54 replies to this topic

[Nightshade24]

luxebo, on 03 March 2015 - 09:52 PM, said:

Bit cluttered but that's ok.

Yeah harasser might be better fit as scouts are more speedy (i.e. SDR-5V, etc) and just spot enemies. Highlander is sorta more brawler (skirmisher in my opinion are longer ranged, and due to the low slung hardpoints it's more of a brawler). Banshee, Blackjack, Treb, yeah you are correct.

For weapon groups at least I mean by the split of em, not necessarily which buttons to push but what weapons should be in groups and which should be in another group. So for example STK should group ML together and chain fire LRMs instead rather than separate MLs, making it harder to use to some extent.

Sorry for the forum freaking out on my post

(at least on my view. it has litered command and stuff like <br /> )

Skirmisher is the term for something that is a 'jack of all trades, squat at none"

It can poke at someone at 600 meters BUT not as good as say a jagermech or a catapult K2.

It can brawl at ranges like 100-250 BUT not as good as say a centurion.

It can run pretty fast but it can't run as fast as a striker or a scout like a raven or an ice ferret.


So yea, anything that has a range of weapons with a good damage from each range ranging from 1 to 250, 251 to 500, and 500 to 650 and moves over 57 kph, that's basicly a skirmisher. (Also hardpoint location doesn't really mean to much about range. it just makes it harder to hill hump or take cover... keep in mind there are Direwolfs, Atlases, and Cataphracts considered "Snipers" even though there weapons are very low slung...

OR the nova which has 2 ER PPC's which lore wise the art has it hang as low as it's knee....)



@ weapon groups. well I think you need to clearify this. As being a player of MW: O for 3 years and have been into BT since I was a little kid. If I failed to understand that. I do not think a guy who first played MW: O as there first BT game would understand.



Btw harasser isn't technically a role, it's just the attack method of a light mech.
Scouts for me in MW: O differ from the normal role as it normally means "have something for scouting devoted at least..."

TAG.
NARC
BAP,
ECM (to a degree)
Those is what I count for a scout in MW: O. As having an assault mech with a standard 400 engine and 5 small lasers or a mech with 4 mg's 1 med las isn't really a scout in MW: O



Also the highlander normal configs are considered a sniper. So yea... If it isn't a sniper anymore then an atlas isn't a juggernaut anymore

(btw Juggernaut is basicly what most people in MW: O call a "brawler" when reffering to an assault.

pretty much it's LOTS of close range firepower and being slow while made to take hits. Like a king crab or atlas.)

[luxebo]

Thanks on the comments of the roles, yeah not super super familiar with all of em but I just try to refer to em by the way they run in this game.

The Highlander can't really do much in terms of sniping in that config, though I guess the actual normal build (HGN-732 is very like a sniper).

Yeah juggernaughts are sorta niche in this game; even then they are more brawlers than anything that can zombie better than other heavy/assault mechs.

And also agreed with scout, those are more for support I would say but in this game they also apply to scouts. I think better term for the hard-hitters (Jenners/Cicadas/Firestarters) is gunboat (laserboat in this case).

[Nightshade24]

luxebo, on 03 March 2015 - 10:42 PM, said:

Thanks on the comments of the roles, yeah not super super familiar with all of em but I just try to refer to em by the way they run in this game.

The Highlander can't really do much in terms of sniping in that config, though I guess the actual normal build (HGN-732 is very like a sniper).

Yeah juggernaughts are sorta niche in this game; even then they are more brawlers than anything that can zombie better than other heavy/assault mechs.

And also agreed with scout, those are more for support I would say but in this game they also apply to scouts. I think better term for the hard-hitters (Jenners/Cicadas/Firestarters) is gunboat (laserboat in this case).

Well juggernauts also has a quota on how 'fast' they are... which pretty much means anything arounds 50's and lower that is mainly a close range build and high armour is a juggernaut.

This is why no light, medium, and most heavies can be one and not even all assaults can be one. These are things like the big ol 100 tonners or 95's and rarely 90's.

The atlas and king crabs fit those quite nicely.

I have nearly over 130 mechs, not trying to boast about it as I know people who own literally all mechs...

No seriously, there's one guy who has all the gold mechs, champions, promotion, packs, heros, etc.

So do not think I am a braggart or anything. All I'm trying to say is I do play a lot of mechs and I do have juggernauts and for me they are still pretty playable. I do not really consider it niche (if you want to go technical then my counter argument anyhting that isn't 100% top of the meta is a niche then =P

And hte term you are looking for for a hard hitting mech with speed is a "Striker". This is suitable to stuff like the Ice ferret. In MW: O I guess these can reffer to the 'heavy hitting' lights but the thing is these lights are not that heavy hitting... You can make a light do a lot more damage (say a 2 large pulse laser, 4 small laser firestarter) or the urban mech with a AC 10, or LBX 10, or Ac 20, or Gauss rifle.

But yea, I know what you mean. But I do not really think lights can do much beyond scout, harras, and in some cases LRM boat. (Urbie is the only one I can deem for a brawler(?)

Also in the cicadas seat, it isn't that heavy of a hitter for it's weight class and tonnage. ^^;

I think sarna has a definition of each role. they are kinda fuzzy around the edges on what is and isn't.




Also if you make "Gunboat" a term for a mech with lots of direct firepower weapons, well the think is the nova , hunchback, and some assaults blow anything those lights can do out of the water. x3

Also some light mechs not in game... for eg te Piranha has 12 mg's, 2 med las, 1 small las.

[luxebo]

The thing is that Juggernauts use their armor as their key, which even the quite tanky Atlas can only sustain a certain amount. That is the issue with tanking in the game, it isn't fully effective and has problems.

Yeah, gunboat is sorta for swayback etc. I usually use striker as a term for stuff like the Jenner/Firestarter/Cicada trial, etc. The Swayback and Nova etc are more gunboats than are the striker type classes.

[Nightshade24]

luxebo, on 03 March 2015 - 11:15 PM, said:

The thing is that Juggernauts use their armor as their key, which even the quite tanky Atlas can only sustain a certain amount. That is the issue with tanking in the game, it isn't fully effective and has problems.

Yeah, gunboat is sorta for swayback etc. I usually use striker as a term for stuff like the Jenner/Firestarter/Cicada trial, etc. The Swayback and Nova etc are more gunboats than are the striker type classes.

Well it may not be that noticable at times. but when you are versing 2 smaller enemies at the same time or so you quite notice that heavier amount of armour. It may not be the same as it was in older games, but it's still a valid thing and an atlas sure can take more hits then say a centurion.

[luxebo]

Anyone to speak of the Mist Lynx Prime stock? How well did any of you do? Strategies?

Anyway gonna update up the trial guide. Some Clan mechs are good, some are very strong, some are a bit hard to use, and some are insanely hardcore (really 2 of em). Credit to Redeagle86 on some advice for the Hellbringer, Stormcrow-C, and Kit Fox-C.

Quoting Redeagle86:

Hellbringer Prime:
"This is a decent sniping build, but does run extremely hot. Advantages are ECM, disadvantages are heat, and the fact that more experienced players have learned to shoot the left torso (right as it's facing them) and away goes most of the weapons and ECM, so if they don't know how to torso-twist, they'll learn quickly or suffer. Use the right side to shield yourself, and remember that your armour is quite weak, especially on the legs! (only 38 points of armour)
The ERPPC's are great for long-range sniping, but you don't even get 3 salvos (both at the same time). If you fire 3 salvos, you overheat for 5 seconds. I'd run it as ERPPC's at ranges of 400m or more, and either the ERML's chain-fired or grouped, personal preference, at targets under 400m. MG's are great for ripping components open, but you only have a quarter-ton per gun, so they should be used on orange components for best chances.
The SSRM-6 is good for anti-light-work, but with only 1 ton, that's 16 shots. Cooldown is 6 seconds, which means that it's not a very good anti-light weapon.
Additionally, the fact that the arms have ERPPC's mean that there is NO side-to-side arm movement, only up and down.
Without any skills unlocked, an alpha-strike will put them up at 90% heat."

Stormcrow C:
"Not nearly as hot as it could be, but still a somewhat effective build. Heat is here.
LPL is your longest (accurate) long-range weapon, and can be used to 'snipe', or at least engage in long-range-ish combat.
MPL's are great for stripping armour off closing (and close) foes, I'd use them around 300m or less, even though maximum (optimum) range is 330m, unless zoomed in, targets can be a little tough to see and accurately fire torso-weapons at that range (especially for newer players). As usual, the LBX is a great weapon for enemies once they're cored.
Because there is a 'restricted' type weapon in one of the arms, the side-to-side movement is limited to about half the regular amount (not sure what the total movement is).
Because of it's speed, it's a pretty good 'Mech to start out with, especially for pilots new to the supposedly OP Clan Tech."

Kit Fox C:
"The basic 'Mech, very useful. ECM and triple AMS with 4 tons (8000 rounds) ammo. Tag provides 750m worth of LOS spotting, the ERLL has essentially the same maximum (optimum) range, great for sniping. The SPL provides very adequate close-in-defence, while the MG's are best for stripped components and "OMG I'M GONNA DIE" fights. Legs are even more lightly armoured than normal, and this 'Mech has no JJ, so be careful when running around.
Be aware that even though this 'Mech is a Light, it does not play like an IS light, it's too slow, and most IS mediums can even outrun it, so range is the friend of the 'Mech."

Edited by luxebo, 04 March 2015 - 05:51 PM.

[Nightshade24]

luxebo, on 04 March 2015 - 05:22 PM, said:

Anyone to speak of the Mist Lynx Prime stock? How well did any of you do? Strategies?

Sadly to say. It's **** and I am famous for trying stock + builds or stock ++ (or in clan mechs, just stock)

My best advice is to have other mechs to support you and attack at 200 to 350 meters so both LRM's and streaks can hit the mech and possibly MGs'.

This thing is extremely ammo dependent and it only has 1 ton of ammo for each weapon (or less)

[luxebo]

Yeah all I can say is as you've said, very tough to play. Too easy to kill, lacking strong weaponry, etc.

Though quoting from redeagle86 again:
Mist Lynx Prime:
"AC/20, 4 ML, yeah... It's really weak. The only playstyle I can think of is to use up all of the LRM ammo prior to actually engaging anything, and don't be afraid of getting up high with those JJ. I've even gotten on top of buildings in Crimson Straight (the tall ones by theta). Pair that with the bugs of the last couple of days, and you might be able to survive for a while, at least until the LRM's (or a sniper) kill you.
SSRM's can be used with the MG's for defence, but this 'Mech should really only be brought into close combat once most of the enemy is cored, aka at the end.
But going to the Dire, it's actually not as strong as it could be, even keeping the weapon loadout. It's very low on ammunition, especially on the UAC's. The LBX has 30 shots, which is decent enough, but you only have 36 shots (or something like that) per gun (1/2 ton), and that gets blown through very, very fast. The PPC's are good for long-range only, MPL's are for stripping armour off close-range, along with the UAC's. LBX is for when those components are open, and the ERSL is for ... ? close-range "I'm gonna die" maybe? Also, no LAA's (Lower Arm Actuators), so no side to side movement for the arms.
The SCR is the strongest of them all, IMO."

An issue with that strat though is fall damage, as you can easily leg yourself flying up/down from there.

[luxebo]

Been away from this thread for a while, but:
-Will update with WVR-6K(C) and JM6-A(C), both are quite good at what they will be doing (much better than some past mechs, like RVN-3L(C), STK-3F(C), etc).
-Might post on this thread a method of reupdating ALL trials both Clan and IS, or open up a new thread. What do you guys think?

[luxebo]

IF the builds all change to min-max builds, I don't know how efficient it'll be for me to recreate my trial mech guide.

BUT, if B33f or any of you forum dwellers stick around to post some additional guides/strats, it's definitely welcome and would be awesome for new players to have those strategies in mind when they pilot the trials.

[luxebo]

..2 months later

Well I'm still active and ready to help out on my old trial guide.

Likely I'll try to reorganize this thread/create a new one. PGI has reworked each trial for the better and most are viable (few are still needing work.) http://mwomercs.com/...gust-4th-patch/

As of right now, there are some good trials. SDR-5K(C) got a speed boost, and RVN-3L(C) is fully viable and is the best CW light you can fit in this trial rotation (has the range). TBT-7M(C) is the LRM boat, but is low on ammo so don't recommend for CW. GRF-1S(C) and QKD-4G(C) are both close range brawlers, so also don't recommend for CW atm (you CAN fit in one but I think it's preferable to fit in longer ranged mechs due to the ranged nature of the maps). TDR-9SE(C) is definitely a great trial with enough range for CW. BNC-3M(C) and VTR-9S(C) are both very useful as well as they have proper heat/ammo configs compared to before's trials.

So all in all, both lights are faster and rangier of the lights, which will teach overall range and electronics/speed versus guns, while there is an LRM boat and two brawlers in the medium-heavy range. The heavies and assaults are perfect in teaching the role of the assault/heavy and has plenty of armor while maintaining decent speeds.

[Elizander]

Yup, would be great to update the trials for newbies on a new thread. I think weapon grouping might be good to include to help them not overheat on some builds.

Not all the champions are trials though.

[luxebo]

They do rotate the trials around every once in a while (takes a very long time now though).

[gunihun]

New in this game. This post really helps. Thanks Luxebo

[aGentleWarrior]

gunihun, on 21 January 2016 - 08:03 PM, said:

New in this game. This post really helps. Thanks Luxebo

Yeah but i noticed that it wasn't updated... I think some of the trial mechs changed thier loadout. Some problem children feel much easier to handle now.