184 replies to this topic

[Jman5]

1/1/1/1 is troubling because it punishes the mid-low ton mechs within a weight class. What advantage do I gain bringing a 45 ton blackjack when my opponent brings a 55 ton shadowhawk? Or why would I bring a 25 ton Commando over a 35 ton Firestarter?

[Joseph Mallan]

Jman5, on 25 September 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

1/1/1/1 is troubling because it punishes the mid-low ton mechs within a weight class. What advantage do I gain bringing a 45 ton blackjack when my opponent brings a 55 ton shadowhawk? Or why would I bring a 25 ton Commando over a 35 ton Firestarter?

I would bring what I bring cause it is the Mech I am best in in that class. So if I am a rock god in a Blackjack I am not bringing a Griffin cause its heavier.

[Fut]

Joseph Mallan, on 25 September 2014 - 09:54 AM, said:

I would bring what I bring cause it is the Mech I am best in in that class. So if I am a rock god in a Blackjack I am not bringing a Griffin cause its heavier.

Perfectly stated, Joseph.
This is also the reason why I don't like the 1L/1M/1H/1A set up. I'm a dedicated Medium Mech Pilot, I don't like the idea of being forced into 3 additional weight classes.

[keith]

Kushko, on 25 September 2014 - 09:31 AM, said:

I actually got a response from Russ in the feedback mail saying that he is in favor of a tonnage limit, so now we just have to convince Paul...and we all know how easy that can be.

As for strict lore, i think thats pretty much out the window with each player having their own Dropship and respawning in to a new body/running back to the dropship from a destroyed mech and coming back up to 4 times in 30minutes. Also even if we did strictly follow lore it wouldn't actually support the 1/1/1/1 either so lore is pretty much on noones side.

then bring on the tonnage limit:P played in many of leagues based on tonnage not limits of mechs weight class. they are bring more flavor to the game.

[Zyllos]

Having a pod limit with a limit of tonnage is the best way forward.

It promotes the use of non-maximum tonnage mechs along with allowing variable re spawns.

So you can have a heavy drop with fewer reinforcements or lighter drop with more reinforcements. The way I look at this, is that it will allow players with lighter mechs to be more aggressive. Protection of those heavier mechs become more important as you will see less of them being reinforced as the battle progresses.

[Pjwned]

stjobe, on 25 September 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:

Learn to pilot all weight classes, it's good for you.

While I can agree it's good to have experience with each weight class, it's still a tremendous pain in the ass to acquire heavy & assault mechs due to all the grind required.

There's nothing wrong with letting people choose their mechs more freely if they want 2-3 heavy/assault mechs or 4 medium/light mechs if that's what they're most comfortable with.

[Durant Carlyle]

Jman5, on 25 September 2014 - 09:51 AM, said:

1/1/1/1 is troubling because it punishes the mid-low ton mechs within a weight class. What advantage do I gain bringing a 45 ton blackjack when my opponent brings a 55 ton shadowhawk? Or why would I bring a 25 ton Commando over a 35 ton Firestarter?

Forcing four different weight classes is better than people just loading up on Timber Wolves and bringing a Locust to fill the extra tonnage.

And people won't be taking the different weight classes at the same time. Your Blackjack might be going up against their Locust and your Commando might be going up against their Atlas -- you never know.

Fut, on 25 September 2014 - 09:57 AM, said:

This is also the reason why I don't like the 1L/1M/1H/1A set up. I'm a dedicated Medium Mech Pilot, I don't like the idea of being forced into 3 additional weight classes.

I much prefer lights to anything else. But I'm very much in favor of 4x1 rather than running into the same pilot in three Timber Wolves.

Besides, it's more fair that everyone drops the same number of times (four), rather than the extreme of someone dropping 10 times in Locusts versus someone else dropping twice in Atlases.

[Eddrick]

The problem I have with a set limit on Tonnage/number of Mechs I can bring is I do best with Mechs around 50-65 Tons. Assaults are not agile enough for my taste and Lights are to weak for my taste. I do best with Mechs right around the middle of the Tonnage scale. Both Set Tonnage Limits and 1/1/1/1 force me to use something I don't want to use. Because, of the min/max limit of 4 Mechs.

[Bront]

I like the Tonnage/Mech limit mix.

No more than 4 mechs, no more than 250 tons, and no more than 2 of the same mech weight class. For clanners, that would mean the Dire Wolf, Timberwolf, Nova, and Mist Lynx, though you could use the Ice Ferrit and Kit Fix instead. If they do indeed use 2 Timberwolves, that's 100 tons left with no heavies, which would mean 2 Novas, or a Storm Crow and Ice Ferrit, or somethine like that.

I don't mind the 1/1/1/1, but I do agree tonnage limits help make odd sized mechs worth more.

Heck, require 4 mechs, but 250 tons (or 235, or whatever) and no other limits. Want 2 Atli and 2 commandos? Go for it. Want to bring 4 Shadowhawks? Go for it.

Remember, tonnage isn't always everything.The Cicada has a place in the medium meta due to ECM and speed, yet it's not a 55 tonner, as can the Hunchie. The Catapults and Jagers still work just fine despite having lower tonnage than the Cataphrats or Orions, and Stalkers can be more useful than Atlases at times.

[Durant Carlyle]

Pjwned, on 25 September 2014 - 10:05 AM, said:

...it's still a tremendous pain in the ass to acquire heavy & assault mechs due to all the grind required.

You don't have to. You'll be using the semi-optimized Champion 'Mechs for classes you don't possess. Much better than stock, and much better than nothing at all.

[Fut]

Durant Carlyle, on 25 September 2014 - 10:05 AM, said:

I much prefer lights to anything else. But I'm very much in favor of 4x1 rather than running into the same pilot in three Timber Wolves.

Besides, it's more fair that everyone drops the same number of times (four), rather than the extreme of someone dropping 10 times in Locusts versus someone else dropping twice in Atlases.

This is a really good point. If 22 of the people in game have 4 Mechs each, and the last 2 only brought 1000 Locusts, everybody in game would have to wait until they cycled through all their Mechs before the match would end. The whine would be legendary.

Perhaps a system where each person gets 4 Mechs, and the team as a whole has a weight limit they must adhere to? So if one bozo takes 4 100 tonne Mechs, the rest of his team will have to convince him to lighten up a bit, or work with the tonnage they have left.

Bront, on 25 September 2014 - 10:07 AM, said:

Remember, tonnage isn't always everything.The Cicada has a place in the medium meta due to ECM and speed, yet it's not a 55 tonner, as can the Hunchie. The Catapults and Jagers still work just fine despite having lower tonnage than the Cataphrats or Orions, and Stalkers can be more useful than Atlases at times.

The two Mechs I use.

Edited by Fut, 25 September 2014 - 10:14 AM.

[Xyroc]

stjobe, on 25 September 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:

Learn to pilot all weight classes, it's good for you.

Most of us that have been around here for a while can .. but this is not the point of the post.

[Bromineberry]

Tonnage Limit would be much better, with 200-250 tons for 4 mechs. Being forced to play a weight class, that you absolutely hate is no fun at all.

[Pjwned]

Durant Carlyle, on 25 September 2014 - 10:07 AM, said:

You don't have to. You'll be using the semi-optimized Champion 'Mechs for classes you don't possess. Much better than stock, and much better than nothing at all.

I'm not thrilled about using mechs that I don't want, so no I actually don't think it's much better than nothing.

[Xyroc]

4 mech / 200 tonne limit ... no weight class restrictions.

Edited by Beliall, 25 September 2014 - 10:18 AM.

[DEMAX51]

I wholeheartedly agree that tonnage limits is the way to go. I suggested this the instant Paul brought Dropship Mode back into the conversation.

I imagine they'll still have to limit people to no more than 4 'Mechs (for technical reasons, it seems like that's about the most their servers can handle), but tonnage limits would go a long way toward restricting people from bringing the biggest 'Mechs in each weight class.

I would think something around 240 tons would be just about right (average of 60 tons per 'Mech, which makes sense to me, because 60 tons is the median weight in the range of 20-100 tons - also, this is exactly the amount of tonnage needed to take two 100 ton 'Mechs and two 20 ton 'Mechs).

I really, really hope they do this.

Edited by DEMAX51, 25 September 2014 - 10:25 AM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Why has this not caused a bigger stir?!


I have several Hunchbacks because I need at least 3 to level them. Why can I only use 1 of the Mechs that I have to acquire in bulk-numbers in order to play the game as intended by the Developers? This defies the leveling system!

[stjobe]

Tonnage limits would simply mean that there'd be a lot of people dropping with three heavies and suiciding when their 20-tonner was up because "I only play [insert (usually heavy or assault) 'mech of choice here]".

Just learn to play one of each weight class and drop with those - or use the Champions that will be provided if you choose not to choose.

It's no big deal, you can play your single variant as much as you want in the non-CW queue.

[Screech]

Hobo Dan, on 25 September 2014 - 08:56 AM, said:

I take your suggestion a step further but also drop to 200ton max. No mech limit at all, so if someone wants to bring 10 Locusts, they can.

I really hope someone at PGI is considering this. I could think of no change for CW that could do more good for the amount of resources needed to achieve it. It would allow for even more granularity when trying to balance clan vs IS allowing you to use tonnage in place of mechs as a balancing factor. It would naturally increase the value of light and even mediums without any nerfing to heavies and assaults. It would allow for asymmetrical encounters and increase ten-fold viable tactics and mechs.

It is simple and elegant. I like.

[Xyroc]

stjobe, on 25 September 2014 - 10:21 AM, said:

Tonnage limits would simply mean that there'd be a lot of people dropping with three heavies and suiciding when their 20-tonner was up because "I only play [insert (usually heavy or assault) 'mech of choice here]".

Just learn to play one of each weight class and drop with those - or use the Champions that will be provided if you choose not to choose.

It's no big deal, you can play your single variant as much as you want in the non-CW queue.

So as they continue to suicide and help the enemy they will lose the match ... I belive they will 1) change their ways 2) stop playing dropship mode. Either way oh well no one wants a sh***y team mate.

Edited by Beliall, 25 September 2014 - 10:27 AM.