281 replies to this topic

[Mcgral18]

Noesis, on 01 November 2014 - 05:50 PM, said:

LRMs are fine.

Some would say fine, I would say terribad. They are just terrible weapons. Can't direct fire worth anything.

PappySmurf, on 01 November 2014 - 07:36 PM, said:

Like I said one big problem with LRM'S or Clrms is everyone has C3 targeting which means even in pug games everyone has a target lock which is just asinine. Plus the fact the missile arc is so high its crazy I took a hunchback and played all the maps just to see how long I could survive the LRM/CLRM battles.

90% of the hills building etc. you could not get effective cover the missile rain never ended even in cover so what good is situational awareness if your cover does not effectively block the missiles? The devs really need to start looking at overall gameplay fun and players having better and longer battle time per match.

LRMS-CLRMS-GUASS-PPCS-ETC it don't matter what the flavor of the month killing weapons are if players cannot stay in battles and have FUN!!!! they will un-install MWO and never look back.

Perhaps you don't read very often; we don't have C3.

Also, perhaps you should start finding some cover rather than concealment; that should stop that particular issue.

Dont LRM me please, on 01 November 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

I'll either "deal with it" or uninstall. Like the other players already have. Or, something, I don't know what, can reduce density of CLRM boats.

Please, if you don't want to learn to deal with the worse weapon system in the game, please, do uninstall.

Kiryuin Ragyo, on 03 November 2014 - 10:56 AM, said:

Tell that to 6xAC5 DWF's face how "Clan AC's sux" xDDDDDD

Well, seeing as my troll 400XL Pulse Laser boat can kill them...I'll wager they are pretty terribad. Though, still a step above LURMs.

[pvtjamesr]

Metus regem, on 03 November 2014 - 11:20 AM, said:

And that is why you are a Smoke Jaguar, and I am a Ghost Bear...

Cause i'm willing to do what it takes to win and won't put up with incompetence?

[Joseph Mallan]

Mercules, on 03 November 2014 - 11:11 AM, said:

So people who use LRMs are "trolls" and "not worth having". Uh huh.... As opposed to people who don't bother to learn how to deal with the easiest weapon to counter in the game.

2 of the greatest Commanders in lore are Archer Pilots. We should do What with LRMs again?

[Cyberiad]

Dont LRM me please, on 01 November 2014 - 04:03 PM, said:

Hi

I am here to talk about LRMs. Before the clan update, LRMs were a good way to suppress enemies and take down lone wolves, and also great at fire support.

But now, ever since the glorious and wonderful clan update, implemented horribly and flawed, things are going downhill in gameplay.

- Regular LRMs are perfectly fine but CLRMs are literally primary armaments of most mechs these days, and it's for a reason. Because they track down and kill people quicky (in bulk), and they spam the living **** out of your screen. It is also harder to escape CLRMs because they go over cover sometimes. If one person says "IS LRMs are better" I'm going to do something violent because that is the biggest lie I have heard in my life. Nothing better than getting spammed by a guy mashing his LMB button looking at your general direction, not trailing or even seeing you in some circumstances. LRMs are meant to be fire support, not the god damn most popular weapon.

- Dire wolfs Roam the landscape, slaughtering anything in front of them. I swear, I have never see a dire wolf do less than 350 damage and I have a dire wolf, and I get a 500-1200 damage a match with dual gauss and dual PPC overpowered bullcrap. Dire wolfs are always MVP. You peek out, lose your chest or lose your shoulder, crawl back down, and die. Or, if your traveling in a map like Caustic Valley, they peek out and shoot you at your spawn, and then you have no were to escape. They also have extreme autocannon builds, some being known to rip a heavy mech's armor CT within 2-4 seconds.

- What I also find very humorous is that the Timber Wolf is going 81kph. A heavy mech going 81kph. Also, the medium for the clans, the Stormcrow specifically goes 97kph. So what happens is all these outclassed Inner sphere mechs are slower, weaker (XL engines) or outgunned by their clan counterparts.

- The maps are seriously messed up. Too many invisible barriers on the maps, where I see air it becomes some kind of forcefield. Also, when I'm running from LRMs (Clan to be exact) running blindly and trying to find "cover", I step into some kind of invisible barrier on the ground, causing me to die horribly. Thanks PGI.

- And artillery and air strikes are out of control. Can't play a match without getting hammered by 3 of them. "Move out of the way!" No, Inner sphere assaults are too slow to move out of the way.

The worse part about all of this is that this is the new norm. People now think that their Dual Gauss and Dual PPC, or LRM boat Stormcrows are completely balanced because well, they are right. A small sliver of players use Inner Sphere mechs now because of the clan Meta. I remember about a year ago when it took FOREVER to die. Like, seriously, mechs took enormous beatings. But now, if you peek over a hill, GET READY! CLRMS AND DUAL GAUSS HEADED YOUR WAY! You die instantly or become severely damaged in every or almost all situations because of these clan monsters carrying 2x The Inner sphere weapon capability but having the same amount of armor.

All I'm saying is that the gameplay has become nothing but LRM warfare and "Who can alpha someone first", kinda like CoD. It should be fixed or some alternatives must be made because there are too many LRM boats and Dire Wolf "Assasins" out there.

Please, fix my favorite game PGI.

-Removal of indirect fire without TAG/NARC (and changing of ECM to reduce target range instead of making mechs untargetable, otherwise LRMs become useless).
-Removal of weapon convergence and instead have weapons fire straight out of their weapon model with the player aiming the torso & arm central axis (would also negate any need for silly game mechanics like gauss charge & ghost heat)
-Reintroduction of 8v8 (maybe even 4v4) would reduce TTK and no longer force players hide behind cover for 90% of the game.

Would fix everything.

Also I think we should have had mix tech and that clan & IS shouldn't have had different mech-building mechanics altogether, just like in all previous mechwarrior games, otherwise you will run into balance issues. As for people who complain that it doesn't match tabletop, well this isn't a tabletop game. I'm pretty sure everyone enjoyed MW2, MW3 & MW4 and they had mix-tech and no real difference between clan & IS mechs.

[Joseph Mallan]

pvtjamesr, on 03 November 2014 - 11:22 AM, said:

Cause i'm willing to do what it takes to win and won't put up with incompetence?

Shooting an ally is not in line with doing whats needed to win. Its quite the opposite in fact.

[Metus regem]

pvtjamesr, on 03 November 2014 - 11:22 AM, said:

Cause i'm willing to do what it takes to win and won't put up with incompetence?

Putting yourself ahead of the team, like any good Smoke Jaguar should.

[Cyberiad]

Also I think the different HUD, different colors & sounds, blue flame missiles for clan are silly. I'd rather have the old hud, colors & sound. The missiles with the blue flames somehow just make me cringe every time I see them. It just seems like it was a really immature idea to have clan missiles have blue rockets just because its blue and the future and it's clan so it's gotta be like that.

[pvtjamesr]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 November 2014 - 11:24 AM, said:

Shooting an ally is not in line with doing whats needed to win. Its quite the opposite in fact.

That goes under the "won't put up with incompetence" part, which if you don't have those people in your unit, it leads to winning.

[AlphaToaster]

Definitions:

Soft Cover = Cover that you can hide behind/under to break line of sight attacks, but will not afford enough cover to stop LRMs or ARTY/AIR strikes.

Hard Cover = Cover that you can hide behind/under to break line of sight attacks, but will also stop AIR/ARTY strike and LRMs.

Safe Place = Any place not in hard cover that is close enough to hard cover, that if you begin to get LRM'd your mech can make it into hard cover before exploding.

Dangerous Place = Any place not in hard cover that is too far from hard cover, that if you begin to get LRM'd your mech cannot make it into hard cover before exploding.

Situational Awareness = Knowledge of events unfolding in the immediate area around your mech that expands outward the more sensitive a pilot is to his surroundings. These events also include cockpit warnings and flashing lights on the HUD.

So using these definitions:

If a pilot is in a Dangerous Place with poor Situational Awareness, they can expect to die to LRMs a lot.

[Joseph Mallan]

Never thought I would like what a Toaster had to say!

ComStar/WoB reference)

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 03 November 2014 - 11:30 AM.

[Metus regem]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 November 2014 - 11:29 AM, said:

Never thought I would like what a Toaster had to say!

ComStar/WoB reference)

I got it

[James DeGriz]

Have to say I'm a little on the fence with this issue. On the one side, I hate the lazy, relatively risk free click spam of LRMs and if I see someone who's boating them (5xCLRM15s on a StormCrow D, for example) I make it my business to close inside that suckers 180m minimum range, rip off it's head and spit down it's neck.

AMS at it's current state, with 1000 rounds per ton, the fact it always seems to want to shoot through buildings and the sheer quantity of LRM spam that there is at the moment means it's more or less out of ammo within the first 30 seconds of the game. Seriously, no joke. One match I started on the north side of River City, walked across the bridge with the rest of the team, and got "AMS Ammo Depleted" by the time we gotta to the Kappa area. Obviously this issue is being addressed tomorrow, thankfully.

Ghost Heat rarely seems to make a difference simply because LRM spammers rarely group fire; always chain fire.

These days this:



.. seems to be an all too common occurrence, which is usually followed by..



this.

The point is, we all know that the most effective way to dispatch an enemy mech is to stick together and focus fire. LRMs firing mechanic makes that infinitely easier. It doesn't really matter if an individual LRM spammer only has 20% accuracy, because if he's firing on the same target with 6 of his mates, that target is going to be dead pretty quickly. Beyond the 180m minimum range, using LRMs en masse has extremely minimum risk. That is why they feel cheap to be killed by them, and that's what the rage is usually about.

On the other hand, Radar Deprevation does make a HUGE difference in mitigating their effectiveness. 6 million CBills for a single add on to your mech may sound like a lot, but it cannot be stressed enough that it's the best load of dough you'll spend, so long as you combine it with the usual LRM avoidance tactics.

I also find myself sitting out of the opening game of LURM tennis. Sometimes if I have a fast-ish mech with RD installed, I'll find some good cover, pop out get targetted and as soon as I see the Lurmnoobs vomiting their cheap laziness at me zip back into cover again to let them Lurm the hell out of the building I'm hiding behind. Yup.. waste your ammo as much as you like. When you're out, you're dead.

TL;DR Lurms aren't over powered, they're over used. Yes they're frustrating to die to if you mess it up, but they're a lot easier to counter than you might think.

Edited by James DeGriz, 03 November 2014 - 11:37 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

pvtjamesr, on 03 November 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

That goes under the "won't put up with incompetence" part, which if you don't have those people in your unit, it leads to winning.

You almost always have someone cross your path. Incompetence has nothing to do with it.

Otherwise the infantry would not have the Axiom, "Friendly Fire isn't!"

[KraftySOT]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 November 2014 - 11:22 AM, said:

2 of the greatest Commanders in lore are Archer Pilots. We should do What with LRMs again?

What does it say about a commander with rear firing weapons though? He says its because he can wade into the enemy. The Skye Rebels say its because he was always running away.

[Joseph Mallan]

Metus regem, on 03 November 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

Putting yourself ahead of the team, like any good Smoke Jaguar should.

Doing that ilKhan Osis lost his head!

KraftySOT, on 03 November 2014 - 11:32 AM, said:

What does it say about a commander with rear firing weapons though? He says its because he can wade into the enemy. The Skye Rebels say its because he was always running away.

It says he's thinking ahead so he doesn't have to turn around to kill a sneaky bastich!

James DeGriz, on 03 November 2014 - 11:31 AM, said:

Have to say I'm a little on the fence with this issue. On the one side, I hate the lazy, relatively risk free click spam of LRMs and if I see someone who's boating them (5xCLRM15s on a StormCrow D, for example) I make it my business to close inside that suckers 180m minimum range, rip off it's head and spit down it's neck.

AMS at it's current state, with 1000 rounds per ton, the fact it always seems to want to shoot through buildings and the sheer quantity of LRM spam that there is at the moment means it's more or less out of ammo within the first 30 seconds of the game. Seriously, no joke. One match I started on the north side of River City, walked across the bridge with the rest of the team, and got "AMS Ammo Depleted" by the time we gotta to the Kappa area. Obviously this issue is being addressed tomorrow, thankfully.

Ghost Heat rarely seems to make a difference simply because LRM spammers rarely group fire; always chain fire.

These days this:



.. seems to be an all to common occurrence, which is usually followed by..

I literally have never had a report that did not have lasers and ACs on that list.

[KraftySOT]

Hey why is that Unseen mech running over the hill...

Ooooh because he's "important" I see. Serious "merc business" to attend to. Wonder if he'll come back and fight?

[Joseph Mallan]

KraftySOT, on 03 November 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Hey why is that Unseen mech running over the hill...

Ooooh because he's "important" I see. Serious "merc business" to attend to. Wonder if he'll come back and fight?

Whats a Quickdraw?

[Joe Mallad]

To those saying we don't use C3 in the game... Sure we do. In Beta PGI even said it was a sort of built in C3 that allowed all units on a team to see what a spotter targeted.

In lore C3 was only used per lance and did not extend to other lances unless a specialty mech had in some cases, 2 C3 units equipped so 2 full lances could get targeting info back from what was targeted.

And I agree... Maybe its time to add true C3 to the game and just like ECM and everything else, put it on designated mechs (just like ECM) and only the mechs in that lance can get instant targeting data from the mech or mechs in that lance with C3.

PGI wants role warfare right? Well then, make it a role someone has to take like ECM. You want to have LRM support that don't have to get direct line of site? Than have a mech with C3 in "that lance" that can spot for you. Otherwise all LRMs mechs should have to get out there and get their own line of site.

[Metus regem]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 November 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Doing that ilKhan Osis lost his head!

As I said, all good Jaguars... mind you most of them became KFSJ (Kentucky Fired Smoked Jaguar) after the SLDF got done with them...

We bears got smart, and decided it was better to remove ourselves from the up and coming conflict and consolidate our holdings, with infrastructure, education and integration with our new clansmen.

[James DeGriz]

Joseph Mallan, on 03 November 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

I literally have never had a report that did not have lasers and ACs on that list.

Have to admit, that was an extreme example that only happened the once during the weekend. One of those situations where I was doing mostly the "Right Thing", but made a small mistake and got unlucky. Popped my head out to follow the team from one area of cover to another, and got spotted by what I'm assuming was a 5D, and that was that; game over.

Edited by James DeGriz, 03 November 2014 - 11:42 AM.