75 replies to this topic

[StraferX]

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Last night was horrid, with every player and his mom coming out of the closet to play for XP x2 weekend the servers went from nice to zippering and rubber banding and not worth playing. I generaly have 50 ~ 80 ping as I live right off the backbone.

#1 The answer to everything posted in this thread is to get PGI to stop playing with normalizing pings and implement regional servers You say not enough population for regional servers. see #2

#2 To populate regional servers and MWO in general, stop charging $30 for a mech $5 for 1 paint color and give us more than 8 lame maps.

#3 turn the game code over to the modding community this way we can have pure MWO servers from PGI and I can run my own modded server with maps, fresh game styles and custom league play adminship.

[Kiiyor]

StraferX, on 20 September 2014 - 04:50 AM, said:

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Last night was horrid, with every player and his mom coming out of the closet to play for XP x2 weekend the servers went from nice to zippering and rubber banding and not worth playing. I generaly have 50 ~ 80 ping as I live right off the backbone.

#1 The answer to everything posted in this thread is to get PGI to stop playing with normalizing pings and implement regional servers You say not enough population for regional servers. see #2

#2 To populate regional servers and MWO in general, stop charging $30 for a mech $5 for 1 paint color and give us more than 8 lame maps.

#3 turn the game code over to the modding community this way we can have pure MWO servers from PGI and I can run my own modded server with maps, fresh game styles and custom league play adminship.

A nice thought, but never going to happen. My gut feeling is that the fanbase isn't large enough, and no amount of cost cutting will fix that.

New players need to be patient and determined to become competitive. Why would they bother when there shooters with far more instant gratification? The existing player base likely has deep roots in the franchise. Lowering costs will probably not provide the influx of players than you think.

The players that pay for mechs are the ones that want to pay for mechs. The publisher formally known as charged the prices they did because MW fans would pay it. I think if prices were lowered, the same number of people would likely be buying mechs, at a lower cost. Less profit. Maybe.

[Fut]

Foxfire, on 19 September 2014 - 10:12 PM, said:

PGI's solution is to guarantee that Sub 50 ping acts like 200+ ping. Seems that the 'sweet' spot for avoiding wonky hit detection issue is ~150 ping.

Seems like you're trying your hardest to blame PGI for this, but I don't think it's their fault.
I highly doubt that they somehow coded their game to screw people with decent connections over. The reason I doubt this, is because I have a good connection (I'm in Ontario, so fairly close-ish to their servers, and normally my ping is 30 or lower) and I rarely have issues.

It's the internet, it's not perfect and it's not PGI's fault.

[That Dawg]

iDame, on 19 September 2014 - 10:20 PM, said:

I play with 250~320 ping and the game works great. Only time I feel my ping is trying ballistics on a light mech.

OMG...its one of them!

My ping, mid 30's most times I play.
I get the desync bug, booted to desktop once a night. Getting better than it was, so...just gonna hang in there.

[ApolloKaras]

This is common in any shooter that has a server side hit detection. Battlefield 3 comes to mind and acts the same way, you're running around go behind cover and die. On your screen you died behind cover on his screen he shot you before you got there.

The same actions are happening, the pilot that shot you saw the events a split second later. There isn't a disadvantage here. You aren't being penalized for having a low ping. If there was no HSR and we had a zero latency environment he still would have shot you. It's not HSR that killed you, it was definitely the shooter.

Edited by Saxie, 20 September 2014 - 05:47 AM.

[El Bandito]

NORMALIZE ALL THE PINGS!

[Dracol]

Foxfire, on 19 September 2014 - 10:40 PM, said:

That makes sense if.. say, I wasn't in cover at the time that I get hit...

Tonight I've had my back obliterated in total cover once, three times I've had a leg blown off.. and once was absolutely raked over the coals and left so damanged across my front that I dare not show my face.

You had your back taken out.... so you couldn't see who shot you. So you have no way of knowing if they did have LOS to you, correct? Which means, at least for your deaths due to being shot in the back, their could be another cause instead of HSR.

Edited by Dracol, 20 September 2014 - 06:41 AM.

[nehebkau]

You could always ask PGI to adjust MM to match people with similar pings.

[Void Angel]

Griggio, on 20 September 2014 - 12:53 AM, said:

No one's blaming high pingers for ruining the game or being bad people. It's the nature of things in online games and it's a better solution than running in a world where low ping players crush high ping players based only on the quality of their connection.

Except the OP.

[FREDtheDEAD]

Dark DeLaurel, on 19 September 2014 - 06:55 PM, said:

'you say you are having 0% packet loss, how are you measuring this?

You can't...UDP packets aren't guaranteed to arrive at their target at all and there's no way to test for UDP drops. You have to trust that UDP will be handled like TCP and it often isn't. Routers will drop UDP before TCP if they're stressed.

---

High ping players have the same problems and are less agile in light mechs. Unless you can make electricity and light go faster, lag compensation is what it is and MWO does a good a job with HSR as any game at the moment.

Edited by Xajorkith, 20 September 2014 - 07:35 AM.

[FREDtheDEAD]

StraferX, on 20 September 2014 - 04:50 AM, said:

QQQqqqQQQQqQQQQqqqQ

Last night was horrid, with every player and his mom coming out of the closet to play for XP x2 weekend the servers went from nice to zippering and rubber banding and not worth playing. I generaly have 50 ~ 80 ping as I live right off the backbone.

#1 The answer to everything posted in this thread is to get PGI to stop playing with normalizing pings and implement regional servers You say not enough population for regional servers. see #2

#2 To populate regional servers and MWO in general, stop charging $30 for a mech $5 for 1 paint color and give us more than 8 lame maps.

#3 turn the game code over to the modding community this way we can have pure MWO servers from PGI and I can run my own modded server with maps, fresh game styles and custom league play adminship.

#1. Not enough players. HSR isn't "normalising" pings.

#2. It costs PGI $500,000 a month to run MWO. More purchases at lower prices doesn't make them the money they need. There are economic models that let companies work out their pricing points and how changing them affects numbers.

#3. Will NEVER happen. Ever. Not the slightest chance.

Some of these things were discussed in the online "town hall meeting"

[Dark DeLaurel]

Foxfire, on 20 September 2014 - 04:18 AM, said:

The thing is, it is hard to to really get proof without using a way that doesn't compromise your game speed(by either loading down your connection or adding load to your computer). Anecdotal evidence is really all that can be gathered to demonstrate this without setting up a way to monitor the game that doesn't impact those two aspects.

Xajorkith, on 20 September 2014 - 07:34 AM, said:

You can't...UDP packets aren't guaranteed to arrive at their target at all and there's no way to test for UDP drops. You have to trust that UDP will be handled like TCP and it often isn't. Routers will drop UDP before TCP if they're stressed.

---

High ping players have the same problems and are less agile in light mechs. Unless you can make electricity and light go faster, lag compensation is what it is and MWO does a good a job with HSR as any game at the moment.

That is correct UDP has zero verification, but there is programs out there that can piggyback along side and give a rough estimate of loss. Which in the end is still better than nothing, and if you have a sub 50 ping taking on an extra 10ms is not going to kill you.

[Glythe]

Dark DeLaurel, on 19 September 2014 - 10:28 PM, said:

have any proof that they are actually griefing sub 100 people?

Long long ago during the lag shield era people did tests.

The best lights combined the inherent lag shield with something to slow down their connection. You'd see 300 ms ravens literally register zero damage. I remember a game where one guy held off against 6+ mechs (at least half were assaults) in a single grid for about 3 minutes while we did 1% of the damage we should have been doing to him.

Ballistics/missiles/ppc register well against laggy targets but strangely enough lasers still seem the most wonky.


I've been playing since the beginning and I can tell you that 100 ping is better than 10 ping. The server seems more forgiving about where you shoot and you seem to do better shooting targets.

[Ghogiel]

Glythe, on 20 September 2014 - 06:50 PM, said:

Long long ago during the lag shield era people did tests.

The best lights combined the inherent lag shield with something to slow down their connection. You'd see 300 ms ravens literally register zero damage. I remember a game where one guy held off against 6+ mechs (at least half were assaults) in a single grid for about 3 minutes while we did 1% of the damage we should have been doing to him.

Ballistics/missiles/ppc register well against laggy targets but strangely enough lasers still seem the most wonky.


I've been playing since the beginning and I can tell you that 100 ping is better than 10 ping. The server seems more forgiving about where you shoot and you seem to do better shooting targets.

Only pre HSR. Those tests demonstrated that a high ping was better lag shield armor. Conversely, playing at a high ping also gave everyone else better lag shield armor too.

But that is mostly irrelevent these days. Except it's not.. you are correct about the lasers. My anecdote is contray to yours. For me the worst mechs are high level NA comp lights with sub 50ms pings. I am a master at removing the comp russian teams SDRs from the field no problem. Go figure.

Edited by Ghogiel, 20 September 2014 - 07:11 PM.

[Dark DeLaurel]

Glythe, on 20 September 2014 - 06:50 PM, said:

Long long ago during the lag shield era people did tests.

The best lights combined the inherent lag shield with something to slow down their connection. You'd see 300 ms ravens literally register zero damage. I remember a game where one guy held off against 6+ mechs (at least half were assaults) in a single grid for about 3 minutes while we did 1% of the damage we should have been doing to him.

Ballistics/missiles/ppc register well against laggy targets but strangely enough lasers still seem the most wonky.


I've been playing since the beginning and I can tell you that 100 ping is better than 10 ping. The server seems more forgiving about where you shoot and you seem to do better shooting targets.

Oh i remember those days very well, but re-read my quote of him and even mine.

Also test like that were conducted before a lot changed with HSR and now private servers, I still encounter the unkillable light which is annoying as hell. Having hard evidence that PGI is actually griefing low ping players is what i want to see, which is what i asked.

[Moonlander]

StraferX, on 20 September 2014 - 04:50 AM, said:

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Is this the first time you've experienced online gaming? Hell, I think I have more latency issues on my Xbox1 or my PS4 than I ever do in MWO. Even in WoW, I've had huge amounts of latency on a regular basis.

I've maybe DC'd or lagged out 3-4 times in my 70hrs played... and since the patch, not at all... but it was so infrequent before, I doubt it would happen since. However, I haven't heard anyone complain about latency or anything in a drop since.

[Kain Demos]

For some reason despite my 90mbps connection speed my ping is always 90-96 in this game.

So weird as most other games I'm in the teens or twenties.

[Vezm]

Can you please tell some hungry children in Africa that you don't like what you had for dinner as well please?

Not having to lead 2-5 target lengths with lasers? Yes please.

[Griggio]

Kain Thul, on 20 September 2014 - 11:20 PM, said:

For some reason despite my 90mbps connection speed my ping is always 90-96 in this game.

So weird as most other games I'm in the teens or twenties.

That could be as result of the routes your connection takes to the server. I like to think not all paths area created equal, especially if your hopping through the networks of other ISP's in other locations. I usually bounce around between 60-80, but I have spiked up to 500+ on occasion.

From what I've read you could eliminate "shot around the corner syndrome" by making everything client authoritative, but do we really want things to be run client side? That would be truly nightmarish.

[StraferX]

Moonlander, on 20 September 2014 - 09:23 PM, said:

Is this the first time you've experienced online gaming? Hell, I think I have more latency issues on my Xbox1 or my PS4 than I ever do in MWO. Even in WoW, I've had huge amounts of latency on a regular basis.

I've maybe DC'd or lagged out 3-4 times in my 70hrs played... and since the patch, not at all... but it was so infrequent before, I doubt it would happen since. However, I haven't heard anyone complain about latency or anything in a drop since.

No actualy I have been playing online games for over 20 years and with the lag experienced in todays games is sad. One would think that in 20 years they would have mastered the internet. In my line of work if i had not mastered my craft in 20 years I would have been out of business long ago. poor code is poor code.