60 replies to this topic

[cSand]

I'm taking it to a friend's tonight to try his ASUS 290, and his 850W power supply.

If that don't work, screw it. I'm sending this sh*theap back and getting an nVidia

Edited by cSand, 27 September 2014 - 04:56 PM.

[FogOfW4r]

cSand, on 27 September 2014 - 04:56 PM, said:

I'm taking it to a friend's tonight to try his ASUS 290, and his 850W power supply.

If that don't work, screw it. I'm sending this sh*theap back and getting an nVidia

Well, didn't you say the GPU was performing fine outside of MWO?

This is quite a strange problem that you are having.

[cSand]

Well, I've been testing it, and it's very inconsistent. SOmetimes it works well, sometimes it fluctuates like mad. MWO it always fluctuates between 100 and 200 MHz below its clock speed.

Maybe I got a bunk card! Who knows...

[ninjitsu]

MWO does not benefit much from video cards. You can use your catalyst control panel to force the card to run at a certain speed, I'd try that.

[RazorbeastFXK3]

I went from a 3GB RAM 2.2GHz dual core processor using a GeForce GT610 1GB Galaxy with a 500GB HD and a 400W power supply running Windows XP to a 16GB RAM 3.4GHz quad core processor using a GeForce GTX650 2GB GDDR5 with a 1TB HD and a 1,000W power supply running Windows 7. The graphics improved immensely.

I compared your graphics card to mine and it seems that you should have a better gaming experience than myself. I'm only running the video settings in game up to 'HIGH' with Post Processing set to 'LOW' and Post Anti-Analyzing set to 'OFF' Damage Glow is 'ON' with V-Sync set to 'OFF'

I messed around with the settings for the graphics card through the program it has. Originally set it to 'single display performance mode' with certain extra features turned off so it'd lean more towards performance with decent graphic quality. [EDIT]Then I just said "Screw it.. let the program decide for itself" and so far it's still working fine though I hear the card working a bit harder now than when I had it set to custom settings..[/edit]

I haven't messed with overclocking as I haven't really learned how to even get into the BIOS that my previous computer had (the screen where you hit ESC or one of the function keys to open up a program to change the master password or power settings or activating the PCI x16 slot, etc..)

I also have my computer hardwired to the modem for a more stable connection even though it has the option for wi-fi.

Outside of that maybe there's an issue between the graphic card and the computer itself.. conflicting settings where the card says YES YES YES! and the computer says NO NO NO!?

Edited by RazorbeastFXK3, 27 September 2014 - 05:41 PM.

[Catamount]

Yeah cSand something odd is definitely going on here. Your should be bottoming at 30, at worst, not dropping into the teens.

Yes, there are situations where a GPU can throttle if being under-utilized that can lead to odd behavior, but I really don't see that happening with you for any normal reason


Also, didn't I tell you to get a 970? (290s a great card though; it shouldn't be running so abnormally)

Edited by Catamount, 27 September 2014 - 05:58 PM.

[FogOfW4r]

Also, OP, have you tried turning off V-sync? it might boost the frames up.

[Maxxximal]

I was using my R9 290 + i7-4770 (Non K -- no overclock with an H87 mobo) and was able to run on low settings with my 4K UHD display -- but noticed some lag.

Considered the Xeon route (like you) but quickly ruled it out for several technical reasons and I upgraded my CPU & Mobo to i7-4790K + Z97 Mobo keeping the R9 290.

With no overclock I am running MWO 4K UHD on low settings with great FPS.

YMMV.

[Goose]

Which R9 290X are we talking about?

[Maxxximal]

OP was R9 290 not R9 290X:

r9 290 that comes with its clock set to 1040MHz (Club3d 290 Royal Ace)

My R9 290 is a non reference Visiontek.

Edited by Slahne, 27 September 2014 - 06:30 PM.

[cSand]

Catamount, on 27 September 2014 - 05:57 PM, said:

Yeah cSand something odd is definitely going on here. Your should be bottoming at 30, at worst, not dropping into the teens.

Yes, there are situations where a GPU can throttle if being under-utilized that can lead to odd behavior, but I really don't see that happening with you for any normal reason


Also, didn't I tell you to get a 970? (290s a great card though; it shouldn't be running so abnormally)

On some maps it seems fine until there ae a bunch of mechs on screen. River city is almost unplayable if I go anywhere near the river, likewise with Forest Colony and the water near the downed ship Strangely enough, I get no drops in the valley level

After a fresh reinstall last night and using the provided drivers the card runs just fine on everything else... trouble is, I don't play everything else. I play MWO, lol!

I was thinking maybe it was under-utilized because I'm running it @ 1680x1050 .. I'll try 1080 P on my TV tonight and see if it kicks it up a notch.... bam?

However...

Gigabyte 780 TI is on sale on NCIX right now for 449.99... including a 20$ MIR, and a $20 GC I have that puts it at a nice price of 409 It'll be that or the ASUS Stryx 970 (which is even less $$, lol)

Serously considering the switch!!!

Thanks again everyone for all the ideas, beers on me

Edited by cSand, 28 September 2014 - 07:32 AM.

[Catamount]

If you go Nvidia, go 970, not 780TI. They're within a few percentage points of each other in terms of performance, but the 970 has far and away superior features, for vastly less money.

As for resolution... maybe? My 7970 is running on a 1440x900 monitor right now (hauled the computer to my parents') and I was playing just fine. Like I said, this is not something that should be happening.


Here's a thought: You've looked at GPUz usage, why not run both GPUz and a FRAPS benchmark, and see if there's a correlation between any of GPUz's metrics and your framerate drops? I know they won't be starting at the same time, but it should be obvious if something is lining up between them.

Also, just to cover the obvious, you did try switching between Full Windows and Fullscreen, right? Fullscreen has been notoriously buggy since MWO has existed to have a Fullscreen mode.

[Tarl Cabot]

Are you sure it is the video card and not something else that is a resource hog and is popping up its ugly head every once in a while? I use Process Explorer and I will at first keep an eye on the System Idle Process. Get an avg of where it should be while MWO is running, and when things take a drop, see if it is registering with a drop percentage in System Idle Process.

One of the culprits some have see has been Windows Media Player Network Sharing Service.

Quote

I can stress the GPU with Furmark or any other tool... but when I fire up the Furmark CPU stresser, or Prime 95... I have now noticed that the GPU clock and usage becomes very erratic. I don't think this is just a MWO problem anymore....

Take active control of the fans with MSI Afterburner or such. CPU and GPU will downclock when each reaches a specific threshold. With the CPU when it Turbo and applies power to fewer and fewer cores to OC the speed of those cores, if the specific core hits that threshold then all cores will drop in speed.

I would suggest disabling the Turboboost to test. And with MSI Afterburner/etc you will be able to set a more aggressive fan profile. On the percentage, set it to 98% instead of 99%.


Disabling Intel Turbo BoosT

My system specs are Intel i-5 3570K 3.4 OC 4.2 with ATI HD 7950. MWO with dx9, most settings at high, AA and vsync on. With Vsync off max 90fps with drops to 45 when in brawling mix but the constant FPS changes, which is noticeable, gives me a headache so being Steady is fine

After doing all the above does not help, I believe someone posted to change the video card clock speeds and reduce them to a lower setting and test. It is possible that die may have passed bench mark tests to run at a higher setting but in the real world it can not. The base clock speed is up to 947mhz, whereas Club3D has that card to up to 1040mhz.

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 28 September 2014 - 09:03 AM.

[cSand]

Hey Tarl, excellent points sir.

I am on a fresh install of WIndows 8.1, with only MWO, steam, and drivers etc.. installed.

While I appreciate your advice (and believe me I do!), my main thing here now is that.. I feel I shouldn't have to **** around with a card just to get it to run the only game I play at a stable framerate (I know MWO is not the best optimized game, but my friend has a 750TI and is running this game better than this card, at half the price). Which means for me, if I have to use Afterburner, or change my CPU turbo settings, or something else just to get the game playable, the card is a bad purchase. I'm not asking for 60+ FPS constantly, but I am asking for it remain fairly consistent and not drop into the low 20's / high teens whenevr it wants to. Unacceptable IMO for what is a $450 video card (even though I paid $350 for it )

I've been reading all about the AMD powertune stuff they use on these 290/290x which bascially puts keeping the card quiet ahead of performance.... which is ridiculous but that's what they did. I may have been better off going for a 280x and saving some money as that card functions like a "normal" card without the dynamic clock BS present on the "higher" end models.

I'll be doing some final tests tonight after my daughter goes to her mom's... if it fails to impress me, it'll be going back to NCIX and I'll be getting either a 780 or a 970

Once again thanks everyone for the input! But unless this thing seriously gets it together tonight, I will be turning to the green side after being an ATI guy for over 20 years! Almost sad....

[Odins Fist]

Inconsistent peformance due to card "throttling down"..??? Heat maybe..??

Are you trying to run everything at MAXED OUT SETTINGS..??

[Oderint dum Metuant]

RazorbeastFXK3, on 27 September 2014 - 05:40 PM, said:

I went from a 3GB RAM 2.2GHz dual core processor using a GeForce GT610 1GB Galaxy with a 500GB HD and a 400W power supply running Windows XP to a 16GB RAM 3.4GHz quad core processor using a GeForce GTX650 2GB GDDR5 with a 1TB HD and a 1,000W power supply running Windows 7. The graphics improved immensely.

To the topic.
Interesting issues and it's going to be one of those things you go round the houses to solve.

​Not convinced it's a GPU issue, but that might be my scepticism over the Xeon approach ( if there was a legit reason to do it, people would be doing it, reviewers and hardware sites would be recommending them).

[ninjitsu]

Gamers have been running Xeons for many years. I don't know why it seems so strange to you guys.

There's a point of diminishing returns on video cards in MWO. The engine has a hard time utilizing hardware.

cSand, have you tried lowering video settings to see if you get an increase in performance? Have you tried dx9?

Check out this thread http://mwomercs.com/...e-rumors-in-mwo it logs computer performance, you can see the game hardly works his computer but he doesn't get amazing fps.

One other thing I can think of is setting the MWO processes affinity to the first four cores so that the game isn't trying to use your hyper threaded "cores".

[Brixx]

DV McKenna, on 28 September 2014 - 10:08 AM, said:

To the topic.
Interesting issues and it's going to be one of those things you go round the houses to solve.

​Not convinced it's a GPU issue, but that might be my scepticism over the Xeon approach ( if there was a legit reason to do it, people would be doing it, reviewers and hardware sites would be recommending them).

Xeons are in fact recommended. At least here in Germany. They are the alternative to non-OC I7's if you prefer HyperThreading over overclocking as you can do so only via Baseclock when it comes to Xeons.

As somebody already said, they are basically identical to "entrace"-level I7s and only lack the integrated GPU - as those are not needed when used in a server.

Addtionally, I have the exact same CPU, the Xeon 1231v3 as cSand has and I don't run into any performace problems at all despite running a 280X instead of a 290.

I hardly ever drop below 50 FPS at 1080p, mostly stable 60FPS depending on the map. Almost everything except particle effects, shadows and AA is set to max.

I can definitly rule out the CPU in general. It might be a specific problem on his side, but in general the Xeon performs very well in MW:O.

[Nemesis Duck]

Hello cSand,
What was the resolution of the laptop screen? I see your desktop is 1680x1050. If your laptop drove more pixels per frame render, IE it was 1920x1080, then you're absolutely right to be concerned that your desktop is sluggish. If it drove less pixels, IE 1366x1024, then it could explain some of the sluggishness you're experiencing now.
Also, can we assume you're testing with the same in-game video settings as with the laptop? Very important too.
EDIT:  Your CPU is fine. EDIT2: Never edit it destroys your formatting.

Edited by Assmodeus, 28 September 2014 - 12:15 PM.

[Catamount]

cSand, on 28 September 2014 - 09:38 AM, said:

I've been reading all about the AMD powertune stuff they use on these 290/290x which bascially puts keeping the card quiet ahead of performance.... which is ridiculous but that's what they did. I may have been better off going for a 280x and saving some money as that card functions like a "normal" card without the dynamic clock BS present on the "higher" end models.

Powertune is fairly old, HD6000 series old in fact (and they had something pretty close prior). Its goal isn't to keep things quiet, but to dynamically clock cards to keep them under their TDP limit, because prior methods relied on severe thermal throttling, whereas powertune can, say, take a card that's running just over its TDP and maybe clock it to "merely" 95% of its max clocks, instead of running full bore, then panicking when the card gets hot, and savagely throttling. Now, of course, cards have boost clocks, but the fundamental method of operating is the same: keep the card under a TDP target.

If you're referring to the "quiet" vs "uber" modes, that's only on the 290X afaik, not the 290, but you could easily switch the switch to uber if you have one. If you do think Powertune is screwing you over beyond that, go just into the normal AMD Catalyst software and turn up Powertune to +20% in overdrive. A minute and a half in the drivers is a lot less hassle than a card replacement. Still, I don't think that's your problem.

If your card is causing problems replace it. If you want to get a 970 get a 970. However, you should be careful to make sure that whatever the problem is, it doesn't just carry over to the next GPU. I think trying your friends' GPU and PSU is a good idea, though make sure you do both independently.

Edited by Catamount, 28 September 2014 - 12:18 PM.