236 replies to this topic

[Cyborne Elemental]

I still use MG's on alot of my mechs, always at least 2 or whats the point.

They're pretty terrible, they don't knockout weapons very fast, and the facetime is... bad.

Even on the Arrow.. 6 mg's? just barely enough to make a dent most of the time.

But its still damage that isn't costing me heat, and it still makes people panic when they've got an open component, so its got that going for it.

[Gattsus]

Techorse, on 24 December 2014 - 02:06 PM, said:

Here's my proposal based on this thread:

- Return the Machine Gun to 1 DPS
- Buff the Flamer to 1 DPS, effectively make it an energy machine gun
- Reduce AC/2 heat to .6 per round, and return the firing rate to .52
- Remove Ghost Heat from the AC/2
- Increase damage done by LB-X autocannons to internal structure to 1.25 per pellet. (Not as relevant to the thread, but I hear the IS LB-X 10 is rather pitiful outside of the Centurion that can spam the weapon)

This

[Bloodweaver]

Vassago Rain, on 25 December 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

Light rifles can't actually damage mechs, and the tonnage to damage profile makes the AC5 and AC2 far superior weapons, anyway.

What you should be asking for are light ACs. Those are AC5s and AC2s, that cut range to use less tonnage and crits.

Heavy Rifle weighs the same as an AC/5 and does almost twice as much damage(9). It's almost as if TT's Autocannon are supposed to be better at damage over time whereas the Rifles are supposed to be single-shot... *gasp*

Where it suffers is in heat and ammo weight. Light Rifles (for light 'mechs) sound like a great option, honestly - 3 tons, 1 slot, 3 damage, short range, and just enough ammo per ton to make it an option as opposed to a "must."

Edited by Bloodweaver, 01 March 2015 - 11:48 AM.

[Bloodweaver]

Mister D, on 01 March 2015 - 11:06 AM, said:

I still use MG's on alot of my mechs, always at least 2 or whats the point.

They're pretty terrible, they don't knockout weapons very fast, and the facetime is... bad.

Even on the Arrow.. 6 mg's? just barely enough to make a dent most of the time.

But its still damage that isn't costing me heat, and it still makes people panic when they've got an open component, so its got that going for it.

I've found 2 machine guns is still utterly meaningless, at least since their recent downgrade. Before, two was just barely OK. Now, not even that. With three, you start seeing some real effects, especially with proper builds (3MG and 2LPL on a Dragon, all arm-mounted, is pretty good, for example). With four of them you get a real, tangible, viable weapon system, although it still needs to work in concert with the rest of your loadout. Six of them is perfectly fine(but should be closer to OP, really, considering you're sacrificing so many potential ACs).

[stjobe]

I've done my fighting to get the machine gun viable (back when it was 0.4 DPS with no extra crit chance), so I'll just show my support to the OP and this thread by posting this video of Saxon doing (a part of) their song Machine gun:

[Naduk]

I agree unnerf the mgs they were in such a good place
Then we just need the rework to flamers paul is working on

[Greenjulius]

I took all the MGs off my arrow and put a 3rd LPL on. MGs are terrible even for the weight, even if they are quirked.

They have almost no purpose. If someone wants to tell me MGs are great, please put together an MG mech and show me a video of their awesome power. I've so far seen no instances of it.

Edited by Greenjulius, 09 March 2015 - 09:36 AM.

[Mcgral18]

Still nerfed...

[Deathlike]

Maybe it's a good time to update the graph of the 1 DPS MG vs the .8 DPS MG and explain to people why they are insane thinking the preemptive nerf from whenever the man shall not be named who altered it was wrong on all levels to do it.

Gotta show how much facetime is required to perform the same action.

[RedDevil]

It should be 1.28 DPS average now instead of 2. Four MG's would be 5.12 or 2nd best DPS on the cart vs. internals, at 3 tons (1 ton ammo)

[Metus regem]

Mercules, on 24 December 2014 - 06:12 AM, said:

Machineguns also get 1k ammo per ton but only expend 1 per 10 second period. They could literally fire for 2.5+ hours before using up a ton of ammo. It would do 2,000 damage over that period of time. The current ratio of damage per ton of ammo in game is 160. You are supposed to buy a ton of MG ammo and feed 4 MGs off of it or 1/2 a ton for two.

*starts to have flash-backs to TT matches, where they lost fresh WHM-6R's to through armour crits hittting the 200 rounds of MG ammo, causing 400 damage to the Warhammer...*

[Alek Ituin]

Metus regem, on 09 March 2015 - 09:23 AM, said:

*starts to have flash-backs to TT matches, where they lost fresh WHM-6R's to through armour crits hittting the 200 rounds of MG ammo, causing 400 damage to the Warhammer...*

Now THAT would be something to see...

[DarthHias]

Machine Gun Arrays would really be nice, but unfortunately not until 3068...

http://www.sarna.net...chine_Gun_Array

[Mcgral18]

reddevil, on 09 March 2015 - 09:10 AM, said:

It should be 1.28 DPS average now instead of 2. Four MG's would be 5.12 or 2nd best DPS on the cart vs. internals, at 3 tons (1 ton ammo)

Correct me if I'm wrong....but don't they presently have an average DPS of 1.21, assuming over 100 rounds you get each corresponding crit.

(48*0.08)+(4*0.324)+(17*0.216)+(31*0.108) which should give you that number.


Of course, that's with a CoF and horribly short range.

[Metus regem]

Alek Ituin, on 09 March 2015 - 09:28 AM, said:

Now THAT would be something to see...

No it wasn't... it made me very, very sad, to lose a fresh WHM-6R to a Locust 1V, due to a lucky hit.

[Greenjulius]

I'm not sure how they work out statistically; I just know that they suck and aren't worth carrying unless you've already filled your other hardpoints. The claims of decimated opponents due to MGs are so overstated that I find it hilarious. People don't realize that they do the vast majority of their damage using other weapons, and have anecdotes about "MGs making a big difference."

If MGs made a big difference in a fight for you, you might be facing some really bad opponents.

[Hidirian]

I've been saying since way back in beta that MGs need to do .20 dmg per round or 2 Dps(10 rounds a second) I even suggested that they lower the ammo back to 1000 per ton, but nope . I never understood this "crit" mechanic that they added to the MGs to make up for it not doing what it's supposed to, it doesn't make any sense. So I gave up, because they will never fix it to how it should be.

[Jetfire]

2 DPS MG's would be interesting to try. That would make the Arrow output 12 DPS in MG's under 90 meters. Compared to say 10 DPS at 270 meters with a dual AC 20 Jager. Now that is without heat... but it still might work. Compared to the small pulse firestarter it probably is not overkill.

[RedDevil]

Yeah, I think my math is totally off. I was going by the old crit chances, and I understand they've changed since the original graphs were made.

[Zuri Prime]

Mercules, on 24 December 2014 - 03:47 AM, said:

That would be the Machine Gun. Technically it should be doing 2 damage per shot like an AC/2. If they just gave it the same DPS as the AC/2 with a lower damage and faster rate of fire that would be okay too.

The MG was horrible in TT, a literal deathtrap because you could never shoot off your ammo in time before having your ammo explode. Get that weak sauce out of here.