45 replies to this topic

[Errant Variable]

The light mech queue has been pretty lonely lately. 4% right now, I've seen it as low as 3, and I've been in several games tonight with just one light per side.

Everyone - what would make you drop in a light? The ratio should be closer to 30% than 3%. No polls, anything from "better jumpjets" to "urbanmech" to "maneuverability overhaul". Also if you regularly run lights, chime in with why.

For me, the problem is that I'm honestly bored with playing lights and that they have little to contribute aside from biting ankles. I enjoy playing my Jenner-D and usually do well, but it only has so much carry. I mostly still use it because I hate being part of the problem, and because there are enough tunnel-vision LRMers lately that I can occasionally ruin their day. There's also the tendency that you'll get LRMs or a lurking Stormcrow waiting until your target's torso shows red before they open up with an alpha and walk away with your kill.

My fixes? IS MLAS back to 3 heat, open up jumpjets to more light chassis, or mitigate pinpoint alphas. And properly sized big guns on lights and mediums. I would play the RVN-4X into the ground if it had a silly big gauss rifle sitting on top of the left side.

Pipedream: turning ability approaches zero at full speed, and acceleration takes longer. Possibly better implemented as any significant turn slows you down a lot (the longer the turn, the slower you get down to arbitrary limit [walk speed?] This will make light mechs and to a lesser extent mediums far more agile compared to the less adaptable assault crowd, increase the viability of hit-and-fade against less aware mechs, but would also lower the ability of lights to pull off 150-KPH madness.

[El Bandito]

http://mwomercs.com/...-completely-op/

[Kilo 40]

I enjoy running my LRM kitfox, but it just doesn't get enough damage or kills to make it worth running as often as I'd like.

[Brody319]

I'm not having any problems running lights. Plus the T-wolf just came out. Seriously, there is a reason the que can go up or down without it being "that whole weight class must just be bad"

[WrathOfDeadguy]

But... 150kph 171kph madness is fun.

[Xetelian]

Give lights a 15% Cbill boost and pow problem solved.

[Lucky Moniker]

This is also due to the faction tournament going on right now, People are putting up big numbers for this, hence why lights are being ignored.

[Caboosegg]

Love lights. The issue isnt people dont use them its more

Timberwolf for cbills
Free medium and assaults from pgi meaning more to master
People being lazyand using lrm boats to rack up easy poits in the tourney.

Only issue I find playing lights now is that my raven 3l is a shell of a mech. Still has the
Quick shoot it, it has ecm tag to its name but mass of bap killed it.

However at same time quirks have made previously average lights like the locust fun again.

One last note:
All hail the overlord firestarter... please dont kill me wih your wubness

Edited by Caboosegg, 17 November 2014 - 12:02 AM.

[MechWarrior849305]

Xetelian, on 16 November 2014 - 11:48 PM, said:

Give lights a 15% Cbill boost and pow problem solved.

Yeah, because of low C-Bill income. 'Cause overall formula forces you to score big with big guns or to use narc/tag light and beside that be totally useless. IE in short - lack of role warfare. Enjoy your Counter Strike MechWarrior Online

[RiggsIron]

It is past time to stop being a stickler for 'lore'.

Not unless the massive balance issue that exists in pnp game is added back into the MMO that was not added.

Game was balanced around random hits not aimed shots.

One thing lights and even mediums need is the ability to add ECM to any model for example - and have their default sensors go for longer range - like BAP for free on every light mech.

That would give them a much bigger use and role.

An MMO is supposed to be every player has a more or less equal 'character'/class/mech.

that is very, very, very far from the case right now for tonnage - and most of that unbalance is right from not having random hits. So the game is already not 'as in the pnp game' - so just change it to be more balanced.

[Ursh]

Because there seems to only be one formula for routinely racking up big scores with an IS light...jump jets combined with 4+ medium lasers and 140kph+

Jenners and Firestarters combine being at the top of their weight bracket with huge engine caps and large numbers of energy hardpoints and jumpjets.

It's hard for other lights to get much traction when there's clearly one superior formula.

[MechWarrior849305]

Ursh, on 17 November 2014 - 12:03 AM, said:

Because there seems to only be one formula for routinely racking up big scores with an IS light...jump jets combined with 4+ medium lasers and 140kph+

You've forgot(ten) wonky hitboxes

[NovaFury]

Lights are fun, but mediums happen to be my favorite weight class now.

I just can't stand randomly dying to PPFLD weapons at maximum speed through my armor. Also since 12v12, increased general deathball size has significantly reduced the weight class's freedom of zipping through an enemy formation to get accurate data/harass rearline units.

Without it being suicidal, that is.

[Mordin Ashe]

Kilo 40, on 16 November 2014 - 11:10 PM, said:

I enjoy running my LRM kitfox, but it just doesn't get enough damage or kills to make it worth running as often as I'd like.

This. I very much enjoy my light Mechs but they simply don't perform, not as my mediums/heavies/fatties do. I mostly play Clan Mechs and Clan lights are a sad sight. I don't mind playing in a style different to what others do or expect, after all my best games in MWO were in a light Mech. But the Mech bust be worth something, be good at something. Currently IS lights are good at running up close and away. Clan lights, which I would consider playing 90% of my game time, are not good at anything, and it tells the story of why we see many DWs, TWs and SCs and rarely any Kit Foxes or Adders.

[Mad Porthos]

Here is an incentive. Remove the unique penalty given to legged lights. Any other mech, you get legged you are down to half speed or 40kph, whichever is slower, right? Light mech gets dropped to 15kph with a stunlock more or less SO THAT YOU CAN FINISH THEM OFF. If they survive somehow and go limping off at 40kph... even a single miniscule tick of damage restores the stunlock 15kph speed... how is this fair or reasonable, when it seems other mechs after losing a leg to mishap can still limp around w out an unrealistic paralysis fit when someone even licks a er large over them at 1200m range to slow them down, until assaults moving a 40kph can finally arrive? Warm light regularly tickles any legged light this way even when normally they could have quite a bit o fight left.

Mediums, heavies and assaults dont have to deal with this stunlock feature implemented in the days when lights were impossible to hit even standing still or doing 40kph. All you have to do to avoid it even is run a cicada, the medium light mech o doom, then you can limp around at the full whopping 40kph and still maybe manuver a little after misfortune legs you. Thing is though, ya shouldnt have to.

Edited by Mad Porthos, 17 November 2014 - 12:32 AM.

[Zetrein]

Errant Variable, on 16 November 2014 - 10:52 PM, said:

For me, the problem is that I'm honestly bored with playing lights and that they have little to contribute aside from biting ankles. I enjoy playing my Jenner-D and usually do well, but it only has so much carry. I mostly still use it because I hate being part of the problem...

It sounds like you're in much the same boat I am. I've been a Jenner pilot since early on, and while I've expanded into Centurions since then, I still actively avoid anything above the medium category to avoid being Part Of The Problem.

Of course, that puts me in this annoying place because they did crap with Jenner and CN9-A quirks, but that's off topic.

Anyway, if I were to change a single thing to help lights, it would be to throw a little more tabletop into the mix. In TT rules, you effectively have dodge-bonuses based on how fast your mech is moving, these are applied to all weapons. For most everything, we've already got that bonus through simple speed. The one thing we don't have it apply to? LRMs.

So that's my simple (likely not simple to code) fix, that could be applied to all mechs (not just lights): Have LRM lock on times increase in relation to the current speed of the target. Those guys hiding behind the hills, or those slow mechs plodding along? Easy targets. That damn Locust? Let the mediums deal with it, you're hunting Direwhales.

[Zakath]

The problem isn't so much the lights, as it is a few of the maps. There's a world of difference between playing a light on Forest Colony or Tourmaline Desert. The older maps were designed for 8v8 if memory serves, and it shows with the crowding.

I enjoy the occasional romp with the Jenner Oxide, load it up with SRM4's and go nuts at breakneck speeds. Get one of the bigger maps and it's horribly fun, but you can't carry your team if the rest goes ahead and dies. Not enough ammo

Only issue I have with Lights really is that they take quite a bit of kitting out to really work, you almost have to invest in an expensive XL engine to be viable, and there isn't much of a reward unless you tag/narc an enemy. Not that I have a good idea how to sort that issue.

[MikeBend]

Just bought me an ECM Spider, just because Lights queue is so small. Of course its a pain in the ... to run around with standard 240 and 1 med laser, but i enjoy myself giving ECM cover to assaults. The 3% of lights is enough motivation for me to run a light, even if i die horribly fast

[Reality Sculptor]

I generally favor mediums more than lights as I feel I can contribute more to the team (kills and damage-wise). However I also love my 3L. I play in my 3L most of the time when dropping with friends because they will not take a light and I'd rather find a game quickly then sit for 5 minutes while the MM finds a game. Also I quite enjoy the thrill of having the possibilty to get one-shotted when harrassing the enemy. That's my incentive.

[The Wakelord]

Why I play lights
- I like maneuverability
- I like the ability to react (taking 5 seconds to turn in an Atlas to chase a new red mark makes me angry)
- I like small targets that can be missed (so I also liked ECM).

Why I think people don't like lights
- Too hectic
- Die too quick if you move in
- Each attack is not satisfying
- No "weight" to the movements
- Being seen as "wasting a slot" when you could have brought an assault mech
- Low c-bill reward compared to heavy/assault ($130k+ and I am super pleased. This is what heavies seem to get normally)

What I think would improve lights
- Increased speed cap when legged (60kph)
- Much faster JJ acceleration
- Significantly improved (ongoing, second by second) bonuses for spotting / scouting / squirrel / generally-being-a-light. They've done a good start with hit-and-run & scout bonuses. 2 examples would be (1) Second-by-second reward for holding a lock if you are the closest or (2) Being the only allied mech within 500m of an enemy mech
- Not changing the physical size of the gun to fit the mech (as you say, a full-sized PPC would look awesome on a spider) - people would play it for the cool, but cry about too large box-sizes
- Strip ECM from any heavy/assault. ECM works great when placed on a mobile, fragile mech that dedicates a big portion of its tonnage to ECM. When it placed on a sturdy slow tank is too OP.
- Buff missiles & ballistics in some way for lights. People currently do great with laser lights, but ballistic lights tend to fail in comparison (3 best lights are 2ERLL raven, 8SPL firestarter 4ML,2MG firestarter, 8ML jenner)

Edited by The Wakelord, 17 November 2014 - 01:55 AM.