178 replies to this topic

[Nutlink]

Flaming oblivion, on 20 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

I'm seeing 37 attackers 47 defenders across the entire ghostbear front this is primetime.

So I'm going to shoot for no.

But tbh the minute russ said PuGs shouldn't play CW in the townhall I snickered. Numbers went down immediately

Thing is you need pugs to make CW happen but PuGs don't want 12 mans

So the big question is

PGI do you want to make 12 mans or PuGs happy ?

I recommend you look at %s on both sides of the argument and make your minds up what you want CW to be

1) A flagship release for the masses.?

2) A niche release for the elitist minority?

Down to 13attackers 27 defenders across the entire ghost bear front.

I still firmly believe that it's entirely possible to have something that works for both pugs and groups. The main issue for me (as a pug) has always been communicating with the team, or the lack thereof. VOIP will go a long way towards resolving that (assuming that they do VOIP "right" and don't screw the pooch on it). My only other complaint would be the lack of variety since everyone is trying so damn hard to win. This comes down to a balance issue. How often do you see CW rounds without a SCR, TBR, or TDR-9S? Being the absolute best of the best comes at a cost, and when a lot of your favorite mechs are outclassed there's simply no reason to even attempt to jump in CW.

I'm just a casual/scrub/pug, so take that as you will.

[EightBitKnight]

Flaming oblivion, on 20 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

But tbh the minute russ said PuGs shouldn't play CW in the townhall I snickered. Numbers went down immediately.

So tell me how it's 'community' warfare if your excluding most of your community? Maybe I should stop spending money on a game that no longer cares about its community or seems to know what that means. I will PuG all I want and the day I can't in Community Warfare is day I stop playing. I'll also be a lot more careful of or simple avoid anything PGI is involed with in the future.

You get a much better sense of the community by PUGing and playing with differnet people (the community) not just the same group of people.

I do understand that it is a lot harder to PuG in CW you must be able to work with the group, sometimes just by knowing what to do.

What the hell is with game companies and saying stupid things not to mention and screwing over there fan base?

Edited by EightBitKnight, 21 January 2015 - 01:01 AM.

[jaxjace]

Voip combined with the new timezones and faction groups = all they need to make pugs happy.
,

[G SE7EN7]

Queue times still way to long, group or not. Next patch please!

[Sougard]

My first game of the new and improved CW took 8 minutes to find. It was a Boreal counter-attack against clans. Our team was 12 pugs, their team had an 8-man of people who had been playing since closed beta. The game ended 22:48, so we only saw two first enemy waves. 90% of clan mechs in that game were laserboat stormcrows.

Until CW has some semblance of balance and fairness I am not touching it again.

[Der Hesse]

And with the new SCR-A they can now fit even 2 more lasers and bring that thing to more than 7 sustained DPS without any modules and a manageable cooling efficiency of 40%.
But they will keep on telling it was only the fact that you had a team against your pug. Now thats not fair too, but its not the only reason some games are lost before they even start.

[Bigbacon]

funny how this changed already. weeks ago anyone one bringing up that Pugs need to be included would have been blasted to high hell...now it seem that other people finally got it and realize they are needed.

Sougard, on 21 January 2015 - 04:37 AM, said:

My first game of the new and improved CW took 8 minutes to find. It was a Boreal counter-attack against clans. Our team was 12 pugs, their team had an 8-man of people who had been playing since closed beta. The game ended 22:48, so we only saw two first enemy waves. 90% of clan mechs in that game were laserboat stormcrows.

Until CW has some semblance of balance and fairness I am not touching it again.

Nutlink, on 20 January 2015 - 11:14 PM, said:

This comes down to a balance issue. How often do you see CW rounds without a SCR, TBR, or TDR-9S? Being the absolute best of the best comes at a cost, and when a lot of your favorite mechs are outclassed there's simply no reason to even attempt to jump in CW.

I'm just a casual/scrub/pug, so take that as you will.

this would be nice, seeing more variety but...the comp groups are always going to use the best of the best and other people will follow suite because they work the best. Russ keeps talking that he'd love to try 1/1/1/1, not sure that would fix it but it would be interesting

G SE7EN7, on 21 January 2015 - 01:05 AM, said:

Queue times still way to long, group or not. Next patch please!

this still....

jaxjace, on 21 January 2015 - 01:03 AM, said:

Voip combined with the new timezones and faction groups = all they need to make pugs happy.,

this will help but the balancing issues will still make it not so much fun for those who haven't invested tons of time to get hte best mechs with the best weapons, and best modules. Again, pretty much impossible to solve but they can figure out something out but I think it will take time.

[Tumbling Dice]

Flaming oblivion, on 20 January 2015 - 08:27 PM, said:

Update now 29 people in the entire Ghostbear domain.

I warned the 12 mans what would happen when they upset to many pugs pilots who prefer to drop solo.

There, fixed it for you.

[Lily from animove]

Thorqemada, on 20 January 2015 - 05:30 PM, said:

They need the "Prestigious Planetary Invasion Elite Group Queue" for 12 mans and the "Backwater Planet Militia Fan Faire Invasion" for the Underhive.

this, the elite fights for the way to terra or is trying to protect terra, and the pug is going for some of the pointless background planets.

But this still keeps the problem of the gruoup players not having enouhg people to play with and versus, because then pugs and groups stay divided.

N0MAD, on 20 January 2015 - 11:12 PM, said:

I doubt it, people group up with friends and are comfortable with that, thats why they dont go round trying to group with strangers/other groups and since it doesnt take you being in a 12 man to be able to launch into a game for these small groups its not going to make a difference, they will keep on grouping with their group of friends.
No doubt there is a percentage that it may be useful for but in reality if these people wanted to group up in bigger groups they would of done so already, just opinion tho.

Not entirely true, some people made a unit with their friends and don't want to decide going for a single side. Then they still choose a side for CW because maybe 3 out of 10 friends want to play CW, but they are hopelessly lost as a 3 man in CW.
Some poeple have units but not enough poeple in their unit to compete properly in CW.

Those people will definately go and attach themselves to some other units, or units can now make alliances and play together. This helps a lot in my opinion.

And when on top of this the nova would be buffed from pointless in competition to somehow competitive, I would play CW all day in my Nova.

But seeing and using the same mechs over and over because they are basically a necessarity to have some kind of success (especially in CW pugs) is just making CW very boring.

Edited by Lily from animove, 21 January 2015 - 06:15 AM.

[Banditman]

jaxjace, on 21 January 2015 - 01:03 AM, said:

Voip combined with the new timezones and faction groups = all they need to make pugs happy.
,

Really? Sure doesn't seem like the facts are on your side. Seems like the solo / small group players are leaving CW in droves . . .

[Almond Brown]

Thorqemada, on 20 January 2015 - 05:30 PM, said:

They need the "Prestigious Planetary Invasion Elite Group Queue" for 12 mans and the "Backwater Planet Militia Fan Faire Invasion" for the Underhive.

That would be agreeable with one caveat. The "Backwater Planet Militia Fan Faire Invasion" queue NEVER gets to put their Badge/Tag on any Planet.

A Resistance Group aka "BPMFFI" may get a honorable mention for their efforts but they never get singled out as having ever won a Major Campaign as a group...

[Ductus Hase]

Can´t really play till tomorrow - played 2 matches yesterday, team got gathered WAY faster and more Players were active.

So yes: There is an important improvement.

[Crockdaddy]

Flaming oblivion, on 20 January 2015 - 05:17 PM, said:

I'm seeing 37 attackers 47 defenders across the entire ghostbear front this is primetime.

So I'm going to shoot for no.

But tbh the minute russ said PuGs shouldn't play CW in the townhall I snickered. Numbers went down immediately

Thing is you need pugs to make CW happen but PuGs don't want 12 mans

So the big question is

PGI do you want to make 12 mans or PuGs happy ?

I recommend you look at %s on both sides of the argument and make your minds up what you want CW to be

1) A flagship release for the masses.?

2) A niche release for the elitist minority?

Down to 13attackers 27 defenders across the entire ghost bear front.

I followed along listening until you said this

"[color=#959595]2) A niche release for the elitist minority?"[/color]

How exactly does your very slanted comment help with the discussion? All team based FPS games need PUGs to grease the wheels of game play. This isn't news exactly. However your supposed "elitist minority" would typically be referred to as "whales" in F2P speak. These are the guys and gals whom actually fund the game. Ya know buy the new packs ... premium time, get into it so to speak.

The truth is ... you need to find a happy or at least grudgingly acceptable balance between both.

I believe we have seen steps forward to help make this happen but it will take time. More mature games such as WoT had growing pains as well. Plus it seems obvious that PGI development was greatly hindered by the shady IGP hanging over it. Since IGP was shed I have pretty much seen dramatic improvements and acknowledgements of past issues.

Also if your 1 day snap shot of CW is what makes you set your value judgement of the big picture then that basically sucks. I hope you give it another chance.

[Almond Brown]

EightBitKnight, on 21 January 2015 - 12:59 AM, said:

stuff
What the hell is with game companies and saying stupid things not to mention and screwing over there fan base?

You may want to verify the validity of the accuracy of what that Poster said. Otherwise I have a Bridge for Sale, that you would love, and it's cheap too.

[Almond Brown]

Sougard, on 21 January 2015 - 04:37 AM, said:

My first game of the new and improved CW took 8 minutes to find. It was a Boreal counter-attack against clans. Our team was 12 pugs, their team had an 8-man of people who had been playing since closed beta. The game ended 22:48, so we only saw two first enemy waves. 90% of clan mechs in that game were laserboat stormcrows.

Until CW has some semblance of balance and fairness I am not touching it again.

So your solution to CW balance is to straight outlaw the use of Laser-boat StormCrows?

OK.... and after that? If you get killed by another build type you don't like. Outlaw those too?

Best we get the SSRM/SRM StreakCrows outlawed right now then. omw

Edited by Almond Brown, 21 January 2015 - 09:13 AM.

[Summon3r]

Mirkk Defwode, on 20 January 2015 - 06:22 PM, said:

If only we had a more social interface to be able to talk to people and find groups....

isnt this a novel bloody idea... honestly it is absolutely appauling that this online multiplayer game has ZERO social interface (unit interface means squat).. people been saying this for years now and no way putting in a faction/global chat would take much of PGI's precious programming time.

[DEMAX51]

Summon3r, on 21 January 2015 - 09:12 AM, said:

isnt this a novel bloody idea... honestly it is absolutely appauling that this online multiplayer game has ZERO social interface (unit interface means squat).. people been saying this for years now and no way putting in a faction/global chat would take much of PGI's precious programming time.

If you didn't watch the townhall or read the show notes you wouldn't know this, but Russ said that Global Faction chat is coming soon (they've already got it working, but they need to do some UI work before they can implement it. He sounded fairly confident it'd be in sometime in February or early March.)

[Fragnot]

EightBitKnight, on 21 January 2015 - 12:59 AM, said:

So tell me how it's 'community' warfare if your excluding most of your community?

You get a much better sense of the community by PUGing and playing with differnet people (the community) not just the same group of people.

I do understand that it is a lot harder to PuG in CW you must be able to work with the group, sometimes just by knowing what to do.

Not picking on you Eightbit, you just made some common arguements I'd like to offer another perspective on...

IMO anyone playing this game without a Unit is really missing out on a greater experience. The most important point being to find the RIGHT Unit to play with. For PuG players who feel as you do, my suggestion is to join the largest Unit you can find. That's what I did right after CW came out and I'm very glad I did.

Being in a really large Unit I think you get the best of both worlds. I do lots of PuG games everyday and can almost forget that I'm in a Unit sometimes, because being so large, you can easily be overlooked; which is sometimes what I enjoy. But when I do feel like doing team games I can always hop in TS and, because the unit is so large, there are always groups going I can join.

Because the Unit is so large I always feel like there is new people to meet. Because the Unit is so large I always have a team to join when I want. Because the Unit is so large I can go unnoticed if I feel like it. Because the Unit is so large I don't have an obligations except for ones I make for myself. Because the Unit is so large...that's what she said : P

TL:DR Join a large Unit if you still want to hang on to a sense of that PuG lyfe.

[EightBitKnight]

Almond Brown, on 21 January 2015 - 09:08 AM, said:

You may want to verify the validity of the accuracy of what that Poster said. Otherwise I have a Bridge for Sale, that you would love, and it's cheap too.

funny I thought the same and would like to redact my statement. Russ said that PUGs looking for money should stay out of CW it's not profitable. Listened to pod cast while PUGing

[Tastian]

CrockdaddyAoD, on 21 January 2015 - 09:06 AM, said:

How exactly does your very slanted comment help with the discussion? All team based FPS games need PUGs to grease the wheels of game play. This isn't news exactly. However your supposed "elitist minority" would typically be referred to as "whales" in F2P speak. These are the guys and gals whom actually fund the game. Ya know buy the new packs ... premium time, get into it so to speak.

'Elitist Minority' does not equal 'Whales'

There are many persons who spend big money on MWO who purely play in solo queue and also play as PUGS or very small groups in CW. There are also many persons who have never spent a dime on the game that join and play 12 mans in CW. The public queue and CW queue are not differentiated by freeloaders and whales.

That being said, solo players should be able to play in CW against other solo players. Until there is a separate queue for solo and group players, CW will continue to be a ghost town.