183 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 14 November 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

ONLY new players? Why not the rest of us?

If they allowed 4vs4 matches for everyone, there would be 3 times as many matches running for the people who preferred 4vs4, which would take up more server resources. So... because money. If the rest of us want 4vs4, we have to play private matches.

oldradagast, on 14 November 2014 - 07:45 PM, said:

Agreed. There is simply zero benefit to bringing the knockdown mechanic back.
It may be "realistic," but I came here to play a game with big, stompy robots, not simulate the physics of said robots.

I'm in the opposite boat. They'd have to add an absurd amount of realism before it was too much for me.

oldradagast, on 14 November 2014 - 07:45 PM, said:

I also fail to see how adding yet ANOTHER mechanic that favors more massive mechs is going to make this game better.
Now, light mechs can simply be blocked and killed... yeah... and my brawling mediums will be dealt with by assaults just getting in their way. What fun... not... Why not simply get rid of anything under 55 tons and call it a day?

It's not going to be a disadvantage for light mechs unless the devs make it so. Right now, it's fairly easy for a light mech to travel through River City at a high speed (not full speed) without the risking of running into a building. However, it's somewhat harder for an assault mech to run at full speed through River City without crashing at all, so many assault mechs may need to slow down when moving through urban areas and difficult terrain, just to avoid taking significant damage from bumping into buildings, etc.

It's also a lot easier for two light mechs on collision course to avoid a collision, as opposed to two assault mechs moving at 70-80 kph.

oldradagast, on 14 November 2014 - 07:45 PM, said:

And let's not even consider the idiocy that will result from team-mates fumbling around and knocking people over. Heck, i think half the matches out there I may as well start at 99% because some surat crashes into me out of the gate... let's add knockdown to that too, so I can go sprawling thanks to somebody else's cluelessness... maybe we can then form a trip pile and knock down other team-mates in the process until the game looks more like a clown show than a mech game.

Again, this is the worst of all possible scenarios. They will likely not make knockdown happen as a result of mechs bumping into each other, and collision damge will probably be very low from the sort of collisions happening at the start of the game. Major damage and knockdown is likely to happen when mechs crash into each other at great speeds, e.g. head to head with both mechs running 60+ kph. How often does this really happen right out of the gate?

Unless you're in the lowest reaches of the steering wheel underhive, I can't imagine this will ever be a problem. And even then, it should be a minor one.

[Alistair Winter]

Lyoto Machida, on 14 November 2014 - 07:55 PM, said:

Are we talking about humans or what mechs can do?
As far as what a mech could "realistically" do to get up, I'm pretty sure using arms would be faster than not using arms to do so.
Fast forward to 0:52...this is pretty much a standard way to get up quickly in MMA (or street fights) from off your back. You really think it's the same to get up off the ground without using your arms versus using them?

How are you gonna talk about realism and then use that link to prove your point? The turkish get-up? Really, dude? Yeah, it's great if you're in a streetfight or MMA bout and worrying about someone kicking or punching you in the face as you get up. But how is that relevant to this discussion? There are no flying knees and superman punches in MWO. That's not the fastest way to get to your feet at all, it's just a relatively safe way if you're in the middle of a fist fight.

Here's a very easy way to get up that doesn't require any speed or the use of your arms. You can do this with arms crossed, so you can't use them to gain momentum.

• Lie down
  
• Sit up, keeping your legs straight
  
• Move the heel from one leg close to your ass, keeping the other leg straight
  
• Lean forward
  
• Stand up

Also relevant:
http://www.nbcnews.c...vity-f1C7588565

Getting up without using your arms. It's not that hard. It doesn't require ninja flips. Most people can do it with a bit of practice, if they have working joints and good balance. And battlemechs will normally have both.

[The Wakelord]

Quote

# Plans to take smaller maps out of rotation, enlarge or revamp them?

- Been talking about reworking them

- Using them for FTUE to ease new players into the game in 4v4 games

4v4 sounds awesome! I'd love it if in the general PUG queue the team sized was randomised between 12v12, 8v8 & 4v4.

Quote

# Mech Collisions and Knockdowns implemented soon?

- Top Priority for Russ.. but need resources to become available after CW to look at it

Cry. Lights are already avoided so much. Heavies & Assaults already have so much in their favour - why add this?

Also Urbie could be cool or super lame. All depends on how large the mech is.

[Keira RAVEN McKenna]

Alistair Winter, on 14 November 2014 - 10:26 PM, said:

Getting up without using your arms. It's not that hard. It doesn't require ninja flips. Most people can do it with a bit of practice, if they have working joints and good balance. And battlemechs will normally have both.

I can do it by bending both my legs from straight out to having both feet by my butt, then you end up on your knees... then stand up... no arms needed.

Just tried it on the kitchen floor a few times and got the weirdest looks from my boyfriend, he didnt say a word though... just quietly backed away.

Edited by Keira RAVEN McKenna, 14 November 2014 - 10:35 PM.

[White Bear 84]

Alistair Winter, on 14 November 2014 - 04:44 AM, said:

Which part of the latest Town Hall meeting made you most excited? You can find the cliff notes here, if you didn't listen to it.

For me, this was definitely the most exciting news:

• Mech collisions and knockdowns are a "top priority" after CW is released, hopefully Dec 15th. This will be a big game changer. Not without major bugs and lots of tears, I'm sure. But it will push the game in the right direction. Towards more realism and less arcade-style.
  
• New maps may be released as often as every month after CW is released. I doubt that will actually happen, but it would be crazy cool. Small maps may also be taken out of rotation, so I think the quality of the maps we're going to play on will increase dramatically in 2015. Bigger, better and more numerous.
  
• A lot of work is being put into making MWO more friendly to new players, such as letting new players fight 4 vs 4 matches on small maps and improving UI. This doesn't affect me directly, but it means that we'll hopefully get a lot of new players when this game hits Steam. And they won't quit out of frustration. Which means the number of players may stay the same, or even grow a little. Which means the game will stay alive longer.

Yup, these three are pretty sweet. Also appreciate that the window for CW drops has been removed, this was really restrictive on when teams could compete and think it will allow for a larger player base to get involved in CW.

Lily from animove, on 14 November 2014 - 05:03 AM, said:

yes hopefully those rekcless 140kph lights will hit their nose on the ground when they rush into buildings and mechs.

*Cough* yes, lets also hope that team mates are mindful of the not so reckless lights that have a high contribution to the team! Its a two way street...

[Keira RAVEN McKenna]

The Wakelord, on 14 November 2014 - 10:30 PM, said:

4v4 sounds awesome! I'd love it if in the general PUG queue the team sized was randomised between 12v12, 8v8 & 4v4.

Cry. Lights are already avoided so much. Heavies & Assaults already have so much in their favour - why add this?

Also Urbie could be cool or super lame. All depends on how large the mech is.

Because it needs adding. I hate that my mech can run around and through other mechs. It just seems wrong and this way I can jump off buildiings onto mech heads!

Actually... its going to be funny watching team mates pushing and shoving each other through alleyways and at spawn!

Edited by Keira RAVEN McKenna, 14 November 2014 - 10:41 PM.

[Alistair Winter]

Keira RAVEN McKenna, on 14 November 2014 - 10:37 PM, said:

Actually... its going to be funny watching team mates pushing and shoving each other through alleyways and at spawn!

Speaking of which, they really need to spread the 3 lances apart on all maps, in all game modes.

If they're still dropping 12 mechs within 10 feet of each other in Forest Colony when collisions are implemented, the internet will explode. Two AFK mechs and suddenly the whole team has to take a 1-minute detour.

[Kodyn]

I'm not sure anyone is realizing just how much work and coding it would take just to properly implement a working collision/melee system into this game...

We're talking months of theorizing, coding, then comes re-balancing every mech in the game to account for melee combat, much, much testing, re-balancing, missing mechs that will inevitably in some way be able to abuse the system, re-balancing, and eventual removal after half the players leave because they realize it's buggy Robo-Mortal Kombat instead of a "thinking man's shooter".

[Prezimonto]

Dimento Graven, on 14 November 2014 - 07:42 AM, said:

I disagree, I think a "noob" queue of 4v4 on smaller maps is a great way to go.

Keeping them locked out of the general queue until they either join a unit (where theoretically they will have other players to assist them in learning the game), or until their ELO breaks a certain level.

As I currently understand it, this is more or less how WoT is handling their game, ensuring that new players NEVER have to suffer a stomp from veterans under normal gaming circumstances, and visa versa, a veteran doesn't get stuck on a noob team just to push their elo into an 'acceptable' range for MM.

It's actually not how WoT deals with things. Their tiering system somewhat keeps the most predatory veterans out of low level matches, but nothing actually stops someone from ranking up a tier 2 tank with full crew, equipment, consumables and stomping newbies, it's just not a profitable endeavor.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

FupDup, on 14 November 2014 - 09:52 PM, said:

That was in fact the Bad's Head.

Hey that head wasnt that bad when it came out...






Albeit 7 months ago; I havent tried it recently

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Keira RAVEN McKenna, on 14 November 2014 - 10:31 PM, said:

I can do it by bending both my legs from straight out to having both feet by my butt, then you end up on your knees... then stand up... no arms needed.

Just tried it on the kitchen floor a few times and got the weirdest looks from my boyfriend, he didnt say a word though... just quietly backed away.

Now try it while getting shot at XD

Kodyn, on 14 November 2014 - 10:58 PM, said:

I'm not sure anyone is realizing just how much work and coding it would take just to properly RE-implement a working collision/melee system into this game...

fixt

Keira RAVEN McKenna, on 14 November 2014 - 10:37 PM, said:

Because it needs adding. I hate that my mech can run around and through other mechs. It just seems wrong and this way I can jump off buildiings onto mech heads!

Actually... its going to be funny watching team mates pushing and shoving each other through alleyways and at spawn!

Itll be fuinny seeing falling lights when they try to nuthug

[Hades Trooper]

Bigbacon, on 14 November 2014 - 05:19 AM, said:

yea! more reasons for folks not to use lights.

now that small pebble that makes you fly into the sky and take leg damage will now make you fall over also along with the million other poorly made map objects.

when they re-add knockdown, I will never use my lights again cause I'm sure the other mechs won't be falling over.

either that or leave knock down to CW only.

Obviously then you don't have the skills to pilot a light, i played back in closed beta in my jenner and loved collisions, it meant you had to think as a light rather than just now being invincible as no one can touch, you.

Get in close expect to be knbocked down pest

[Keira RAVEN McKenna]

hahaha like little toddlers running into things and bouncing onto their butts

[Eboli]

I too have a fair concern regarding collision implementation.

I remember the days where the general tactic was to knock down the enemy and then the rest of the team shot the enemy mech to pieces before they were able to get up. This tactic was very effective and became the norm. Some may say it was a good form of griefing as well.

In most cases I was certainly able to avoid knockdowns due to piloting error so this is not a worry of mine if implemented again.

Just wait till weekend comps start where players are competing for kills and will literally run over their teammates to get the final points.

I also remember the days of massive pile ups in restricted areas which created some very colourful language in chat plus being a lighter mech player being knocked down frequently by larger mechs whom sometimes just didn't care at all.

I can see all of this happening again.

BUT, after the above I would not rule out Collisions as long as PGI thinks long and hard about its implementation. As a player in Australia where rubber banding still occurs at high speed and you infrequently find yourself facing a different position, PGI has to ensure that all these problems have to be fixed before such a system gets implemented.

I also believe that damage must occur to both mechs and that there is a chance of the larger mech toppling over as well. Larger mechs should take much longer to get up than lighter mechs. I am sure that this would be easy to arrange within the program.

It just needs to ensure that heavier mechs don't have it all their way which does seem to be the way of a lot of comments here.

Cheers
Eboli

Edited by Eboli, 15 November 2014 - 12:25 AM.

[SaltBeef]

It will be the end of Butt science Proctology mech piloting. This is not a bad thing.

[Krivvan]

Alistair Winter, on 14 November 2014 - 04:44 AM, said:

But it will push the game in the right direction. Towards more realism and less arcade-style.

Who says realism is the right direction...?

[BlackBeltJones]

All your hopes and dreams just 90 days after CW.
All this has happened before, and all this will happen again...

[luxebo]

AS LONG AS THEY DON'T BRING BACK DRAGON BOWLING I'M OK FOR KNOCKDOWNS.

This is all I must say. Weapons that shoot people in the face heavily and knock em down, yes to an acceptable manner.

Lights that trip Atlases and Dire Wolves because they were having a good bump and hump for two seconds, please no.

[Kodyn]

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely hate having mechs up my ******, and I would love it if whenever idiots run into me they take damage...and yes, i do know that it has been implemented before Buddah, that's why I used the word "working".

I just do not see melee combat nor offensive collision damage as being a positive thing, nor easy for PGI to develop and implement. Seems like one of the absolute lowest priorities right now for this game, with all the other issues that need addressing, and plans they already have for streamlining the combat as-is.


EDIT: Really, a medical, dictionary definition of a body part is auto-censored? Now that's just sad...

Edited by Kodyn, 15 November 2014 - 12:33 AM.

[Keira RAVEN McKenna]

BlackBeltJones, on 15 November 2014 - 12:28 AM, said:

All your hopes and dreams just 90 days after CW.
All this has happened before, and all this will happen again...

Battlestar Galactica right? I KNEW I'd heard that before