178 replies to this topic

[LordKnightFandragon]

Daynar, on 21 January 2015 - 11:29 PM, said:

Russ has said such game modes are in the works.

Say it with me folks:

"We have had CW for a MONTH."

Let them build content for it. Now that PGI owns the rights they have been busting butt to get things built.

Last Town Hall: 1 new CW map a Month starting Feb.

Resistance Mechs start dropping next month (Hello Enforcer)

New Game Mode for Counter-Attack

Varible drop deck tonnage and also 4 vs 4 and 8 vs 8 missions as well.

This is just the START of CW guys.

So just chill and give it at least until they get us to at least 5 maps and the new game mode.

I read reviews when all there was was like 3 maps and Assault and Conquest when the game got going. The reviews loved the graphics and thought the game play was too repetitive.

PGI is not like Ubisoft with facilities in twenty countries and the manpower to grind out games.

It is going to take time. And they kept their word that before X-mas we would get the CW BETA.

Beta as in things will change, and change rapidly.

I will give PGI credit, they have living up to their "game developer" title alot more since pitching IGP. I saw more development in the last bit after they dropped IGP then all the time before it. I only came back at the Clan release, and was surprised that after all that time the game was largely unchanged. But they really picked up the pace.

[Karl Marlow]

They really do need to look at the C-bill rewards a bit more. They need to have CW matches make at least as mutch as the normal queues. Until then their faction balancing technique of offering better C-bill rewards isn't going to work since you still would make more money dropping outside of CW even if you are part of the highest paying faction.

[Thorn Hallis]

Seriously, what is this with todays gamers? I just need to look at the map layout of both PI maps and know that this can only work with coordination and communication, even without a developer telling me. So if I join a match as a solo player I know exactly that chances are high that I might get rolled by a group. And when it happens, it is totally my fault because I refused to group up, I refused to join a TS server, I dropped solo. So I have noone to blame but myself, and no reason to complain about the "unfair" advantage that teams have.

[DaynarFaol]

Well CW's economy is in Beta.

I would love to see mission bonuses.

Like say a Bonus for Omega being at 100% (no damage) at the end of a match.

Or a bonus for attackers taking out 75% of the Defenders.

Right now contracts are pretty flat rate. I will say that as an avg. player I make about 300,000 to 500,000 (p-time) on the defense and around 150,000 to 200,000 on the attack.

A good well fought defense gets me about the same amount of cash as two to three PUG fights for my skill level. So while it is comparable if you engage the enemy the current tactic of Zerg Rushing means you make the min amount. And yes the idea should be to hit the objective, but if you use tactics that cause little to no damage to the other side then you get the consequences of such.

Want the easy way to have CW make about the same amount for 2 PUG matches?

STOP ZERG RUSHING.

Had one of my best fights the Friday night went up against unit tag DERP and friends. Took the full 30 mins with us on the Defense. We ended up running out the clock on Sulfur. We had 5 effective (if you can call mechs held together by hopes, prayers and lots of duct tape effective)

They had 9 fresh in bound.

Very hard fought, very fun, ZERO ZERG.

Yes it was an IS vs Clanner fight. And it was a blast.

Good sportsmanship all around. And good tactical fight.

Honestly wish every fight was like that.

I think a lot of people got turned off when it became

Zerg, Zerg, Zerg some more on the attack and defenders have a hard time stopping it.

Sure it is a valid tactic, but it short changes you on C-Bills.

Change your tactics.

Zerging should be the Hail Mary, all or nothing, last ditch, kill the gun tactic.

You should want to test yourself against your enemy. Work for your objective and have fun doing it.

And I am already planning new builds when the Resistance mechs drop. I think the Enforcer, Grasshopper and Zeus are going to be able to break the Zerg. Not sure yet, but I have a few ideas.

[Flaming oblivion]

Still ABSOLUTELY NO ONE in ghost bear space.

I wish the premades had listened I may have been abit harsh but they seriously killed CW for the pugs.

With the 2 maps and other issues with CW 12 mans really were the death of CW for pugs. Sigh

Cw's died already

[Lucky Noob]

CW is build for large Groups.

Pugs dont want Fight large Groups

Pugs are 84 % of Player Base.

So dont wine that you have no Enemies.

Be happy that you have your CW, special designed for you.

Have fun playing against each other.

[oldradagast]

Braddack, on 22 January 2015 - 02:49 AM, said:

CW is build for large Groups.

Pugs dont want Fight large Groups

Pugs are 84 % of Player Base.

So dont wine that you have no Enemies.

Be happy that you have your CW, special designed for you.

Have fun playing against each other.

Exactly.

The tryhards did everything they could to scare away PUG's and casual gamers. From insulting everyone in matches - and then posting about how "stupid" PUG's and casuals are on the forum - to screaming like children when anyone proposed any ideas (optional matchmaker, etc.) that would have given newer and casual players a place in CW other than cannon-fodder for their massive egos. Stomping PUG's was "a needed part" of CW and apparently an example of the "higher level of skill" needed to play in that game mode... because having free wins handed to your big team on a regular basis is "skill." Right...

When the problems were pointed out, they just shrieked about how everyone should "join a group" and "get on coms" - because we're to believe that the natural human reaction to a long, dull game-mode with huge amounts of lop-sided games and terrible sportsmanship is to want to invest MORE time and effort in it... not just go off and play in the Public queue or leave the game entirely... and don't kid yourself - this joke of CW has cost the game players.

So, the casuals, new players, and people who have better things to do than waste 30+ minutes on games that are decided at the pairing screen have left. I hope the try-hards have fun playing with themselves, since that's all the CW format has become anyway - a place for such people to indulge their own fantasies, while going out of their way to prevent others from having fun.

Edited by oldradagast, 22 January 2015 - 04:19 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Braddack, on 22 January 2015 - 02:49 AM, said:

CW is build for large Groups.

Pugs dont want Fight large Groups

Pugs are 84 % of Player Base.

So dont wine that you have no Enemies.

Be happy that you have your CW, special designed for you.

Have fun playing against each other.

So Solo players aren't happy with One Que being set up so they can have what they want? They want both? Or as Rad would have it 1 1/2 Ques or more?


And don't forget I PUG more than I Team play.

Also this? Why are the solo players complaining about the MM that will save CW???

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 22 January 2015 - 06:52 AM.

[Lucky Noob]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 January 2015 - 06:41 AM, said:

So Solo players aren't happy with One Que being set up so they can have what they want? They want both? Or as Rad would have it 1 1/2 Ques or more?


And don't forget I PUG more than I Team play.

Also this? Why are the solo players complaining about the MM that will save CW???

Nono, missunderstanding.

i just wanted to explain why the queues are so emty,

CW is designed for Large groups, so it was anounced, so it was done, and so it is atm. So all is okay with CW. from my Side.

[Ragnar Bashmek]

Thorn Hallis, on 22 January 2015 - 12:01 AM, said:

Seriously, what is this with todays gamers? I just need to look at the map layout of both PI maps and know that this can only work with coordination and communication, even without a developer telling me. So if I join a match as a solo player I know exactly that chances are high that I might get rolled by a group. And when it happens, it is totally my fault because I refused to group up, I refused to join a TS server, I dropped solo. So I have noone to blame but myself, and no reason to complain about the "unfair" advantage that teams have.

This comment totally misses the point of the discussion but is a fine example of the self-serving attitude that is prevalent in the competition MW community.

His solution to the problem boils down to "if you are not part of a 12 man comp team and don't want to be, you should just STFU and go away". Which unfortunately is exactly what is happening.

Previous to this CW release the comp teams went off to private matches to massage each others over blown egos and left the rest of us to enjoy the game on our own terms. Now they are taking great joy in stomping Pugs in CW and congratulating themselves on what great MW players they are.

The only way to get rid of these a__holes in CW is to do away with 12 man drops.

Four man drops would accomplish a number of worthwhile goals for CW.

It would allow small Units to field teams that could fight on equal footing with the larger Units.

It would greatly enhance the ability of Pugs to participate in a meaningful way because it is much easier for 4 Pugs to coordinate effectively than it is for 12 Pugs.

It would greatly reduce MM wait times.

It would make it more practical for the MM to play Pugs against Pugs and Teams against Teams.

A variation on this theme would be to create a separate "universe" for the 12 man teams and have a 4 man team universe for Pugs and smaller Units. This would be similar to current arrangement where competition squads play in private matches and the rest of us play the public queue.

[Joseph Mallan]

oldradagast, on 22 January 2015 - 04:17 AM, said:

Exactly.

The tryhards did everything they could to scare away PUG's and casual gamers. From insulting everyone in matches - and then posting about how "stupid" PUG's and casuals are on the forum - to screaming like children when anyone proposed any ideas (optional matchmaker, etc.) that would have given newer and casual players a place in CW other than cannon-fodder for their massive egos. Stomping PUG's was "a needed part" of CW and apparently an example of the "higher level of skill" needed to play in that game mode... because having free wins handed to your big team on a regular basis is "skill." Right...

When the problems were pointed out, they just shrieked about how everyone should "join a group" and "get on coms" - because we're to believe that the natural human reaction to a long, dull game-mode with huge amounts of lop-sided games and terrible sportsmanship is to want to invest MORE time and effort in it... not just go off and play in the Public queue or leave the game entirely... and don't kid yourself - this joke of CW has cost the game players.

So, the casuals, new players, and people who have better things to do than waste 30+ minutes on games that are decided at the pairing screen have left. I hope the try-hards have fun playing with themselves, since that's all the CW format has become anyway - a place for such people to indulge their own fantasies, while going out of their way to prevent others from having fun.

Newer and Casual players can do like I do and play in the Open Que if they don't want the tough game. I've spent just under 30 matches in the Open Que grinding a Commando, Its going pathetic cause I am not a good light Pilot. Dying 22 times with 0 kills in 29 matches.

How do you think I would fare in the CW que?

Ragnar Bashmek, on 22 January 2015 - 08:09 AM, said:

His solution to the problem boils down to "if you are not part of a 12 man comp team and don't want to be, you should just STFU and go away". Which unfortunately is exactly what is happening.

What I read was, I take responsibility for my own failures and don't need the game to cater to my wants...

He said it right here:

Quote

I dropped solo. So I have noone to blame but myself, and no reason to complain about the "unfair" advantage that teams have.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 22 January 2015 - 08:14 AM.

[BourbonFaucet]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 January 2015 - 08:13 AM, said:

What I read was, I take responsibility for my own failures and don't need the game to cater to my wants...

I take responsibility for my own failures too, Joeseph, but at some point there comes this feeling of "this is pointless because the game mode doesn't follow basic logic."

MWO's 12 mans are actually the largest competitive gaming teams I know of. Most games I can think of have teams of no more than 6.

Team Fortress 2, DOTA2, League of Legends, Counterstrike GO, Counterstrike classic. They have teams of 6 or less. The fewer players you have on a competitive team, the more each player's skill and tactical contribution to the team matters. A 12 man just dilutes it and boils it down to everyone getting to stack preplanning and better stuff.

So how come a single lance of highly coordinated players can't be the cornerstone competitive unit in MWO? How come it has to be 12, where preplanning and loadout make way more of a difference than the actual skills of the players? I understand that for a while people complained that "I can only play with 3 other friends!" but to some extent, that's ludicrous. You know that past 3 other people it's not about skill, it's about stacking preplanned advantages.

[Joseph Mallan]

Techorse, on 22 January 2015 - 10:55 AM, said:

I take responsibility for my own failures too, Joeseph, but at some point there comes this feeling of "this is pointless because the game mode doesn't follow basic logic."

MWO's 12 mans are actually the largest competitive gaming teams I know of. Most games I can think of have teams of no more than 6.

Team Fortress 2, DOTA2, League of Legends, Counterstrike GO, Counterstrike classic. They have teams of 6 or less. The fewer players you have on a competitive team, the more each player's skill and tactical contribution to the team matters. A 12 man just dilutes it and boils it down to everyone getting to stack preplanning and better stuff.

So how come a single lance of highly coordinated players can't be the cornerstone competitive unit in MWO? How come it has to be 12, where preplanning and loadout make way more of a difference than the actual skills of the players? I understand that for a while people complained that "I can only play with 3 other friends!" but to some extent, that's ludicrous. You know that past 3 other people it's not about skill, it's about stacking preplanned advantages.

The Company level (12 man) is the largest played in MOST scenarios. As 4 on 4 Matches ended super fast. I rarely ran less than Company on Company battles.
And if 4 man is the biggest in other combat games you are only working at the fire team level and missing a whole lot of what combat is like.

I was used to 12 man action in the field(one squad) and on TT. So most games are playing more by Good old RPG norms(a fighter, a Mage, a thief, a Cleric) than actual Combat from my experience.

One thing I found in the military, basic logic and combat logic are not the same. I read it here every day.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 22 January 2015 - 11:04 AM.

[Almond Brown]

EightBitKnight, on 21 January 2015 - 10:54 AM, said:

funny I thought the same and would like to redact my statement. Russ said that PUGs looking for money should stay out of CW it's not profitable. Listened to pod cast while PUGing

Ahhh the Internet Forums eh! Gotta love it.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Almond Brown, on 22 January 2015 - 11:01 AM, said:

Ahhh the Internet Forums eh! Gotta love it.

Lol, makes CW seem evne more pointless if its not a place to make $$$. Cuz besides the grind to improve your bank account, why does someone play MWO? I suppose if its to just drive stompy robots, then I could see it.

But CW should totally have objective bonus payouts.....a flat rate of 75K is hardly worth it...or 50K.....

But a nice fat check for 300K for killing hte objectives or holding them, plus the contract, plus your performance pay.....mmhmm. And besides, if the idea is to attract more players to CW, dontcha think increasing the payouts would be a good idea? Then increase the payouts in publand to still persuade people to keep going there if they dont want hard mode.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 22 January 2015 - 11:04 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

LordKnightFandragon, on 22 January 2015 - 11:02 AM, said:

Lol, makes CW seem evne more pointless if its not a place to make $$$. Cuz besides the grind to improve your bank account, why does someone play MWO? I suppose if its to just drive stompy robots, then I could see it.

But CW should totally have objective bonus payouts.....a flat rate of 75K is hardly worth it...or 50K.....

But a nice fat check for 300K for killing hte objectives or holding them, plus the contract, plus your performance pay.....mmhmm. And besides, if the idea is to attract more players to CW, dontcha think increasing the payouts would be a good idea? Then increase the payouts in publand to still persuade people to keep going there if they dont want hard mode.

Don't know about you. I came here to kick clan Ass! The pay was supposed to be a bonus.

[Almond Brown]

Tastian, on 21 January 2015 - 01:06 PM, said:

You don't think it would be easy for 3 groups of 4 to sync drop in CW? Cause it would. Form 3 groups of 4. All 3 attack the same planet.

With the addition of in game Comm's, that will likely be the "next best thing" in MWO. Until then, 3 x 4 without Comm's, is still 3 x 4 (unless they type a bit before dropping). Wait a minute, any PUG group of 12 could type a bit before dropping now right?

So sorry, a 3 x 4 with no Comm's is no good either. Just gotta be 1 x 12, with Comm's, or it just isn't viable.

Edited by Almond Brown, 22 January 2015 - 11:09 AM.

[Thorn Hallis]

Ragnar Bashmek, on 22 January 2015 - 08:09 AM, said:

This comment totally misses the point of the discussion but is a fine example of the self-serving attitude that is prevalent in the competition MW community.

How can I miss a point in a pointless discussion? And as I allready noted, I play solo.

Ragnar Bashmek, on 22 January 2015 - 08:09 AM, said:

His solution to the problem boils down to "if you are not part of a 12 man comp team and don't want to be, you should just STFU and go away". Which unfortunately is exactly what is happening.

No, it boils down to "If you want to play a mode as a solo player that is designed for team warfare, you should expect to be crushed". You can blame the "self-serving compteams" all you want, but they didn't design that game mode. The devs did and they did it with purpose.

[Revis Volek]

Tastian, on 21 January 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

'Elitist Minority' does not equal 'Whales'

There are many persons who spend big money on MWO who purely play in solo queue and also play as PUGS or very small groups in CW. There are also many persons who have never spent a dime on the game that join and play 12 mans in CW. The public queue and CW queue are not differentiated by freeloaders and whales.

That being said, solo players should be able to play in CW against other solo players. Until there is a separate queue for solo and group players, CW will continue to be a ghost town.

CW in fact WILL BE a ghost town is there IS separate queues for groups and pugs....also how does that work? Two different queues fight over the same stuff on one map?

There is not enough players to have both....which is why we are having problems now. PUGs are leaving and the groups are still here wondering where everyone is.

You really need to have an understanding of what you are talking about before you spout nonsense sir....

"ELITIST MINORITY" doesn't mean anything because it DOESNT EXIST! Its not whales or comp guys or whatever delusion you have made up in your head. We are all here, playing the same game in the same mechs for the same reward.. No one is an ELITIST other then in YOUR OWN EYES.

What makes someone the Elitist Minority? I'd love to become a part of that? Got an application i can fill out? How much money does it cost? Free? Where do i go for this? What are the perks? What do they have over me or YOU for that matter?

Get a grip on reality and relax man....its a game!

[Almond Brown]

Cathy, on 21 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

so pugs shouldn't play CW according to Russ

That's fine by me..

as long as PGi can churn out mechs that I'll get and grind,

That is very bad form for a MWO Founder Cathy. If you actually believe the BS written about such things on here without first verifying it yourself, then booo on you.

Edited by Almond Brown, 22 January 2015 - 11:42 AM.