44 replies to this topic

[MeiSooHaityu]

El Bandito, on 30 October 2014 - 01:59 AM, said:

It is official, Catapult is the favorite missile mech PGI likes to kick around like a sick puppy.

I am convinced some important decision maker at PGI absolutely HATES the Catapult.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 30 October 2014 - 02:07 AM.

[Rashhaverak]

Onmyoudo, on 30 October 2014 - 01:47 AM, said:

Yes, but in the actual post (where quriks such as yaw are listed as movement quirks) he says movement quirks will remain as is until a later pass. So they might not be un-nerfed next week.

Perhaps the nerf to the catapult torso twist was instituted as a permanent change and not a quirk, and therefore the devs have either forgotten the nerf was made, or intentionally don't want to redact the nerf. Either way it appears that the torso twist is not being changed, based on the fact that Russ appears to be specifically omitting any mention of it for the K2 and the A1.

[Hades Trooper]

Kevjack, on 29 October 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

I thought every single negative quirk was being removed. Maybe he forgot to write it?

Not every change is a quirk

[Onmyoudo]

Well, there we are then. Show's over folks, put your cats back in the bag.

[Triordinant]

Some guys have supposedly data mined all the Quirks due on Nov. 4 from the Test Server. Details here.

[Napoleon_Blownapart]

the only adavantage of a catapult was its being able to fire behind you.yet another example of PGI selleth, PGI taketh away....

could someone more artistic than i am combine these images?




could someone link where Russ discusses these nerfs?

Edited by Gorantir, 30 October 2014 - 06:42 AM.

[Belorion]

Rashhaverak, on 29 October 2014 - 12:11 PM, said:

Based on the update Russ just made to the October quirks page, it would appear that the catapult torso twist nerf is permanent. There was no mention in the K2 or A1 quirks posting that the movement nerfs from 140 degrees to 120-110 degrees was going to be revoked.

I'm disappointed. The Cat will never compete with the MadCat.

They have said several times all negative quirks are being removed.

[BTone]

Honestly, I always use my Catapult as either a direct/in-direct fire support mech. You may all say "Well DUUH", but when you think about it, the torso twist range doesn't affect it terribly in that role. I play my Catapult fairly regularly, and my success in it hasn't changed all that much.

All I mean to say is that in my Catapult, I generally try to avoid seeing any enemy for any length of time. I'm usually hurling lrms, or popping over hills with my K2 and firing off a couple PPC shots. I think if you play the mech that way, which I consider to be the proper way to play it, then you probably wont mind this "nerf" so much.

[Jetfire]

Given the power of the 140 degree twist... I would say it is wise to keep it until quirk pass #2 sometime in the future.

[EvilCow]

It is not the twist the main problem, the Catapults got nerfed bad in pitch movement (16° / 35°), now there is no reason to keep that considering that the Catapult is marginal at best.

[salkeee]

terrycloth, on 29 October 2014 - 01:39 PM, said:

I pilot Catapults in battle against Timberwolves all the time.

(not saying I *win*)

If U rly goin 1on1 on Timberwolf ur doin it wrong so wrong.

[Napoleon_Blownapart]

EvilCow, on 30 October 2014 - 06:33 AM, said:

It is not the twist the main problem, the Catapults got nerfed bad in pitch movement (16° / 35°), now there is no reason to keep that considering that the Catapult is marginal at best.

its not like the pitch kept your 1st lrm volley after you get a lock from pounding into the ground in front of you...

[EvilCow]

Gorantir, on 30 October 2014 - 06:49 AM, said:

its not like the pitch kept your 1st lrm volley after you get a lock from pounding into the ground in front of you...

For the K2 it matters.

[Ragnar Darkmane]

salkeee, on 30 October 2014 - 06:41 AM, said:

If U rly goin 1on1 on Timberwolf ur doin it wrong so wrong.

Right, U should play a Timberwolf instead, that does almost everything better than a Cat that isn't pure LRM spam, carrying more firepower, being far more survivable, being faster, being able to equip ballistics and JJs... for only 10 tons more (which has almost no MM impact anyway).

Cats are incredibly outdated now, massive power creep and all those nerfs it got 2 years ago and the "improved geometry" make it a barely viable choice at best. PGI would have to remove the negative mobility nerfs, remove the awful VHS boxes that make C1/C4/A1 Arms bigger than the CT of many mechs and significantly reduce the size of the CT hitbox (by making the ST's bigger - the fact that they made MadCat hitboxes Stalkeresque (on top of it being super fast) is an incredible insult to anyone who still bothers to pilot a Cat and has to deal with the current hitboxes) to make cats competitive and viable again.

Right now there is at least one mech that does each of the Cat's strengths better and has fewer downsides (especially looking at Timberwolves and Jagermechs). Looking at the new Quirks for the Cats I seriously think that PGI doesn't give a rat's *** about how bad the mech does, which is a shame for one of the most popular and iconic IS mechs ever. And yes, this is coming from someone who mastered the Catapult some time ago.

Edited by Ragnar Darkmane, 30 October 2014 - 06:57 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Come on PGI, restore the torso twist. Chubby's a Catapult pilot and he wants to twist again, like he did last summer. He misses his favorite mech...quit making him sad.

[Napoleon_Blownapart]

im still waiting for a link to russ discussing cat torso twist...

Edited by Gorantir, 30 October 2014 - 07:31 AM.

[Bront]

If they're not listed as quirks, they're not quirks in the traditional sense. Much like how the Stalker 3F has a better torso twist than other stalkers, or the Battlemaser 1G has a worse one. Quirks are things like the movement restrictions on Victors or Highlanders.

[Rashhaverak]

BTone, on 30 October 2014 - 06:20 AM, said:

Honestly, I always use my Catapult as either a direct/in-direct fire support mech. You may all say "Well DUUH", but when you think about it, the torso twist range doesn't affect it terribly in that role. I play my Catapult fairly regularly, and my success in it hasn't changed all that much.

All I mean to say is that in my Catapult, I generally try to avoid seeing any enemy for any length of time. I'm usually hurling lrms, or popping over hills with my K2 and firing off a couple PPC shots. I think if you play the mech that way, which I consider to be the proper way to play it, then you probably wont mind this "nerf" so much.

You're playing the Cat wrong if you think that the torso twist doesn't matter to a support mech. One of the keys to effectively playing a missile Cat is being able to remain out of the main fight, avoid a flanking maneuver, and keep from being overrun. Being able to torso twist 140 degrees allowed the Cat driver to target the enemy and provide support to the main line brawlers while still moving and maneuvering to remain out of the main conflict. When I drive my C1 I never point my mech at the enemy if I can help it, I'm pointed to the left, the right, or as I used to be able to do, some direction behind me, waiting and ready to position myself behind my front line, but able to still fire.

The torso nerf to the Cat significantly affected all of the varient's performance in both a supporting and brawling role.

[BTone]

Rashhaverak, on 30 October 2014 - 01:45 PM, said:

You're playing the Cat wrong if you think that the torso twist doesn't matter to a support mech. One of the keys to effectively playing a missile Cat is being able to remain out of the main fight, avoid a flanking maneuver, and keep from being overrun. Being able to torso twist 140 degrees allowed the Cat driver to target the enemy and provide support to the main line brawlers while still moving and maneuvering to remain out of the main conflict. When I drive my C1 I never point my mech at the enemy if I can help it, I'm pointed to the left, the right, or as I used to be able to do, some direction behind me, waiting and ready to position myself behind my front line, but able to still fire.

The torso nerf to the Cat significantly affected all of the varient's performance in both a supporting and brawling role.

Yeah maybe YOU don't know how to play the Cat right, ever think about that? Of course you didn't! I've been doing fine in my Catapult, pre-nerf and post. If you think otherwise, then feel free to drop with me and I'll gladly prove you wrong.

[Koniving]

Rashhaverak, on 29 October 2014 - 12:11 PM, said:

Based on the update Russ just made to the October quirks page, it would appear that the catapult torso twist nerf is permanent. There was no mention in the K2 or A1 quirks posting that the movement nerfs from 140 degrees to 120-110 degrees was going to be revoked.

I'm disappointed. The Cat will never compete with the MadCat.

To mention it... The Battletech Catapult never had torso twist. It never had a pelvis.

And the MWO "shoot backwards" Catapult was the original reason that twin AC/20s needed something like ghost heat.

Edited by Koniving, 30 October 2014 - 01:55 PM.