349 replies to this topic

[Tesunie]

Widowmaker1981, on 07 November 2014 - 05:00 PM, said:

erm, some lore im not aware of?

im a BT fan, since playing TT with my older brother 20 years ago, but i am far from a roleplayer lol, i will do whatever i think gives me the best chance of winning, without cheating

Clans tend to find more honor with bidding fewer/lighter forces into a battle. The less that they can use to achieve victory, the more honor that they may gain. However, a defeat is still a dishonorable result. Thus, in clan warrior terms, more risk, more reward.

[Widowmaker1981]

Tesunie, on 07 November 2014 - 06:10 PM, said:

Clans tend to find more honor with bidding fewer/lighter forces into a battle. The less that they can use to achieve victory, the more honor that they may gain. However, a defeat is still a dishonorable result. Thus, in clan warrior terms, more risk, more reward.

Ah, Honor. has no place in war - you kill me, or i kill you. Honor is for when we are being civilized, and trying to kill each other is not being civilized.

Probably not the most clan way of thinking, but im far from a roleplayer as i said. i just think the clan mechs look better tbh. (except the Fridgefreezer Ferret, that got hit over the head with the ugly stick, then had the ugly piano dropped on its head)

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 07 November 2014 - 07:14 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Lucian Nostra, on 27 September 2014 - 08:03 AM, said:

As I said in another thread about the new mechs the Gargoyle is a wait and see kind of mech. We know it's speed, it's hardpoints but we don't know how it actually handles.

If it runs around like Victors used to than I can see it being very good. If it handles like a fat slug than forget it.

Don't forget hit boxes. If it has good hit boxes, can utilize torso twisting and generally tank then it might actually be better than a Dire Wolf or Warhawk despite its rather limited firepower and semi light armor. If it can tank and move well because of thaat 400XL, well it could be a damn fine mech.

However, it has just as big a potential to flop as be a success.

[White Bear 84]

LordLosh, on 26 September 2014 - 05:12 PM, said:

Do you even Play Assault mechs or bother to look at the hard points? It will have one good load out you can make with being a 8 point laser boat. the other maybe a in your face brawler with **** for ammo. A Decent mech yeah maybe, a Dire wolf killer lol your a troll. So I will warn everyone else not to feed you. Executioner had a chance with or without MASC but until then all hail and worship dire whale *for clan assault.

All praise the 20 tonne locust!

Grimwill, on 26 September 2014 - 04:42 PM, said:

What do you guys think of the gargoyle going toe to toe with the Dire wolf? Do you think the gargoyle has what it takes to dethrone the king of battle? Personally i like it and i can't wait to see the end of dire wolf's..

Forget the Gargoyle, there is only one rightful King on the Battlefield...

Edited by White Bear 84, 10 November 2014 - 07:36 PM.

[Kain Demos]

White Bear 84, on 10 November 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

All praise the 20 tonne locust!



Forget the Gargoyle, there is only one rightful King on the Battlefield...

My Dire Wolves are ready to eat seafood.

[White Bear 84]

Kain Thul, on 10 November 2014 - 09:11 PM, said:

My Dire Wolves are ready to eat seafood.

(Im too lazy to change the image.. )

[Tesunie]

King Crab will basically be, for all intents and purposes, an IS Direwolf... Trust me, many of the builds a Direwolf can make, the King Crab can probably be able to copy. (It should, hard point inflation dependent, be able to even copy the "fabled" dual PPC and dual Gauss loadout of the Direwolf. Possibly even with SRM options (or LRMs for people like me).)

[HlynkaCG]

Tesunie, on 10 November 2014 - 10:13 PM, said:

King Crab will basically be, for all intents and purposes, an IS Direwolf... Trust me, many of the builds a Direwolf can make, the King Crab can probably be able to copy. (It should, hard point inflation dependent, be able to even copy the "fabled" dual PPC and dual Gauss loadout of the Direwolf. Possibly even with SRM options (or LRMs for people like me).)

If we get the KGC-010 it wont even be a question. 2 LB 10Xs, 2 PPCs and 2 SRM 6s becomes 2 Gauss and 2 PPCs without a whole lot of shuffling.

[Lily from animove]

My dream dropdekc would be TBR, MDD, NVA, ADR

but with the current state of some clanmechs it would just be gimpung the team :/

so it porbably is going to be a TBR and 3 SCR's, or something else on the current OP scale.

I hope we get some quirks to make the inferior clanmechs viable. I really don'T wanna see the CW dropdekcs consisting of nearly only 2 mechs.

Edited by Lily from animove, 11 November 2014 - 02:01 AM.

[Tesunie]

Lily from animove, on 11 November 2014 - 02:01 AM, said:

I hope we get some quirks to make the inferior clanmechs viable.

They are next to receive the quirks... Give them a bit of time. They wont leave the clan mechs just hanging. (Basically, give it a while after the current changes so that PGI can see how things have been affected by it, adjust that, and then they probably will be looking at the clan mechs.)

[Kain Demos]

Lily from animove, on 11 November 2014 - 02:01 AM, said:

My dream dropdekc would be TBR, MDD, NVA, ADR

but with the current state of some clanmechs it would just be gimpung the team :/

so it porbably is going to be a TBR and 3 SCR's, or something else on the current OP scale.

I hope we get some quirks to make the inferior clanmechs viable. I really don'T wanna see the CW dropdekcs consisting of nearly only 2 mechs.

Nothing is OP currently. It would be nice if they gave the Summoner, Nova, and Adder some additional pods so they aren't so hardpoint limited but those 'mechs are what they are. The Nova will always be easy to hit and de-arm and have those jjs so it will never be a Stormcrow. The Summoner weighs 5 tons less than the Timberwolf and has 5 tons of hardlocked JJs--it will never play the same. The Adder suffers from the C-ERPPC nerfs (terrible speed and not full 15 damage) so that the Prime model is not as imposing as it should be for a light 'mech with bad speed, no JJs or ECM.

Some of the issues could be addressed with new 'pods. I really think some things should be unlocked for Clan 'mechs though:

Endo/FF (this would only help the 'mechs that are considered "subpar"--the strongest 'mechs have these already)
Limited unlocking of engines/heatsinks--once again the "best" 'mechs have these optimized for the most part so let the engine heat sink slots be utilized. Also allow engine size changes that have to coincide with your tonnage--example the Nova could only go in increments of 50 and the Adder in increments of 35.

If they do give quirks someone mentioned the Summoner PPC arm getting the full damage as a quirk.....I like that. If they did that for Adder Prime as well as a speed boost like the Awesome I would be all over that 'mech again. I tend to no longer use my Adder Prime right now because I have so much more success in my 2 x C-LPL 2 x C-ERML bulid and C-Gauss + 2 C-ERSML build. I've had so much success with those builds though it makes me want to think that the Adder is fine......but then I go back to the Prime (I just love PPCs and always loved this 'mech) and it just lacks the punch/heat that it seemed to have in MW4. A heat reduction quirk could turn the Nova Prime into an offensive powerhouse which would be fair in my book since you can disarm one just by looking at it with bad intentions. If they could give the Nova prime arm pods quirks (when used together) to get the C-ERML heat back to the old value of 5 that would be great as would GH but I don't think they could eliminate ghost heat for a particular weapon with quirks.

Edited by Kain Thul, 11 November 2014 - 12:24 PM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Kain Thul, on 11 November 2014 - 12:20 PM, said:

Nothing is OP currently. It would be nice if they gave the Summoner, Nova, and Adder some additional pods so they aren't so hardpoint limited but those 'mechs are what they are. The Nova will always be easy to hit and de-arm and have those jjs so it will never be a Stormcrow. The Summoner weighs 5 tons less than the Timberwolf and has 5 tons of hardlocked JJs--it will never play the same. The Adder suffers from the C-ERPPC nerfs (terrible speed and not full 15 damage) so that the Prime model is not as imposing as it should be for a light 'mech with bad speed, no JJs or ECM.

Some of the issues could be addressed with new 'pods. I really think some things should be unlocked for Clan 'mechs though:

Endo/FF (this would only help the 'mechs that are considered "subpar"--the strongest 'mechs have these already)
Limited unlocking of engines/heatsinks--once again the "best" 'mechs have these optimized for the most part so let the engine heat sink slots be utilized. Also allow engine size changes that have to coincide with your tonnage--example the Nova could only go in increments of 50 and the Adder in increments of 35.

If they do give quirks someone mentioned the Summoner PPC arm getting the full damage as a quirk.....I like that. If they did that for Adder Prime as well as a speed boost like the Awesome I would be all over that 'mech again. I tend to no longer use my Adder Prime right now because I have so much more success in my 2 x C-LPL 2 x C-ERML bulid and C-Gauss + 2 C-ERSML build. I've had so much success with those builds though it makes me want to think that the Adder is fine......but then I go back to the Prime (I just love PPCs and always loved this 'mech) and it just lacks the punch/heat that it seemed to have in MW4. A heat reduction quirk could turn the Nova Prime into an offensive powerhouse which would be fair in my book since you can disarm one just by looking at it with bad intentions. If they could give the Nova prime arm pods quirks (when used together) to get the C-ERML heat back to the old value of 5 that would be great as would GH but I don't think they could eliminate ghost heat for a particular weapon with quirks.

The only outlier issue I see with unlocking engine sizes to multiples of the mech weight and unlocking endo/ferro is it allows the unholy abomination that would be a Direwolf with XL400 (moving at 71.3kph), with endo and ferro and only 10HS it would still have 46 tons for weapons…

I don’t see any other issues. A Madcat with a 300XL is arguably better than what we have if you remove ferro, but its only arguable, and the SCR wouldn’t change engine size if it could anyway (275 is too small, 385 is way too big)

[Razus]

All you need is a Bloodthirster and Rand... oops wrong game

[Kain Demos]

Widowmaker1981, on 12 November 2014 - 03:47 AM, said:

The only outlier issue I see with unlocking engine sizes to multiples of the mech weight and unlocking endo/ferro is it allows the unholy abomination that would be a Direwolf with XL400 (moving at 71.3kph), with endo and ferro and only 10HS it would still have 46 tons for weapons…

I don’t see any other issues. A Madcat with a 300XL is arguably better than what we have if you remove ferro, but its only arguable, and the SCR wouldn’t change engine size if it could anyway (275 is too small, 385 is way too big)

It's funny how what some people think of as being too strong someone else can dismiss.

I thought about this pretty carefully (I thought) as a way to benefit the 'mechs that AREN'T the Stormcrow, Timberwolf, or Dire Wolf since I think we call can agree these are the best clan 'mechs.

Stormcrow--Has Endo/FF already. Engine changes in either direction by a factor of 55 wouldn't help it IMO.

Timberwolf--Has Endo/FF already. Can't go up in engine rating so the only options would be going down to 300 or 225....I didn't think anyone would want a slow or super slow Timberwolf. Sure, with a 300XL you wouldn't be so slow as to be "unusable" but with the limited free slots I don't see the tonnage savings paying off especially with a steep speed penalty. What makes the Timberwolf good is being fast as well as having the other advantages of a 75 ton 'mech--armor and weapons.

Dire Wolf--Does NOT have Endo or FF but going to a 400XL would be possible. Do you think the Dire Wolf would have enough slots to utilize its available tonnage if you added ES and FF to offset the additional weight of a 400XL? Would a 71kph (instead of 53.5) Dire Wolf with LESS weapons than "stock" really be better? I think that would be arguable as well. Even keeping the 300XL and just adding Endo, FF or both I don't think would accomplish much. As it sits with neither and a 300XL if you don't add some high tonnage weapons you can run into situations where you've used up all your space and still have tonnage available. Adding ES or FF would make this even worse--what would having 60t of space do for you if you didn't have enough slots to utilize the weight?

On the other side of that coin a 'mech like the Nova that has neither Endo NOR Ferro could add one/both and/or move up to a 300XL. The Summoner could swap FF for ES or simply add ES. The Kit Fox could skip JJs and instead get into a bigger engine. The Ice Ferret and Gargoyle could go do down an engine size and mount more weapons.

Edited by Kain Thul, 12 November 2014 - 08:50 AM.

[Carthoo]

Widowmaker1981, on 07 November 2014 - 07:11 PM, said:

Ah, Honor. has no place in war - you kill me, or i kill you. Honor is for when we are being civilized, and trying to kill each other is not being civilized.

Probably not the most clan way of thinking, but im far from a roleplayer as i said. i just think the clan mechs look better tbh. (except the Fridgefreezer Ferret, that got hit over the head with the ugly stick, then had the ugly piano dropped on its head)

Thats where youre wrong. Many military-barbaric cultures have honor pretty high in their ladder of lifes priorities.

Clans, Mandalorians in SW, Myrmidons and Spartans in ancient Greece, Samurais in Japan...and usually they are TOP warriors around. Precisely coz risking for higher reward - in both material and non-material sense...

[CyclonerM]

Kain Thul, on 12 November 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

Would a 71kph (instead of 53.5) Dire Wolf with LESS weapons than "stock" really be better?

Sure! That is one of the reasons that make me dislike 'Mechs like the Dire Wolf.

Edited by CyclonerM, 12 November 2014 - 10:03 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Widowmaker1981, on 12 November 2014 - 03:47 AM, said:

I don’t see any other issues. A Madcat with a 300XL is arguably better than what we have if you remove ferro, but its only arguable, and the SCR wouldn’t change engine size if it could anyway (275 is too small, 385 is way too big)

There is a Clan mech that is pretty much a Timber Wolf with a 300XL, it is called a Night Gyr. It would run 71 kph with Tweak, mounts 4 JJs and has 38 tons left over for weapons. I mean technically that isn't much different than a Warhawk though so I am not sure if it would be OPed. 350XL on a Timby though would be sweet. Still runs 83 kph but gives you an additional 4.5 tons for weapons and DHS. You might even get away with a 325XL which would still have you running 77 kph but give you 7.5 tons extra. 99% of the people would do this in a heartbeat if they unlocked the Timby engine.

Also I agree that there wouldn't be much changes to the Stormcrow except would be very nice to unlock those 3 DHS slots in the engine especially since I have found myself running out of crits before I ran out of tonnage on that mech.

[Kain Demos]

Viktor Drake, on 12 November 2014 - 12:07 PM, said:

350XL on a Timby though would be sweet. Still runs 83 kph but gives you an additional 4.5 tons for weapons and DHS. You might even get away with a 325XL which would still have you running 77 kph but give you 7.5 tons extra. 99% of the people would do this in a heartbeat if they unlocked the Timby engine.

Under what I proposed that wouldn't be happening. You either stay with the 375 or go down in increments of 75.

Edited by Kain Thul, 12 November 2014 - 12:36 PM.

[Widowmaker1981]

i disagree about the direwolf, with an XL400 and endo steel you could still do the 2xgauss 2xPPC build, albiet with less ammo and heatsinks, or massive laser vomit, or 4UAC5 + ERML vomit.. the thing is you would have the speed of a warhawk, with 7 or 8 more tons of pod space to play with and 6 engine slots for heasinks too., and the hardpoints of the direwolf.. i agree it wouldnt help the TBR and SCR much/at all, but it would turn the direwolf into an unholy monster..

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 12 November 2014 - 01:52 PM.

[Kain Demos]

Widowmaker1981, on 12 November 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

i disagree about the direwolf, with an XL400 and endo steel you could still do the 2xgauss 2xPPC build, albiet with less ammo and heatsinks, or massive laser vomit, or 4UAC5 + ERML vomit.. the thing is you would have the speed of a warhawk, with 7 or 8 more tons of pod space to play with and 6 engine slots for heasinks too., and the hardpoints of the direwolf.. i agree it wouldnt help the TBR and SCR much/at all, but it would turn the direwolf into an unholy monster..

Maybe, I guess we will never know. They could always just give the DW a cap on engine rating (like the IS 'mechs) so that then basically 300 would effectively be all you could use. Going down to a 200 you'd end up with too much free tonnage to effectively cram into your open slots I'd bet.

I think the changes I outlined would benefit a 'mech like the Nova immensely. You could go to a 300XL for a gain of only 3 tons and offset 2.5 tons of that with ES structure. This would give a 107kph speed (like the Stormcrow) and you could still boat lasers as usual.