22 replies to this topic

[Felio]

The Mist Lynx is a 25-tonner (like the Commando) that runs at 113.4 kph. It also has three C-DHS taking up space because there isn't room for them in the engine. As a result, it is also less heat-efficient. A precious ton is taken up by an active probe, which is a nice item but mostly redundant with the optional ECM, its only redeeming quality. It does come with 6 jump jets, which I personally would do even if it weren't forced because you can't take the sky from me, but that's a third of its weight that would otherwise be available.

The Ice Ferret is a 45-tonner running 129.6 kph. Finally, a clan mech for fans of light mechs! Except with an XL 360 engine and two extra C-DHS, it has only 8.46 tons available after maxing armor, and it brings few hardpoints.

The Hellbringer uses standard structure and standard armor. Like the Nova, except without the super nova arms capable of 42 damage each.

The Gargoyle uses a massive 400 XL engine, which I wholeheartedly approve of, but it also uses standard structure. So does the Mad Dog. Reminds me a lot of the Summoner's troubles.

But I'm sure they'll get +5% torso yaw speed to make up for it.

[Mcgral18]

Loki will be good.

25 tons of pod space, quite a few hardpoints, Magic Jesus Box.

Gargoyle will be sub par, but it can mount 8 ERMLs with 28 DHS, which runs surprisingly cool.

MythLynx will be pretty suboptimal.

IceFerret, we'll have to see.

[TELEFORCE]

We'll have to see when they come out to be sure! Hit boxes will make a huge difference.

I have experience using each of those chassis on table top, except for the Mist Lynx, which I would substitute with a Fire Moth. I'm looking forward to receiving Wave 2

[Angel of Annihilation]

Felio, on 03 October 2014 - 02:19 PM, said:

The Mist Lynx is a 25-tonner (like the Commando) that runs at 113.4 kph. It also has three C-DHS taking up space because there isn't room for them in the engine. As a result, it is also less heat-efficient. A precious ton is taken up by an active probe, which is a nice item but mostly redundant with the optional ECM, its only redeeming quality. It does come with 6 jump jets, which I personally would do even if it weren't forced because you can't take the sky from me, but that's a third of its weight that would otherwise be available.

The Ice Ferret is a 45-tonner running 129.6 kph. Finally, a clan mech for fans of light mechs! Except with an XL 360 engine and two extra C-DHS, it has only 8.46 tons available after maxing armor, and it brings few hardpoints.

The Hellbringer uses standard structure and standard armor. Like the Nova, except without the super nova arms capable of 42 damage each.

The Gargoyle uses a massive 400 XL engine, which I wholeheartedly approve of, but it also uses standard structure. So does the Mad Dog. Reminds me a lot of the Summoner's troubles.

But I'm sure they'll get +5% torso yaw speed to make up for it.

Aside from the Loki it is going to be hit or miss.

The Mist Lynx is competing against Spiders and Firestarters, not Commandos simply because it is the only semi-fast Clan light in the game. However it only runs 123 kph with tweak while the IS mechs will be running 150 kph plus. Also it is only 25 tons so will lack in the armor category. What it does have it range which may possibly give it that competitive edge that it seems to be lacking. Basically by using C-ER MLs at 400m range instead of IS MLs at 270m range it will have greater stand off range which should allow it to limit its exposure. The biggest issue this mech will have is dealing with heat. I can easily mount 4 C-ER MLs which is sweet but with only 6.5 tons of room after max armor, I don't think just 12 DHS will be enough to deal with the heat from those 4 C-ER MLs. Other than that, it will be all up to hit boxes and scaling. It it comes in tiny and thin with small hit boxes it has a chance.

Ice Ferret has a similar problem to the Mist Lynx in that it only has about 8.5 tons to play with and very limited hard points Best builds here will probably be 3xC-ER ML, SRM6 or 1xC-ER LL, 2xC-ER ML, SRM6 but again without the extra tonnage to bring enough DHS, it might run hot. Max DHS your really going to get is 14 DHS on this thing. Now with a 144 kph top speed thing thing might actually be a good surrogate for a beefy light mech but since it is a medium, chances are it will be a fairly large target. Again scaling and hit boxes is going to be the key.

The Gargoyle won't be as bad as alot of people think. Sure it only has about 20 tons available for weapons and equipment and is no faster than the Timber Wolf but it at least mounts 16 DHS all in the engine so it doesn't have to worry about having to add a boatload of DHS and can focus on just adding weapons. Also that 400XL should give it a decent level of agility. In general, a Timber Wolf will outclass it but if you don't like Slow, lumbering Assaults, the Gargoyle will fill that Assault slot nicely when CW comes out. Again, alot will depend on if it has good or bad hit boxes but that is the case with almost all new, untested mechs.

The Loki well lets just say I think that one is going to be a beast. Despite not having FF or Endo, it can still mount 26.5 tons of weapons and equipment which is just shy of what a Timber Wolf can mount. Also one of the big things people don't take into account is that without FF or Endo, it has a completely open internal structure which means there are absolutely no "fixed" obstructions to get in the way of you outfitting it the way you want to. Also it has a very good range of hard point options mixing and matching various combinations of ballistic, energy and missile. Plus it has the option to mount ECM across all variants without giving up firepower (ECM torso has 3 energy mounts in it). Lastly this is one mech where I don't think even if it has bad hit boxes that it will actually be bad. ECM will go a long way mitigate bad hit boxes.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 03 October 2014 - 03:07 PM.

[Brody319]

Well we gotta see how the hit boxes are. I doubt that the Man-o-war is going to be any replacement for the Whale. It has a lot of heatsinks it doesn't need.

The others might be good or bad, depends on the hitboxes and the omnipods

[Tezcatli]

Well they said they would give the Clans a quirk pass. So they'll find a place. Unless you mean the competitive scene. That's a much tighter margin for successful build.

[Milocinia]

I see the Vulture as the sweetener for buying that package. There was nothing else within Wave 2 that really floated my boat. I bought it anyway as a completionist and as a devout fan of this game's artistic merit... if not its balance and gameplay prowess.

What I do find interesting is the poll for the assault and heavy mechs posted here by PGI. IS loyalists need something to buy into to become eligible for the King Crab so expect a package of IS "reinforcement" mechs with 1 of each weight class coming very shortly. These do look very interesting with the Zeus chosen for assault and the Black Knight currently edging it for heavy.

Hoping PGI will resist sticking steadfast to timelines and offer the Bushwhacker as a medium choice for the IS!

Edited by Kyocera, 03 October 2014 - 03:23 PM.

[Vassago Rain]

Loki maybe.

Likely not the others.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Brody319, on 03 October 2014 - 03:06 PM, said:

Well we gotta see how the hit boxes are. I doubt that the Man-o-war is going to be any replacement for the Whale. It has a lot of heatsinks it doesn't need.

The others might be good or bad, depends on the hitboxes and the omnipods

Are we playing the same game? Gargoyle (Man-o-War) ONLY has 16 DHS stock. This is barely an adequate amount of DHS to even remotely run 20 tons of the super hot Clan weaponry we have in the game and the Gargoyle despite having some ballistic options is going to be running energy-centric builds more often than not. The better way to look at it is that it actually has a good START on the amount of DHS it is actually going to need.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 03 October 2014 - 03:35 PM.

[Fuggles]

the loki is going to have roughly 23.5 tons of podsace (max armor), not 26.5, it has 13 DHS stock (3 in the engine). 22.5 with ECM. thats not a lot, but you have the freedom to do pretty much whatever youd like with it.

45 free slots mean you can fit basically anything were ever you want so that is a definite plus side and a diverse set of hardpoints although only 2 missle.

some possible builds:
7erml + ecm and 28dhs
mini clan atlas ddc with gauss/2srm6 in RT, 2x erml in the arms, + ecm
lb20x with 4mlas + ecm
2xlrm15 10t ammo 4 erml + ecm

or what i expect to be the new meta, ecm, 3 erml, 1 flamer (in the head for maximum terror) an lrm 20 and 6, yes six machine guns! open your opponents armor safely under the cover of ecm from range with the lrm 20, then as they close in to avoid the bombardment, leg them with the 21 pinpoint damage of your medium laser bank, shut them down with your head flamer, and then proceed to farm them for cbills mercilessly with the devastating power of 6 machine guns!!!

Edited by Fuggles, 03 October 2014 - 05:56 PM.

[Felio]

Fuggles, on 03 October 2014 - 05:54 PM, said:

45 free slots mean you can fit basically anything were ever you want so that is a definite plus side

My issue with that is that clan FF/endo only take up 4 slots each, so to take advantage of it, you can have no more than 3 open slots in your build. To make things more difficult, clan weapons and equipment take up less space, with the exception of the AC/2 for some reason.

The only way to use up all the extra space -- the only way -- is to use a lot items that take up more slots than they do tons, and I mean a lot of them. That list is very short: Flamer, Machine Gun, ER Small Laser, AMS and C-DHS. That's all you have to work with. You can only allow about 2 or 3 slots to use a 1:1 slot:ton ratio, or you won't make it.

[Kain Demos]

The Gargoyle should be good. Imagine a faster pre nerf Victor with quicker torso twist.

I will be using and mastering the Hellbringer. Haven't decided if I'll do the same with my Warhawks yet or the Gargoyle when it comes out.

Edited by Kain Thul, 03 October 2014 - 06:54 PM.

[MonkeyCheese]

Well I got the mist lynx as I look forward to the challenge. 123kph is a perfectly fine speed to run at.

As for that fatty light the ice ferret I dont know. If it is near the size of a treb or cent it could have problems, but it looks fun.

[Lexx]

The speed of a Gargoyle will allow it to keep up with the rest of the team in a fast moving all clan mech murder death ball. It might not have as much armor or weapons, but the team won't be slowed down to the speed of a Dire Wolf or Warhawk.

[Asyres]

Felio, on 03 October 2014 - 06:15 PM, said:

My issue with that is that clan FF/endo only take up 4 slots each, so to take advantage of it, you can have no more than 3 open slots in your build. To make things more difficult, clan weapons and equipment take up less space, with the exception of the AC/2 for some reason.

7 slots each for Clan FF and Endo.

[Pariah Devalis]

If the Summoner is any harbinger of the Hellbringer's hitboxes, the Hellbie is going to be a pain in the ass to kill. That torso design looks absolutely ideal for armor rolling, plus having 24.5 tons of pod space (after somewhat optimizing the armor) is respectable, even if 1 ton of it goes into the ECM. Spitballing, we could see a Hellbringer packing an ECM, 2 SRM4, 3 ERMLas, and 2 ERLLas with 22 DHS, or go full on laser vomit in the thing, while maintaining an ECM capability.

Mist Lynx, though not as fast as many lights, it does have the possibility for some wicked firepower - especially if you ignore the ECM arm. With around 6 tons of space to work with, you could easily fit a couple SSRM4 and an ERMLas in the sucker, with possibly more room left over. Sure, an IS light can catch up to it, but that would be a bit suicidal.

Ice Ferret, with only around 8.5 tons of pod space, is a bit anemic in firepower, but it can still go SSRM or SRM heavy with ERMLas backups, so unlike a Cicada, it should be able to not only keep up with IS lights but be able to be more than just target practice against them.

Gargoyle, however.... Honestly, I only see it as a laser platform. Moving like a Timber Wolf, I expect to see them boating either MPlas or ERMLas. Basically an 80 ton, 90 KPH Wubshe.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 04 October 2014 - 12:32 AM.

[Karamarka]

Im interested in the Hellbringer.

[aniviron]

Mcgral18, on 03 October 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

Gargoyle will be sub par, but it can mount 8 ERMLs with 28 DHS, which runs surprisingly cool.

I think it's been confirmed that we're not getting the Gargoyle C, which is the one that has the 6ERML arm. Which is a shame, because a mech like the Gargoyle is pretty much optimal at the stock C loadout of a UAC20 and 6 ERML.

[Mcgral18]

aniviron, on 04 October 2014 - 03:09 AM, said:

I think it's been confirmed that we're not getting the Gargoyle C, which is the one that has the 6ERML arm. Which is a shame, because a mech like the Gargoyle is pretty much optimal at the stock C loadout of a UAC20 and 6 ERML.

4 in one arm, 2 CT, 2 other arm.

Or 7 if you go Prime CT. Would have been nice to get that arm.

[Fuggles]

Felio, on 03 October 2014 - 06:15 PM, said:

My issue with that is that clan FF/endo only take up 4 slots each, so to take advantage of it, you can have no more than 3 open slots in your build. To make things more difficult, clan weapons and equipment take up less space, with the exception of the AC/2 for some reason.

The only way to use up all the extra space -- the only way -- is to use a lot items that take up more slots than they do tons, and I mean a lot of them. That list is very short: Flamer, Machine Gun, ER Small Laser, AMS and C-DHS. That's all you have to work with. You can only allow about 2 or 3 slots to use a 1:1 slot:ton ratio, or you won't make it.

my point is this: you have 23.5t to play with if you max armor, thats it, thats all you can carry.
you have the freedom however to put whatever you have the tonnage for, where ever you want it.

compare this to other clan mechs:
kitfox: the left torso only has 2 free slots and the right torso only has 5.
nova: JJs in the legs/HS in the torso you cant remove
summoner: balistic hardpoints in the torso but only 8 slots so no 9 slot weapons.
TW: 7 slots in the torsos (soon to be less on the S) so no dual lrm20 or 9 slot weapons
warhawk: need i say more? very restrictive stock loadouts.
DW: hard to complain about this one, but it does have 3 DHS that are fixed. i guess techincally you cant run 6lb10s.. boohoo

Edited by Fuggles, 04 October 2014 - 08:22 AM.