451 replies to this topic

[Vassago Rain]

>I just fought against inferior pilots in terms of skill
>ERPPCs flying from every angle in such a manner that it was IMPOSSIBLE to trade
>NEVER overheated...
>Heat scale is the only way to limit DPS in this game

[KuroNyra]

Gyrok, on 02 January 2015 - 11:43 PM, said:

This has to be the most OP mech in the game, honestly.

PGI nerfed PPC/ERPPC velocity for a reason...then they buff the hell out of it on a mech AND reduce the heat?

No thank you...this mech needs the heat reduction removed. PPCs were a HUGE problem with FULL heat before the nerf. At this point...they are becoming a HUGE problem again.

Additionally...the clans have no recourse. At least if it was on even footing, then you could argue ERPPCs are equally OP for both sides...and it would be even.

Ultimately...this needs to change. It is one thing to drop in an Awesome and tie up 80 tons, but if you can bring a 65 ton mech that does it BETTER than the 80 ton mech, why would you?

The 9S T-bolt needs to be dialed WAY back.

I kinda disagree, and you are unecessary rude on your post.
But basicly you pointed some real problem that butthurt will refuse to see:

Thunderbolt are now better PPC boats than Awesomes (!)
Even a Clan Mech like the Warhawk (who is suppose to be a PPC Boat on his prime config) can't really rivalise with the Thunderbolt.

Some people argue about the SRMS boats like the Stormcrow. I hardly see a Stormcrow sniping with SRMS. Unless I am under Nova Cat special treatement.
And I remember back in the day where it was Capults and others IS Mech who were "splatsmech".
Some argued about the torso who is "vulnerable". Guess what, Clans Mech also got vulnerables ST, but you have to get one in order to see it. Somethings butthurts won't do. When a Clan Mech lose a side torso, he pretty much lose half his firepower at minimum, that's not something you can just pass and move away.
Beside, Thunderbolts have the choice of STD Engine, since they are sniper anyway it's not the speed-is-life who apply to them. + Let's not talk about the fact it's pretty much like the Hunchback, you cover the torso who got the main weapon. Thigns Clans cannot really do.


The Thunderbolt at the moment is no more no less than IS Holy Mech like the Holy Trinity (or more like Binity since the Dire Wolf is fine itself) need tuning.
And something NEED to be done about the Thunderbolt.

What this game should have his not just one or two top tier mech for competitive scene or whatever. But multiple options of chassis all working fine. But apparently, stating the obvious especially when talking about IS make you a ******* right away. Ho no big surprise, butthurts always like to blaim the "big bad wolf" and buck it if they have there own big bad wolf. After all, THEY ARE RIGHT SO THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO HAVE THERE OWN EVEN IF IT THE EXACT SAME PROBLEM THEY ARE BLAMING THE OTHERS FOR? RIGHT? RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT?



I dare a butthurt to say I'm biased toward Clans. Make my day. I have always been for a balance between both side but what we have at the moment is ridiculous. The generals mech of the IS crush the lambdas Clans Mech thanks to the quircks.
The Holy Binity crush the generals mechs of IS but are matching by the Big Ones of the IS. But Only Clans Mech should get changed? Ppppplleeeeeaaassseee.

[STEF_]

Gyrok, on 03 January 2015 - 12:52 AM, said:

I have ZERO issues with aiming. However, when you are leading a target at range, when the point comes that you must lead so far that a change in trajectory of the target causes your otherwise successfully lead shot to miss, the weapon becomes ineffective at that range.

CERPPCs have a max effective range against lights around 500m, for quick mediums about 600m, and for assaults roughly 800m. This is due entirely to projectile speed.

***I AM FINE WITH PROJECTILE SPEED***

The issue is, with VASTLY reduced heat, it can be fired many times, and at a higher velocity in the 9S.

Additionally, who is to say the pilots you killed in the mech were competent? If you are comparing PUG drop pilots in this scenario...then you are drawing conclusions based off a very low common denominator. In a locust, you are likely using speed and SPLs to chew them up while they are trying to hit a light with PPCs up close (which is a skill only acquired after a long time playing PPCs and knowing the weapon extremely well).

Still I prefer the actual situation over the passed time. Otherwise thunders and other buffed chassis will desappear again.

With those buffing patches, situation has changed a little.

I'm enjoying the game more now, I'm seeing more viable builds, more new situations and that means more fun.
I don't think that seeing always the same mechs with always the same loadout would be a good stuff.

So we must choose solution n°2: "deal with it".

[KuroNyra]

Stefka Kerensky, on 03 January 2015 - 02:48 AM, said:

So we must choose solution n°2: "deal with it".

Than deal with it for the Timber Wolf and the StormCrow.
But peoplebutthurt want 2 weight 2 solutions.

Edited by KuroNyra, 03 January 2015 - 02:56 AM.

[John80sk]

Frankly, if you folks ran less LRM's and more ER Large and Gauss builds you wouldn't have any trouble trading with Thuds. The pinpoint might be less, but the alpha is 2-3x that of the Thunderbolt.

This is the same thing that happens with the Clans are OP stuff. People running bad builds against good builds. Min/maxed the Thud is no better than a min/maxed Hellbringer or Timberwolf.

Edited by John80sk, 03 January 2015 - 03:18 AM.

[pwnface]

4xERLL TBR and HBR are on par with TDR9S. Stop throwing lrms and medium lasers then complaining on the forums about being out sniped.

[KuroNyra]

pwnface, on 03 January 2015 - 03:21 AM, said:

4xERLL TBR and HBR are on par with TDR9S. Stop throwing lrms and medium lasers then complaining on the forums about being out sniped.

4 ER LL TBR and HBR can't shoot like a Thunderbolt do and overheat after there first attack.
Not really a good thing especially for mech suppose at the beginning to run "cooler".

Why not 8 Large laser Dire Wolf if you want to put that up huh?
Huuuuuh?
Thought so.

[WildeKarde]

You can't really say it's purely the mech alone unless you give a new player one to see if he cannot be stopped, then see how he performs in a mad cat (maybe using the twin PPC's / 4 ER ML build which seems to play the same sniping option) and see what they find better for playing.

The tbolt still overheats and shuts down, it's just when used by a decent player in the right circumstances it can be very good.
In fact lots of players sit snipe, duck behind cover, snipe, duck behind cover, etc. - this option on CW plays to the strengths of the tbolt build so makes it more effective.

Personally I think the awesome should be more effective with PPC's, background wise it's meant to be able to keep up firing two of them without overheating. Maybe the solution would be for the quirks to have a diminishing return the more weapons fired in a single shot

[Eglar]

clans op, nerf clans.

[Kensaisama]

TDR-9S overpowered eh? I guess the OP hasn't had the pleasure of a 4 Large Pulse Laser ***** from the TDR-9SE on chain fire.

[Alistair Winter]

It's not overpowered. It's just the best mech in the game. Just like the Timber Wolf. Deal with it.

- signed, Timber Wolf and Thunderbolt pilots.

[xe N on]

As an mostly IS pilot I find that wubwub and ERPPC Thundebolts need to be nerfed. They are just over the top.

Edited by xe N on, 03 January 2015 - 05:40 AM.

[ManDaisy]

That is why you are proud member of clan ghost bear is it not? Tho, I agree if anyone has pointed out, that the awesome should be the king of ppcs, not the thunderbolt.

[Shauma]

Lets see:

CER -Llaser can hit the tdr-9s
CERPPC- can hit the tdr-9s even further effective range than the maximum range of the TDR-9s
C-GAUSS- can hit the tdr-9s
C-AC2/5 LBX-2/5 can hit the tdr-9s

Besides the obvious the TDR-9S is a sniper mech, so no brawl close him and dead, and of
course hitting moving targets above 1000mts requires aiming is not just point and click, so if you are a stationary target and got cored just move and stop crying.



**: the difference between awesome and thunderbolt is maximum effective range in the awesome is 2000mts in the thunderbolt is 1600mts, so if you are very good at sniping the awesome is better choice

Edited by Shauma, 03 January 2015 - 06:11 AM.

[Roughneck45]

I do think its weird that it got PPC buffs instead of ER LL or something because reinforcing the awesome as a PPC mech would have been cool.

But really, a 3 PPC mech is OP? I don't think so. Don't trade shots at range with someone who has better aim than you do.

[KuroNyra]

Shauma, on 03 January 2015 - 06:07 AM, said:

Lets see:

CER -Llaser can hit the tdr-9s
CERPPC- can hit the tdr-9s even further effective range than the maximum range of the TDR-9s
C-GAUSS- can hit the tdr-9s
C-AC2/5 LBX-2/5 can hit the tdr-9s

Besides the obvious the TDR-9S is a sniper mech, so no brawl close him and dead, and of
course hitting moving targets above 1000mts requires aiming is not just point and click, so if you are a stationary target and got cored just move and stop crying.



**: the difference between awesome and thunderbolt is maximum effective range in the awesome is 2000mts in the thunderbolt is 1600mts, so if you are very good at sniping the awesome is better choice

And of course your forgetting all the rest. Like the Heat who make that mech ridiculous.
An Awesome is suppose to boat a PPC.
Not a thunderbolt.

Here we have a guy doing better job at boating PPC in comparaison to the guy who is SUPPOSED to boat the same gun. Heck even the Heat is better for the PPCBolt in comparaison to the Awesome.

[Widowmaker1981]

To be honest, while i used to agree the thundrbolt was stupid OP, im not so sure anymore. a bit maybe, but not hugely. I think part of the reason is that IS ERPPCs, which is what it is hugely buffed for, are contenders for being the worst weapon system in the game imo (well, barring flamers obviously)

I did some testing to compare to clan mechs and the results are a little closer that i thought (all tests on forest colony. with mastered mechs - using a stopwatch so times could be maybe 0.5s wrong):

Thunderbolt 9S, STD 290, 3x ERPPC, 16DHS, ERPPC cd5
Firing only the 2 shoulder mounted PPCs as a pair:
8 volleys in 16 seconds, overheats on the 8th - 160 pinpoint damage. Takes ~19s to cool from 100% to zero

Warhawk, 2x ERPPC, 2xLPL, 28DHS, TC1, ERPPC cd5
Firing only the PPCs:
6 Volleys in 16s, overheats on the 6th. 120 pinpoint, 30-60 splash, takes ~15s to cool from 100% to zero

Hellbringer, 2x ERPPC, 24 DHS, TC1, ERPPC cd5 (bad build, wouldnt use it in a game, just to compare equal tonnage)
5 volleys in 13s, overheats on the 5th - 100 pinpoint, 25-50 splash. takes 19s to cool down from 100% to zero

Compared to the Warhawk the Thud is doing similar damage before overheat, though more pinpoint, moving faster and more agile, 20 tons lighter. The extra weapons on both mechs nearly balance each other with a slight advantage to the warhawk there. The warhawk dissipates its heat slightly faster, but nowhere as much as youd expect from all those heatsinks (due to DHS raising the cap as well as the dissipation i think). The thunderbolt is a better mech, but there isnt a great deal in it really - but the WHK is 20 tons heavier, so in this kind of comparision its a bit silly that it would lose.

The BHR is faster andd more agile than the thud and has ECM, but its heat efficiency cannot compare.. its a bit of a silly comparison though, because thats not a good hellbringer build - Guass + 4 ERML is far better. Its more to show that with 24 DHS it takes almost exactly the same time to cool from 100% to zero as the TDR with 16 DHS

My conclusion from this really is that DHS should be made true 2.0s all the way for dissipation only (so clans actually get the benefit from having so many, which they pay for in other nerfs) and increase all armour by say 20% to compensate for slightly increased DPS.

[MerryIguana]

MerryIguana, on 28 December 2014 - 08:41 AM, said:

Powercreep got you down? Welcome to 6 months ago for the spheriods. I think you can deal with it for a couple months while it gets sorted. (we did)

From a couple days ago. Still relevant...

[STEF_]

In my previuos post I mentioned locusts, because, honestly, I really feel THEY are the really OP mechs.

Only recently I'm a light pilot, but .... my locust trio has the absolutely best "dmg per match per ton" average among my entire bay: 9,653.

Do you know what this mean?

That your own timber should do at least 724 EVERY match to be as productive as a locust.

And the dire, at least 963 every match.

It's really a pity that mwo doesn't have a dmg per ton reward

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 03 January 2015 - 07:00 AM.

[MechWarrior9376871]

This guy is one crazy SOB. Have the clans been losing planets that I am not aware of? How OP could this super mech be if it doesn't win. I haven't even seen one score over 1200 in a match. I have seen Direwolves, Atlas, Timbers and Cataphracts score over 1600 damage in a match...