1123 replies to this topic

[Greenjulius]

I changed my mind about this build. Kill it, kill it with fire. It's encouraging too many to sit back at the end of the map and snipe.

I forgot how much I enjoyed PPCs being nerfed to hell.

Edited by Greenjulius, 02 January 2015 - 01:51 PM.

[Serpieri]

So the quriks which was basically another band aid fix is causing problems -- the simple solution would be to wait for PGI to add another band aid..it's not like they are going to fix the core of the problem..

[EvilCow]

At the end it will be the statistics from PGI that will determine changes so why bother? all this arguing is ridiculous.

[Greenjulius]

EvilCow, on 02 January 2015 - 01:52 PM, said:

At the end it will be the statistics from PGI that will determine changes so why bother? all this arguing is ridiculous.

It'll show even bad players even do well with this damn mech now. Players gravitate to the easiest option. Thunderbolts appear to be that pillow.

[mogs01gt]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 January 2015 - 01:50 PM, said:

this is also true.
I guess 3 stupidly broken mech ideas is better than 2?
Me? I favor 0.

Of course, I hate any game mode or mech that is "OP" at range.

In lore, it was ******* HARD to hit mechs, unless its an Assault! In MWO, its too damn easy.

Edited by mogs01gt, 02 January 2015 - 01:55 PM.

[Mawai]

LordKnightFandragon, on 02 January 2015 - 06:00 AM, said:

The ERPPC should be slow to fire, hot to use and deadly when it hits.

15/15, 5s CD, no heat quirks, and a max fired at a time of 1.

Gauss rifles do 15 damage
AC20s do 20 damage
AC10s do 10 damage little heat
Clan ERPPCs do 15 damage

IS ERPPC and PPCs do 10 damage for 15 and 10 heat respectively.

If you want idiotic limits like this on an ERPPC ... you should start with the more damaging weapons listed above ...


By the way, the complaints seem to be mostly about the 9s and not the ERPPC in general.

The 9S is actually a decent mech with 2xERPPC and some supporting weapons (I have used 3 MPL). It isn't as good as many clan mechs (TBR, SCR) but it can hold its own. The ERPPC gives it the range that is needed in CW given the maps which is why you are seeing so many ... especially on the attack.

Ghost heat on the ERPPC penalizes any 3xERPPC combinations. They overheat typically by the third shot. 2xERPPC will also overheat but it takes long enough that folks don't usually get the opportunity to fire that many consecutive shots.

PGI will decide if it needs a nerf but if it does I think it would be a small one ... something like 20% heat reduction for energy and 20% heat reduction for ERPPC instead of 25% and 25% as it is currently. This will likely overheat the 3 ERPPC builds on the second volley while making it significantly more difficult to manage the heat from the 2xERPPC builds ... but we shall see ... PGI has the numbers and can hopefully make a decent decision.

Edited by Mawai, 02 January 2015 - 02:03 PM.

[AlmightyAeng]

EvilCow, on 02 January 2015 - 01:52 PM, said:

At the end it will be the statistics from PGI that will determine changes so why bother? all this arguing is ridiculous.

PGI...basing balance....on statistics...and not whining...LOL.

How long have you been here? I could have sworn you'd been around a while.

[Bishop Steiner]

EvilCow, on 02 January 2015 - 01:52 PM, said:

At the end it will be the statistics from PGI that will determine changes so why bother? all this arguing is ridiculous.

Not really. They won't make changes usually that go against their telemetry, BUT, oftentime things that get some extra mustard can and do get looked at quicker.

[EvilCow]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 January 2015 - 01:55 PM, said:

Not really. They won't make changes usually that go against their telemetry, BUT, oftentime things that get some extra mustard can and do get looked at quicker.

Clan fanbois asking to nerf the 9S and IS cheerleaders whining about the sacred trio are not going to impress them much IMHO.

Sufficient whiling will make them overnerf ALL of them, they are not famous for careful changes, be careful about what you wish...

Edited by EvilCow, 02 January 2015 - 02:00 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Mawai, on 02 January 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

Gauss rifles do 15 damage
AC20s do 20 damage
AC10s do 10 damage little heat
Clan ERPPCs do 15 damage

IS ERPPC and PPCs do 10 damage for 15 and 10 heat respectively.

If you want idiotic limits like this on an ERPPC ... you should start with the more damaging weapons listed above ...

ac10s also weigh 12 tons, 7 crits and need ammo. Especially on mechs under 70 tons, those factors tend to matter. AC20, 14 and 10, along with generating 2/3 the heat of the PPC, worse GH penalties 1 second longer cooldown and oh yeah, half the range.

Also, a good number of us have called for longer cooldowns on Gauss, also, for quite some time.

WHy cherry pick only part of the picture? Not saying I agree with 5 seconds, at least in a vacuum, just saying let's present the full story.

EvilCow, on 02 January 2015 - 01:58 PM, said:

Clan fanbois asking to nerf the 9S and IS cheerleaders whining about the sacred trio are not going to impress them much IMHO.

is it really H?

[FupDup]

[LordKnightFandragon]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 January 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:

ac10s also weigh 12 tons, 7 crits and need ammo. Especially on mechs under 70 tons, those factors tend to matter. AC20, 14 and 10, along with generating 2/3 the heat of the PPC, worse GH penalties 1 second longer cooldown and oh yeah, half the range.

Also, a good number of us have called for longer cooldowns on Gauss, also, for quite some time.

WHy cherry pick only part of the picture? Not saying I agree with 5 seconds, at least in a vacuum, just saying let's present the full story.


is it really H?

I chose 5s cool down and max fire limit of 1 cuz if we ever saw a true 15d ERPPC, I can see a 4s CD and being able to deathstar them insanely OP, considering, like some have said...its an unlimited ammo Gauss Rifle. I can see the 101 ways that would be insanely OP.

So, the GR has its annoying charge time and its max charge limit of 2, along with being heavy as hell and sorta short on ammo, though good players can make 30 rounds go a long way.

So if we were ever to get a true 15dmg ERPPC it would need limits similar to the GR but in a different kind of way. That way imo is to give it a longer Cool down, and the ability to only chain fire them so as to avoid the death star and endlessly focusing 60-90dmg in a single spot. 5s CD, 1max fire limit and then even maybe 1s delay between even being able to fire them. Fire-1s pause-fire-1s pause-fire. Would slow down the fire rate on said ERPPC quite a bit. It would still be more deadly then what we have now, but would spread the damage around better, so more balanced imo....but idk...I only dream.

[Ngamok]

Bishop Steiner, on 02 January 2015 - 12:46 PM, said:

for one thing it overlooks things like RoF and Projectile Speed, two other factors of import. Also, the Hellbringer can't mount the energy as high (don't think anything but a King Crab or K2 can) to the point at range you can fire the ERPPCs on the TDR's right shoulder but literally be unable to be hit back

The Firebrand, all the Blackjacks minus the hero, and the Dragon 1C (the 1N can only mount 1E) can mount them all that high.

[LordBraxton]

The 9s is still much weaker than the holy trinity, however, to those IS players complaining...

I think the solution lies in buffing the AWS\CPT-K2 so that they are just as good as the thud.

Im all for buffs for the summoner\adder as well, but lets buff before we nerf please.

I dont think the 9S is breaking any games. Clan XLs are definetly still breaking the game so, the clams can keep their shells shut.

[Brody319]

LordBraxton, on 02 January 2015 - 02:13 PM, said:

The 9s is still much weaker than the holy trinity, however, to those IS players complaining...

I think the solution lies in buffing the AWS\CPT-K2 so that they are just as good as the thud.

Im all for buffs for the summoner\adder as well, but lets buff before we nerf please.

I dont think the 9S is breaking any games. Clan XLs are definetly still breaking the game so, the clams can keep their shells shut.

Clan XLs are not breaking the game.

[Monkey Lover]

Greenjulius, on 02 January 2015 - 01:51 PM, said:

I changed my mind about this build. Kill it, kill it with fire. It's encouraging too many to sit back at the end of the map and snipe.

I forgot how much I enjoyed PPCs being nerfed to hell.

I guess you forgot about all the dual gauss weapons that showed up the next day. If you nerc the 9s you will see gauss ppc mechs again. Nothing will change sniping mechs unless you remove long range weapons.

[LordBraxton]

Brody319, on 02 January 2015 - 02:14 PM, said:

Clan XLs are not breaking the game.

my bad

*giving one faction a serious advantage*

Game breaking is too strong of a phrase, as it implies victory is impossible for IS, which isnt true at all.

Clan XLs are the factor that makes Clans so much more powerful than IS however.

I'd sell my soul for a Clan XL in my Banshee

Edited by LordBraxton, 02 January 2015 - 02:19 PM.

[Davers]

Clan player: Timberwolves are the only good Clan Heavy so I use it all the time. Nerf Thuds!
IS Player: Thuds are the only good IS Heavy so i use it all the time. Nerf Mad Cats!

[Bishop Steiner]

Ngamok, on 02 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

The Firebrand, all the Blackjacks minus the hero, and the Dragon 1C (the 1N can only mount 1E) can mount them all that high.

can't comment on the Dragon ATM, but not technically, correct

Due to cockpit and weapons being in the arms, both of these still present a significantly larger target area than the Thud, where the arms are useless, and the cockpit very high.

K2 has this same flaw, in that the arms are high, but the cockpit sits too low to maximize that. This defilade ability is part of what made the Stalker so good at it, in the day.

Also, none of them can match it's quirks.

Davers, on 02 January 2015 - 02:18 PM, said:

Clan player: Timberwolves are the only good Clan Heavy so I use it all the time. Nerf Thuds!
IS Player: Thuds are the only good IS Heavy so i use it all the time. Nerf Mad Cats!

Jedi player...both are OP outliers, address them one way or another, and return balance to the Force.

LordBraxton, on 02 January 2015 - 02:13 PM, said:

The 9s is still much weaker than the holy trinity, however, to those IS players complaining...

I think the solution lies in buffing the AWS\CPT-K2 so that they are just as good as the thud.

Im all for buffs for the summoner\adder as well, but lets buff before we nerf please.

I dont think the 9S is breaking any games. Clan XLs are definetly still breaking the game so, the clams can keep their shells shut.

TTK is already too low, what we need is some firepower retarding, not increasing.

[Keira RAVEN McKenna]

I dont get it... the Tbolt ERPPC isnt uber powerful... if at long range and you are in a sniper dule with them, stand side on and keep moving forward and back (side to side from their point of aim) and they usually miss...