM Specialist you are not there to score kills or roll big damage, you are there solely to help your team to WIN.

I'lll try to remember next time that to kill a Timberwolf that was massacring one of our heavies is not helping my team. Nor is to kill an Atlas. Those were 2 of my 3 kills in the Crimson loss. The third was a stalker. Erasing a LRM assault from the battlefield is also useless for your team.

I guess that also means that if I'm in a game where I hit nothing, get no damage, get no kills, die early but the other 11 guys in my team carry me to victory, then I've done a great job. Because my team has won. Right?.

You, sir, are really clueless.Big damages and kills indeed help your team to WIN. The damage means stripped armor, destroyed components and much easier to kill enemies. The Kills means removed firepower from the battlefield and being closer in the score to winning.
If the team then is unable to WIN because they can't WIN being a collection of skilless useless players who wouldn't be able to win even at tic-tac-toe, is not -my- fault, but -theirs-.

I think the Orion game screenshot has gone way PAST your head and that you don't grasp it at all.... You can carry as hard as you can, you can even wipe 66% of the enemy team out by yourself. The other 4 will win the game if the other 11 guys in your team are worthless. And that applies to the Orion pic as much as it applies to a 803 damage game with 3 kills. Again, that's 25% of the enemy team wiped out by 8% of your own team assets (and all of them BIG guys with great firepower). You would expect the other 92% of your team to have an easy time on the enemy team's 75%.

If they don't win, is not your fault.

Edited by ramjb, 20 September 2014 - 03:31 AM.

[Lynx7725]

ramjb, on 20 September 2014 - 03:29 AM, said:

You, sir, are really clueless.Big damages and kills indeed help your team to WIN. The damage means stripped armor, destroyed components and much easier to kill enemies. The Kills means removed firepower from the battlefield and being closer in the score to winning.

Wrong. Quick kills wins. Because quick kills remove firepower from the battlefield. Which is why FLD is so good. Which is why big damage is no good -- you want to kill thing with the least amount of damage possible, so that it's immediately over. The longer you get to roll damage, the longer the enemy has to inflict damage on you, potentially killing your entire team before you can kill them.

That is difficult to achieve, so LRMs are used because indirect fire enables DF to kill things faster later. If you can see that point, why are you still having problems with LRMs?

ramjb, on 20 September 2014 - 03:29 AM, said:

If the team then is unable to WIN because they can't WIN being a collection of skilless useless players who wouldn't be able to win even at tic-tac-toe, is not -my- fault, but -theirs-.

If you keep fobbing the blame off to the rest of the team, you cannot improve. This is a team game. You have to integrate with the rest of the team to win it. I don't win every game. I do blame the team at times. But at the end of it, I recognize I'm not good enough with my tools to consistently win, and I strive to improve my own game. I can't do that if I keep telling myself that my performance is because of a sucky team.

[ramjb]

Ace of spades in a loss, in a heavy mech. Yep. I lost because this is a team game and as we didn't win, I failed to integrate with the team and must've carried harder. 8 kills is not enough it seems.

As you say this is a team game, if your team sucks, your team sucks. I know when i've underperformed and when I haven't done so. And sometimes I know I've underperformed in wins, and I know I've done a heck of a job in a loss. Your argument simply doesn't stand the simplest rational analysis. Is as simple as tyat.

[hercules1981]

So this guy comes back after being gone for a while. Jump snipe meta almost completely gone, guess he has to find something else to start complaining about to cover his bad play. Yeah LRMS flight path may or may not be messed up but I would rather then work on so may other things then worry about that.

[Joshua Obrien]

hercules1981, on 20 September 2014 - 04:49 AM, said:

So this guy comes back after being gone for a while. Jump snipe meta almost completely gone, guess he has to find something else to start complaining about to cover his bad play. Yeah LRMS flight path may or may not be messed up but I would rather then work on so may other things then worry about that.

Lol cover my bad play. You're a funny one you are. I wasn't complaining about the damage or the speed or that they're in need of a nerf. I think they need their arc tweaked so they don't fly over almost every cover that should block them. Learn to read man.

[Wolfways]

Joshua Obrien, on 20 September 2014 - 01:24 PM, said:

Lol cover my bad play. You're a funny one you are. I wasn't complaining about the damage or the speed or that they're in need of a nerf. I think they need their arc tweaked so they don't fly over almost every cover that should block them. Learn to read man.

As PGI are the ones making the game and deciding how high the arc should be doesn't that mean that missiles do only fly over cover that they should?

[Joshua Obrien]

Wolfways, on 20 September 2014 - 01:35 PM, said:

As PGI are the ones making the game and deciding how high the arc should be doesn't that mean that missiles do only fly over cover that they should?

Lol they way you word that makes me unable to argue that fact with you. You have stumped me good sir.

[Wolfways]

Joshua Obrien, on 20 September 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

Lol they way you word that makes me unable to argue that fact with you. You have stumped me good sir.

I'm not saying you cant disagree with their decision though

[Moomtazz]

El Bandito, on 17 September 2014 - 04:24 PM, said:

most of the good players I know have no problem against LRMs.

Killed you at lunch with my super difficult to use LRM MadDawg. No Narc involved.

[Scratx]

Moomtazz, on 24 September 2014 - 01:14 PM, said:

Killed you at lunch with my super difficult to use LRM MadDawg. No Narc involved.

And TheBeef has killed people with his Partyback... with nine small pulse lasers.

Your point?

Weapons kill, that's what they're designed to do, everyone will die to any weapon at some point if they play long enough. Yes, don't feel humiliated when you see "Flamer" as the last weapon you got hit with.

[Astarte]

Sorry but if i'm behind cover and get "Incoming missles" just move to the side a good deal and you'll avoid 90% of them.