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Sneak Peek: King Crab Assault Battlemech


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#321 HlynkaCG

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:28 AM

View PostAlek Ituin, on 07 December 2014 - 11:18 PM, said:


Well, you're late to the party. The issue was already wrapped up if you'd bothered to read any further.

As it happens, the C&C KGC-010 variant uses LB-X/10's and twin PPC's, not the iconic twin AC/20's of the combat variants. Sooooo, yeah... Still has a good battery of energy weapons, and the command variant is more than capable of downing an Atlas.

IMO, as far as front-line command units go, if your command Atlas can get its face wrecked by a command KGC you have the wrong front-line command unit. Which one can easily assume an Assault command unit will be, since why the hell else would you use an Assault C&C Mech over a Heavy or Medium?



As others have noted the things that made the Atlas the superior Command vehicle aren't really modeled in game.

Things like the KGC's status as a maintenance-hog / Hangar queen vs. the Atlas' larger cockpit, and superior avionics / communications gear. Never mind the TT implementations of things like convergence and and the benefits of having a full set of actuators.

To paraphrases Napoleon, 1 Assault mech at the point of decision is worth 100 over the next rise.

#322 verybad

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:42 AM

View PostAlek Ituin, on 07 December 2014 - 11:18 PM, said:


Well, you're late to the party. The issue was already wrapped up if you'd bothered to read any further.

As it happens, the C&C KGC-010 variant uses LB-X/10's and twin PPC's, not the iconic twin AC/20's of the combat variants. Sooooo, yeah... Still has a good battery of energy weapons, and the command variant is more than capable of downing an Atlas.

IMO, as far as front-line command units go, if your command Atlas can get its face wrecked by a command KGC you have the wrong front-line command unit. Which one can easily assume an Assault command unit will be, since why the hell else would you use an Assault C&C Mech over a Heavy or Medium?

:rolleyes:

You're looking at the combat capabilities.
Now no mechs really have better command capabilities in this game as command systems aren't really fluffed out (thoguh ECM is useful for staying alive longer)

However, the Atlas in the TT game was considered a superior command mech to pretty much everything. The King Crab could take one out (maybe, it's not a guarantee there, even if you are excited about the new mech) and it would be good for defending the command mech, but the King Crab wasn't famous for it's command computer, it was famous for it's dual AC-20s.

I know you're excited about the new mech, and that's fine, but please don't let that excitement make you declare stuff about the KC that isn't part of the lore. In battletech, the Atlas got the battlecomputer quirk.

Representing a tactical battle computer that offers more effective control of a combat force, the Battle Computer Quirk designates an advanced command unit. Having at least one in-play, with a conscious pilot or crew[7], grants a bonus to Initiative Rolls made by the unit's force, although this modifier is not cumulative with that granted by the presence of a Command BattleMech.[8] Applicable to: BattleMechs, Combat Vehicles and Support Vehicles.[2] I don't believe the KC did. In MWO, I think the KC coudl very well be a better fighter than the Atlas, but not necessarilly all the time, and it's still not going to have ECM so *mech* We;ll see.

Edited by verybad, 08 December 2014 - 10:43 AM.


#323 SgtMagor

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:55 AM

is the command console basically the same thing as a Clan targeting computer?

#324 Angel of Annihilation

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:57 AM

View PostSgtMagor, on 08 December 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

is the command console basically the same thing as a Clan targeting computer?


No it is pretty much the same thing as having the shared locks we do in normal gameplay.

#325 Fishbulb333

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 11:01 AM

View PostSgtMagor, on 08 December 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

is the command console basically the same thing as a Clan targeting computer?


Similar, not the same. Targetting computers improve target info gathering speed, zoom distance, sensor range, projectile speed, beam weapon range and crit chance for projectile/beam weapons, Command consoles just improve zoom distance, sensor range and target info gathering speed.

Source - http://mwomercs.com/...ommand-console/

#326 Funkadelic Mayhem

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 11:31 AM

<--- Still waiting 4 the Flea!

#327 pwnface

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 11:32 AM

View PostFunkadelic Mayhem, on 08 December 2014 - 11:31 AM, said:

<--- Still waiting 4 the Flea!


Are you going to complain about getting one shotted again when you get it?

#328 SgtMagor

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 01:24 PM

waiting patiently for the MOW preview.

#329 Keira RAVEN McKenna

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 01:39 PM

soooo like have a backseat officer to deal with the greater battle while the mech pilot drives the mech?

#330 Greenjulius

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 02:00 PM

View Postpwnface, on 08 December 2014 - 11:32 AM, said:


Are you going to complain about getting one shotted again when you get it?

Flea DOA :blush:

Edited by Greenjulius, 08 December 2014 - 02:02 PM.


#331 Moonlander

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 02:10 PM

Where's the Gargoyle?! RIOT!

#332 kosmos1214

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 02:30 PM

View PostBrody319, on 07 December 2014 - 08:52 PM, said:


purchase the highest tier package of any of the ones they released. Gold founder, Overlord phoenix, Missarki collection, Man-o-war collection or the highest resistance package.

thanks guys now i might go spend 80$ but now i know how to get it thanks

#333 Uklistan

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 03:06 PM

What is funny in this is - even Sean was having Hit Reg issues, other then that.....clanners will be dying by the billions HAHAHAHA!!!!!

#334 Noesis

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 03:48 PM

Posted Image



#335 Butane9000

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 05:22 PM

We need a Clamps skin:

Posted Image

#336 Christof Romulus

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 05:40 PM

First off:
PGI - well done! Once again you're releasing pure awesome, keep it up!

View PostAlek Ituin, on 07 December 2014 - 09:19 PM, said:


Yes, because IRL tactics don't call for targeting command structure above most everything. Which, as it happens, carries over to BT. In fact there was even a Mech designed specifically to kill commanders and their Mechs, either SLDF or Jihad era. Inferior combat chassis make inferior command vehicles, because the chassis itself is inferior. Despite you trying desperately to come up with a reason the KGC should be inferior, all evidence points to the contrary.

KGC:
Easily down an Atlas in its weaker C&C variant
Take multiple Lances and cause guaranteed casualties
Annihilate opponents in close-combat
Can compete well with the Clans in its "Clan Buster" variant

Atlas:
3 extra tons of armor
"superior" C&C abilities
Intimidation factor?
Can pick up mediums and throw them around like rag dolls

Honestly, the lore speaks for itself. The only reason the Atlas is "superior" as a C&C Mech is because lore says so, despite the KGC being superior in almost all aspects. Command Mechs should and must be capable of defending themselves (or scurrying away), which is why a large number are based on Assault Chassis, and not weak ones at that. Lore even supports this fact, just as much as it supports the Atlas somehow being better for C&C duties.

Nothing about the Atlas lends itself to being more versatile for C&C duties, at all. I implore you to come up with some plausible reason as to why the KGC is less versatile, keeping in mind that they're both 100 tons (and can easily make room for equipment).

OH, and you seem to forget that there are such a thing as "battlefield commanders", which both command forces, and fight with them. There's entire history books full of people like that, and most of the notable ones were notable because they were good at it. Not every commander hangs back and does the desk jockey routine, staring at maps and waiting for reports.


Alek,

The Atlas was a Command mech (in lore) not just because of it being 100 tons, not just because of it's use of armor, and not just because it brought a lot of weapons.

The Atlas was a Command mech because of the Sattelite Uplink targeting computer - a device that provides an an initiative bonus to the entire side of the battlefield, at cost to the mech (hits to piloting rolls, gunnery roles, and inability to spot for, or fire upon enemies using LRM indirect fire).

Being a commander involves commanding - the King Crab, even the 010, does not provide the "Act first" bonus that having a single Atlas does. The Atlas's armor and weapons prove it to be a formidable mech to attempt to 'snipe' if you were attempting to remove that said field bonus.

As for Mechwarrior Online, yes, the Atlas is being somewhat hit hard by the release of the King Crab. 10 hardpoints is nothing to sneeze at. Is the King Crab a "better" mech? Time will tell. The high-mount energy hardpoints alone give it an incredible advantage over the Atlas, and the ability to bring dual heavy ballistics gives it a potential role all its own in the Inner Sphere, especially when considering it is now like the Jager mech - able to bring an XL engine and AC 20's.

Do I think the Atlas is a worse mech in MWO than the King Crab? Honestly, very likely. It wouldn't be too bad if PGI were to give the Atlas's hardpoints a once-over, and perhaps add one hardpoint to every model to bring it in-line with more modern mechs.

Is the Atlas my favorite mech in MWO? Hands-down, yes. After all, they may have discontinued the F-14 Tomcat, but that doesn't make it not my favorite fighter plane of all time.

#337 Alex Morgaine

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 06:02 PM

I am now drooling.

#338 DarkonFullPower

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 06:15 PM

Question.

The King Crab has no lower arm or hand actuator. If it did, it couldn't use AC-20 in it's arms.

But it has an moving claw function on it's gun arms.

With no hand actuator.

...How?

EDIT: Nvm, it's an actual Lore thing.

"To protect the autocannons in combat engineers designed the King Crab with simple hand actuators."

Edited by DarkonFullPower, 08 December 2014 - 06:21 PM.


#339 Scratx

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 06:21 PM

View PostDarkonFullPower, on 08 December 2014 - 06:15 PM, said:

Question.

The King Crab has no lower arm or hand actuator. If it did, it couldn't use AC-20 in it's arms.

But it has an moving claw function on it's gun arms.

With no hand actuator.

...How?


I don't recall the Catapult having any lower or hand actuators either. HAX?

#340 DarkonFullPower

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 06:23 PM

View PostScratx, on 08 December 2014 - 06:21 PM, said:


I don't recall the Catapult having any lower or hand actuators either. HAX?


My edit ninja'ed you. :ph34r: I guess the tech to make a full hand movment is so OP it needs it's own crit slot. Expains why the Dragon's X-Claw hand doesn't have one either.

Edited by DarkonFullPower, 08 December 2014 - 06:23 PM.






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