94 replies to this topic

[UrsusMorologus]

If it increased protection rate it would be worth the tonnage. As it stands right now, the same missile spam that can instantly kill you without AMS can also kill you with it. And when you learn how to mostly survive without it (stay near cover, know your ECM buddy, use Deprivation module) then its completely unecessary.

Edited by UrsusMorologus, 27 November 2014 - 10:06 AM.

[Metus regem]

GoldenFleece, on 27 November 2014 - 09:34 AM, said:

Good joke. As one AMS is shooting down what, 3 missiles from an IS launcher and maybe 5 missiles from a Clan LRM20 ?
The average LRM count is around 50 or 60. So you get a little something from 1.5 tons invested in an AMS, but for defence it's a joke compared to ECM or Radar Deprivation...

It maybe a drop in the bucket, but that little bit of missiles shot down are missiles that are not hitting you or a teammate...

My Kit Fox gives up a lot of tonnage to mount triple AMS+3tons of ammo+TAG+ECM, most of that is not there for me, but my team. And I have never had anyone whine that I put out next to no damage in a match with that build.

[damonwolf]

R Razor, on 26 November 2014 - 09:28 PM, said:

If Lurms aren't easy mode and require inordinate skill to use, why do you never see them in the comp scene, always see them in the pug scene and see double and triple the amount when a challenge comes along that rewards damage and assists?

Nuff said.

Why, because they deal the worst and least damage in the game for a major weapon system, and are the easiest to counter/avoid/nullify. They only do 1 point of damage per missile, they tend to do damage across several Mech parts rather than one.

So, no, the competition boys don't take them because of your idiotic "skill" argument, they take them because they want effective, efficient weapon systems that will get them a win.

P.S. And to be a good LRM pilot does take skill. Sh!t LRM pilots don't do jack for damage or get many kills/assists.

Edited by damonwolf, 27 November 2014 - 11:31 AM.

[R Razor]

damonwolf, on 27 November 2014 - 11:23 AM, said:

Why, because they deal the worst and least damage in the game for a major weapon system, and are the easiest to counter/avoid/nullify. They only do 1 point of damage per missile, they tend to do damage across several Mech parts rather than one.

So, no, the competition boys don't take them because of your idiotic "skill" argument, they take them because they want effective, efficient weapon systems that will get them a win.

P.S. And to be a good LRM pilot does take skill. Sh!t LRM pilots don't do jack for damage or get many kills/assists.

Whatever makes you feel good about yourself pal.........the poll didn't lie..........lurms are the ultimate no skill weapon, you know it, I know it, and most people playing the game know it, that's why you see them in PUG drops and even more of them when challenges come along......so folks that lack skill (you know who you are) can achieve the challenge and feel good about yourselves just like those of us that do it without the lurm crutch do.

[DJFrost]

Using AMS is a joke. The amount of LRMs in most pug matches is a joke. PGI should really consider limiting the number of LRM boats that get brought into a match. When a good chunk of the team gets smoked because a couple pilots got in close enough to render LRMs useless, it is obviously no help to their own team, and the constant rain of LRMs just makes most players hide and do nothing. Top that off with the lack of cover on many maps, and it is easy to see why a lot of people are getting fed up with it. I would love to be able to load AMS and have it actually help me, but until they fix it and make it an actual workable defense tool, I will just keep the extra slots for weapons, or larger engines, they are of much more use.

[damonwolf]

R Razor, on 27 November 2014 - 11:33 AM, said:

...the poll didn't lie...

What poll? You mean the biased, badly written one that is a current topic in the forums? That is not a significant measure of the viewpoints on LRMs, nor is it a measure of skill. If you want to read what skill it takes to make a good pilot, then read my long post in poll thread.
I will not debate you on the skill part because you appear to be completely biased, and incapable of rational discussion or reasoning ability. G'day.

Edited by damonwolf, 27 November 2014 - 11:51 AM.

[Saobh]

R Razor, on 27 November 2014 - 11:33 AM, said:

Whatever makes you feel good about yourself pal.........the poll didn't lie..........lurms are the ultimate no skill weapon, you know it, I know it, and most people playing the game know it, that's why you see them in PUG drops and even more of them when challenges come along......so folks that lack skill (you know who you are) can achieve the challenge and feel good about yourselves just like those of us that do it without the lurm crutch do.

Indeed everyone who uses LRMs are no skills hacks while you oh mighty one are the ultimate God who walks on the corpses of all those unworthy newbs.

Where in the rules is it written that you must slay your enemy only face to face with 'honor' ? Samurais had the same mentality, guess what firearms made them extinct.

Edited by Saobh, 27 November 2014 - 12:29 PM.

[R Razor]

Pretty sure I didn't say everyone that uses them....generally I find it's the ones that rush in here to defend them the most vociferously that can't handle a game without them.

Just in case you fail to grasp my point........Most folks that use them are lacking in skill, no doubt about that, but I've seen some that actually get their own targets and move in to battle with the team as opposed to your standard (hide behind the hill and wait for my team to do the heavy lifting) players.

[damonwolf]

Quote

no doubt about that

That quote applies to your bias and lack of reasoning ability as well.

Edited by damonwolf, 27 November 2014 - 12:53 PM.

[Clownwarlord]

1 AMS can handle 1 lrm 5 if you add in the modules at max level then it can handle a lrm 10. But that is useless with just one mech taking it and then it is again useless because lrm boats usually have 40 to 80 tubes. Yes you even see the 100 lrm stalker at times ... if you don't believe me check out youtube.

So title is wrong Heck if you have 12 mechs that have max out AMS modules then maybe if there is only 120 lrm tubes on the enemy team, but most likely there are close to 200 tubes if not more.

I haven't even begun to talk about AMS ammunition which usually runs it self out at a 5 to 1. So you burn 5 rounds to knock out 1 missile or somewhere close to that it isn't 1 to 1. If it was then heck everyone would be using it.

[damonwolf]

Quote

lrm boats usually have 40 to 80 tubes

I will fix this for you: lrm boats usually have 30 to 60 tubes. Rarely, rarely, will you see more than that. There is a few LRM 70 Warhawks out there, but more than that? Bah! Those are worthless troll builds.
More than 60 (50 in many Mechs) and the Mechs have ammo, heat, and survivability (armor, secondary weapons) issues. Most Mechs that carry more than 40 usually have a lack of effective secondary weapons and if you get in their face, you can have yourself a quick snack.

Edited by damonwolf, 27 November 2014 - 01:21 PM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Wow... I think this thread can be completed in one passage:

"If you prevent 45 missiles from impacting members of your team, then 1.5 tons of AMS has served its purpose. If you bring 2 AMS and 2 tons of ammo, then it has justified its weight if you prevent 90 missiles from impacting your team. AMS is a form of add-on armor, and should be revered in terms of weight divided by number of accurate missiles it intercepts."

That sums it up. Divide weight by the damage it mitigates, and then you can calculate AMS's worth.

[Saobh]

R Razor, on 27 November 2014 - 12:44 PM, said:

Pretty sure I didn't say everyone that uses them....generally I find it's the ones that rush in here to defend them the most vociferously that can't handle a game without them.

Just in case you fail to grasp my point........Most folks that use them are lacking in skill, no doubt about that, but I've seen some that actually get their own targets and move in to battle with the team as opposed to your standard (hide behind the hill and wait for my team to do the heavy lifting) players.

A good LRM boat isn't supposed to "find its own target" as that means that its in direct line of sight of the enemy and thus able toget sniped and as they are not brawler builds that are supposed to soak up damage they are very liable to get serveliy damaged by doing so.

So no a Good LRM boat isn't supposed to expose itself to get targets that's like saying that mobile artillery is supposed to be in visual view of the enemy to support its infantry... its not.

But I agree on the "follow you team close" because it 1/ lesseens the ttime the LRM flight time and thus better chance of hitting a target going to cover. /2 less chance of getting over whelmed by lights or flank snipers.

A good LRM boat should survive a good portion of the match as he is supposed to give support to his mates with indirect fire as long as possible and forcing the enemy team to constantly use cover in order to slow their progress.

Most bad LRM boats are more of a liability to their own team then anything else as they tend to die quickly while landing most of their lrms into buildings and hills.

Edited by Saobh, 27 November 2014 - 01:42 PM.

[R Razor]

I get it, you button pressers don't want your ez mode changed.........most likely PGI will agree with you so there's no need to worry about it. Meanwhile there will be daily (or even hourly) threads on how screwed the LRM spam is making the game......of course that is only players that are no good or new players though, which further reinforces PGI's assertion that there are plenty of folks playing the game............because after all, there wouldn't be so many posts about them being screwed up because they actually are right?

[-Halcyon-]

Jonny Slam, on 25 November 2014 - 11:00 PM, said:

IF YOU DON'T LIKE LRM'S THEN TAKE AMS

Yeah, ok.