224 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

superteds, on 17 December 2014 - 04:58 PM, said:

i didn't realise sun tzu was essential reading for playing stompy robots ;_;

Then you assumed wrong.

[Kmieciu]

Kumbaya my Lords :-)

Edited by Kmieciu, 18 December 2014 - 05:16 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Latorque, on 18 December 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

Based on my experiences; i have serious trouble believing this. Even the the most unrepentant evil normally has a completely believable explanation for itself that justifies its action, and this idea of being horrible so others may work themselves up to your skill level through bad example just to get back at you is just twisted; in addition to manipulative and unlikely to work; at least in the way it's intended.

Bad groups leaving or using the same mechanics? That's basically ****ting the nest. My idea of fun is very different from theirs. Of course playing to win is more fun - if you don't take a game seriously to a certain extent; playing is indeed wasted time. If you take it too seriously; you can rather quick open a nasty can of worms. Add to this the anonymity of this environment; and you only justify the worst kind of action taken against you (in this regard, the "wolves burning out the clock" - thread is a quite interesting read, it's not even just combat mechanics in use after such a short amount of time since CW is even implemented).

Getting my ass handed to me by a superior player? I've never got a problem with this. Him being a smug ******* afterwards? It may be only me; but again based on former experiences; this empties the playing field faster than you can say "Maybe we shouldn't have engaged in pseudomachiavellistic schemes to enforce our way of playing and our idea of fun."

One group of players won't be able to do this; but if this behaviour spreads as intended... oh yes. CW will be for the hardcore crowd; but i fear it may be a "crowd" you can count with the use of of your fingers and toes.

I'm not saying the insults or right. I'm also not saying everybody should use the same 'Mechs; even the Lords aren't all necessarily using the "meta" right now because they don't generally have to in order to win. But you should know that not all of the members in Lords behave terribly, and you should know that the insults are very superfluous because they tend to be pretty chill when not engaged in a team fight. If they say they want a challenge, you should accept that as true instead of trying to read their minds across the internet because your ability to interpret tone through the tubes is unreliable at best.

I also just came from that thread. I think burning out the clock or refusing to allow the enemy to engage you at full strength is a valid tactic. Refusing to open the games and picking the enemy off as he mills around inside the base is clever. You think CW is about winning your own match? No. CW has a much broader picture than that. CW is also about gaming the system so your own faction gets more wins. As such, burning the clock is a legitimate strategy for expanding your borders. People can cry about it being abusive or exploitative all they want, but being abusive and exploitative is at the core of finding the "meta" in any game so in my eyes it's fighting fire with fire.

Next, getting insulted or upset is a choice for most people. Unless you have a mental handicap which disallows you the ability to apply logic and can your emotional response, you have the ability to just flat out ignore and otherwise let their trash-talk pass through you. I see tons of things on this forum I feel I should reply to, but I don't. Why? Because ultimately it is trivial and it's not worth getting bunched up over. Anybody feeling disrespected by Lords should just roll their eyes, write it off as silly game egos, and keep playing without a second thought to it. If more people did that, then Lords's verbiage would be utterly wasted and people wouldn't leave the game over it.

Finally, nobody has to fight the Lords if they don't want to. Everybody knows which planets CJF can attack, and everybody can just ignore them. There are more than enough planets for that to work for pretty much the entire life-span of MW:O.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 18 December 2014 - 05:17 AM.

[Latorque]

Yeonne Greene, on 18 December 2014 - 05:17 AM, said:

I'm not saying the insults or right. I'm also not saying everybody should use the same 'Mechs; even the Lords aren't all necessarily using the "meta" right now because they don't generally have to in order to win. But you should know that not all of the members in Lords behave terribly, and you should know that the insults are very superfluous because they tend to be pretty chill when not engaged in a team fight. If they say they want a challenge, you should accept that as true instead of trying to read their minds across the internet because your ability to interpret tone through the tubes is unreliable at best.

The behaviour one assumes when embedded into a group actually says quite a lot about the individual. And one should take the "challenge" - statement at face value without regard for the insults? Hm. No. One could actually rather see it as a further insult; though i'm not inclined to do so.

Yeonne Greene, on 18 December 2014 - 05:17 AM, said:

I also just came from that thread. I think burning out the clock or refusing to allow the enemy to engage you at full strength is a valid tactic. Refusing to open the games and picking the enemy off as he mills around inside the base is clever. You think CW is about winning your own match? No. CW has a much broader picture than that. CW is also about gaming the system so your own faction gets more wins. As such, burning the clock is a legitimate strategy for expanding your borders. People can cry about it being abusive or exploitative all they want, but being abusive and exploitative is at the core of finding the "meta" in any game so in my eyes it's fighting fire with fire.

Valid indeed; but this is not about burning Moscow to the ground while retreating to let Napoleons army starve in the winter, unless this being simulated is considered fun. Gaming the system leads back to the question as how hardcore the whole setup should be. And i kind of fail to see the broader picture when the game boils down to mechs fighting it out (now with larger superstructure) in a match system. The complaints of the JFs in the thread regarding this tactic are vocal btw., so yeah... they got a strategical challenge. Not quite in the tactical way they expected it seems. Of course this nature of system abuse will always be present; but enforcing it is a good idea?

Yeonne Greene, on 18 December 2014 - 05:17 AM, said:

Next, getting insulted or upset is a choice for most people. Unless you have a mental handicap which disallows you the ability to apply logic and can your emotional response, you have the ability to just flat out ignore and otherwise let their trash-talk pass through you. I see tons of things on this forum I feel I should reply to, but I don't. Why? Because ultimately it is trivial and it's not worth getting bunched up over. Anybody feeling disrespected by Lords should just roll their eyes, write it off as silly game egos, and keep playing without a second thought to it. If more people did that, then Lords's verbiage would be utterly wasted and people wouldn't leave the game over it.

I didn't even encounter them so far, only in solo drops. But how often or for how long is one willing to roll his eyes in something one should consider fun; especially after being stomped time and time again? Flying into a fit of rage after being insulted on the internet is quite another matter.

Yeonne Greene, on 18 December 2014 - 05:17 AM, said:

Finally, nobody has to fight the Lords if they don't want to. Everybody knows which planets CJF can attack, and everybody can just ignore them. There are more than enough planets for that to work for pretty much the entire life-span of MW:O.

Depends on the faction. I basically barely give a damn about those; but good for me i guess. For someone who is more in love with the lore than me; this might look different. Interestingly enough, my only drops were against CW so far (we lost a defense. Quite embarrassing , but it was a fun fight). Now idea how this was possible since the FS don't even share a border with them; but as long as there are matches...

[Rush Maguin]

Lord being a skilled group, I can live with. No prob.

Lord being jerks, well, don't know how to counter that.

Lord assuming they can tailor the game's following according to their personal ideas = garbage. That's simply bullying, full stop. They should not influence who plays, how or when according to their advantage. If they want players to improve, there are *FAR* better ways to see that come to pass beyond treating people horribly. That's simple minded thinking in it's prime and I would prefer to think of Lord as not so simple minded. What's given is an excuse to legitimize bullying. Let's not pretend they're encouraging or inspiring anyone with that kind of talk. Let's not pretend it's some brilliant psychological ruse to build up people they judge to be bad players. It's childish and self-entitled. Full stop. If they genuinely want to improve the community, they can try being leaders. Not so much the barking drill sergeant everyone hates and automatically ignores.

This is basically "Gatekeeping." "You pass only if *I* say you pass, only if *I* think you should." Not cool, not courteous, and above all, not their right.

[Bishop Steiner]

WhoopieMonster, on 18 December 2014 - 03:34 AM, said:

I have fought along side a LORD lance a few times in CW, and whilst very good at stompy robots they were a bunch of caps lock using jerks that made the game unfun for the rest of us despite the win.

Being told to constantly move to a location only to see the lord lance **** off somewhere else with no explanation leads to confusion amongst pugs. I know they knew what they were doing but only telling people half the plan and then caps lock RAGE and insults when people appear confused and dare to question the self appointent overlords is not a fun experiance.

"GO B4"

"Alright, omw"

"Where are you going?"

"I SAID GO F**CKING B4"

fun times...

part of what they are doing is using the pugs as meatshields and diversions, lol.

[Haji1096]

I used to get angry at getting "ggclose"ed.

Now its just amusing.

Everyone has the right to play the game the way they want. I don't see a difference between dealing with a solo player's antics or a group, its just internetz.

[CDLord HHGD]

Keep taking screenshot and keep sending them to PGI.

support@mwomercs.com

If PGI sees a problem, they will address.

[Djinnhammer]

Father Dougal, on 17 December 2014 - 06:44 PM, said:

We've played against them before, yes they are good but they are not good sports about it. We take great pleasure when we do beat them. They are human and they can be beaten.

Aye, they are staggeringly poor sports with a shockingly bad attitude. Individually.....not superhuman at all. As a team, very strong with ruthless tactics. They will do whatever they have to to win, no matter sportsmanship. They get results.

You can bash them for their conduct,
You can bash them for ruthlessness,
You can't argue with the results they get.


If people are bothered by them that much though, you all should simply switch to Steiner contracts and chain queue on them. Ghost drop them off the map. They need to sleep and eat-just like we do. so until people get co-ordinated, it's pointless whining about them.
If you want them beat, you have to be every bit as ruthless as they are. To beat your enemy, become him.

[Bishop Steiner]

Song Weyland, on 18 December 2014 - 07:15 AM, said:

Aye, they are staggeringly poor sports with a shockingly bad attitude. Individually.....not superhuman at all. As a team, very strong with ruthless tactics. They will do whatever they have to to win, no matter sportsmanship. They get results.

You can bash them for their conduct,
You can bash them for ruthlessness,
You can't argue with the results they get.


If people are bothered by them that much though, you all should simply switch to Steiner contracts and chain queue on them. Ghost drop them off the map. They need to sleep and eat-just like we do. so until people get co-ordinated, it's pointless whining about them.
If you want them beat, you have to be every bit as ruthless as they are. To beat your enemy, become him.

exactly what I said to do. LORDs say they aren't impressed with CW; blah blah blah, just want to plant their flag on planets and wave epeen.

So instead of worrying about playing them, simply coordinate a coalition, and take their name off the planets. They play for bragging rights, largely, so take away the recognition they crave.

They live to game the mechanics to the razors edge, and do it better than anyone. So if you can't beat them at their game, tactically, do it strategically, and game the Planetary Ownership side of the equation. Because if you don't, it's only a matter of time before LORDS; SJR, etc, make their own coalition and do it to the rest of you.

Or do nothing, and whine. In which case, just shut up.

[King Arthur IV]

their territory is shrinking by the day. they arnt getting to terra any time soon.
there is more then one way to beat them

i like to think the people of this community are able to put aside their differences and join large groups to defeat a common enemy.

they may be individually skilled but hey.... they cant make friends. CW working as intended

[Bishop Steiner]

King Arthur IV, on 18 December 2014 - 07:35 AM, said:

their territory is shrinking by the day. they arnt getting to terra any time soon.
there is more then one way to beat them

i like to think the people of this community are able to put aside their differences and join large groups to defeat a common enemy.

they may be individually skilled but hey.... they cant make friends. CW working as intended

One thing for sure....JF as a faction fits their image and attitude to a "T", lol. Good call on that.

[AlmightyAeng]

So Steel Jags, Lords and DERP are all Jade Falcon. So what?

You really wanna play this game easy mode? Go invade Davion

The rest of us will keep on defending places like Maxie's Planet like last night and push 'em back. It's more fun

Edited by Ghost Badger, 18 December 2014 - 07:46 AM.

[Dulahan]

Yeah, Lords matches are fun for how much of a ROFLstomp they usually are. Same for the 228 A teams and a few others. It's fun in a way.

[AlmightyAeng]

Dulahan, on 18 December 2014 - 07:46 AM, said:

Yeah, Lords matches are fun for how much of a ROFLstomp they usually are. Same for the 228 A teams and a few others. It's fun in a way.

Did you miss the part where JF didn't take Maxie's Planet last night? lol

Not everyone expects to be facerolled by them. They're damned good players, with good synergy. A real challenge, but not invincible.

Edited by Ghost Badger, 18 December 2014 - 07:50 AM.

[Zeece]

I'm sure the adding for 12 ERLL to all Attacker Drop ships in today's patch will help prevent this in the future

[Mcgral18]

Zeece, on 18 December 2014 - 07:57 AM, said:

I'm sure the adding for 12 ERLL to all Attacker Drop ships in today's patch will help prevent this in the future

Range is also being reduced; 675 being the optimal range of isERLLs or 740 for cERLLs. Is it currently going out past 1KM?

[Bishop Steiner]

Mcgral18, on 18 December 2014 - 08:03 AM, said:

Range is also being reduced; 675 being the optimal range of isERLLs or 740 for cERLLs. Is it currently going out past 1KM?

Yup. SO while not as effective, they just need to spawn camp with their C-ERLarge about 750 out. We'll see if this really makes a difference.

[Dulahan]

Ghost Badger, on 18 December 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

Did you miss the part where JF didn't take Maxie's Planet last night? lol

Not everyone expects to be facerolled by them. They're damned good players, with good synergy. A real challenge, but not invincible.

Oh, certainly. I'm just saying *I* am not good enough to compete with them. But I won't complain when they drop against me. It's like... now I know how a Planetary Militia must feel when one of the Elite of the Elite units invades.

And playing against the good teams does improve my skills. Though some of my drops against Lords and similarly good teams have been so quick I wasn't even sure what happened, like "wow, I'm dead... huh."

[Bishop Steiner]

Dulahan, on 18 December 2014 - 08:14 AM, said:

Oh, certainly. I'm just saying *I* am not good enough to compete with them. But I won't complain when they drop against me. It's like... now I know how a Planetary Militia must feel when one of the Elite of the Elite units invades.

And playing against the good teams does improve my skills. Though some of my drops against Lords and similarly good teams have been so quick I wasn't even sure what happened, like "wow, I'm dead... huh."

Yeah, 2 minute facerolls don't actually improve your skill, just for the record. And even improving your skill? Doesn't matter unless your other 11 drop mates are equally improved, and disciplined.

I could, in theory, be better, individually, than any LORD in the game (I'm not, for the record, in case there was any confusion ), and it quite simply won't matter when it's 11-12 of them vs me. Because no one player makes that much impact, in that scenario, including the LORDs individual skills. In fact, in honesty, their large group tactics, don't even really show their individual skills and twitch reflexes off at their best, as it's the steamroller effect of the unit, maxing out every variable, that crushes you , in a heartbeat, unless you are on a similarly skilled team (of which there are what...2-3, tops?) using similar tactics.

Facing off against Krivvan, Adiuvo, etc in smaller settings, casual queue, 1v1, though, can indeed be good training.

So, unless you have a bunch of really really top tier twitch friends, with a lot of time to burn, who want to practice a ton, exploiting the Meta to the max, Large Group on Large Group, you will never "get gud" enough to matter, in that scenario.

When dropping against them solo, or lance v lance, they are still that good, but can no longer control all the variables (unless your team lets them) and are indeed beatable.

That said, I would rather see Krivvan or such on my side in that scenario. Because even if they were not "that" good, they would still be disciplined and reliable. Which sure beats the usual draw in the PUG lotto.