144 replies to this topic

[BourbonFaucet]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 January 2015 - 12:27 PM, said:

that's for dang sure, too much of the visual laws are subjective. I mean the criteria is impossible to fully enforce.

Also, not really my redesign, so much as my redesign of the REeseen redesign, that I liked jsut thought had silly proportions.

Well yeah, the original reseen looked like it had scarecrow/ AT-ST legs and would snap if sneezed on, much less hit by AC shells. Nonetheless, the re-proportion you've done seems reasonable. I'm just not enough of a purist to demand the Glaug form for the Marauder, but I like the 'mechs role as a command/support platform for PPC's and light autocannon, where you can either snipe or go mid-range with the help of some brawlers to take down enemies closer in.

[Chiasson Brinker]

ClannerJake, on 27 January 2015 - 03:12 AM, said:

some decent deviant arters out der... id have it angled back more like the wing structured ones you see, but keep the hard cut lines and push the cockput glass down more and up more, and sink it in so you couldnt get glass shot spammed.. maybe it be too mara still thou.

That right there is a Draconis Combine assault omnimech called the Tenchi, and since even with the most glowingly optimistic outlook, I don't see this game still being around 95 years from now, we aren't getting it unless we take a HUGE time leap. 3145 folks.

[ClannerJake]

Aidan Kell, on 27 January 2015 - 12:35 PM, said:

That right there is a Draconis Combine assault omnimech called the Tenchi, and since even with the most glowingly optimistic outlook, I don't see this game still being around 95 years from now, we aren't getting it unless we take a HUGE time leap. 3145 folks.

i know its not. im saying, as a base, to show if you could pull a mara's profile in and back and make it look nice and not be a right rip and nothing they could do.

Edited by ClannerJake, 27 January 2015 - 02:32 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Bishop Steiner, on 27 January 2015 - 12:19 PM, said:

Multi-national courts. I believe in the USA, at least, the decision currently stands in favor of HG. Thus, while it may be possible to release the stuff elsewhere (not feeling like looking up the specifics atm) those items at the least would not be available to players in the USA. Which on a global PvP game, I would imagine is it's own set of nightmares, legally.



I'm part of the minority who would be happy if Alex just redid this. Then no talk of "replacements".

Problem is, I know I'm in the minority who like the reseen Marauder betters. (And Tbolt. And Warhammer IIC The rest? Not so much. And the reseen Warhammer needs to burn in a fire)

Yeah, PGI should give Bishop a job as the HG Mech designer. Im sure you could come up with a number of models that would look amazing and yet still get by Horridly Gay's lawyer horde.

[Brody319]

LordKnightFandragon, on 27 January 2015 - 04:14 PM, said:

Yeah, PGI should give Bishop a job as the HG Mech designer. Im sure you could come up with a number of models that would look amazing and yet still get by Horridly Gay's lawyer horde.

if we renamed it, then Yes, that would totally get by HG. Problem is, the group of people who are willing to give up the Name, and the group of people who are willing to give up the original Design, don't overlap very much.

[Metus regem]

Brody319, on 27 January 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

if we renamed it, then Yes, that would totally get by HG. Problem is, the group of people who are willing to give up the Name, and the group of people who are willing to give up the original Design, don't overlap very much.

But we do...

[LordKnightFandragon]

Brody319, on 27 January 2015 - 04:48 PM, said:

if we renamed it, then Yes, that would totally get by HG. Problem is, the group of people who are willing to give up the Name, and the group of people who are willing to give up the original Design, don't overlap very much.

I would have an easier time renaming it then I would altering its design. BUt, if we are to ever see it in game in any fashion, then lets see what Concepts PGI can come up with. Then let the community vote lol...


Couldnt PGI do something with the Stalker torso? Maybe slim it down a little, the Marauder basically has the same long wang looking center body part. Its just narrower and more triangular. I do kinda wish the Marauder got a bit more beefiness to it's self. Never did like its real thin, narrow, lanky look, the MW2 one? Take Bishops concept art, lengthen the CT, squash down the cockpit and make it look more like a big Raven cockpit then slap a big gun on top above the CT.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 27 January 2015 - 05:57 PM.

[Brody319]

LordKnightFandragon, on 27 January 2015 - 05:54 PM, said:

I would have an easier time renaming it then I would altering its design. BUt, if we are to ever see it in game in any fashion, then lets see what Concepts PGI can come up with. Then let the community vote lol...


Couldnt PGI do something with the Stalker torso? Maybe slim it down a little, the Marauder basically has the same long wang looking center body part. Its just narrower and more triangular. I do kinda wish the Marauder got a bit more beefiness to it's self. Never did like its real thin, narrow, lanky look, the MW2 one? Take Bishops concept art, lengthen the CT, squash down the cockpit and make it look more like a big Raven cockpit then slap a big gun on top above the CT.

If PGI makes a new design, they have to ask HG if if violates copy-right law. Harmony Gold can then just say "yes it does" and PGI is where it is now. We are lucky we got the Unseen we do now.

This is why I suggest using the Reseen designs (already used in other media) and just renaming it and claim its a new mech all together. then HG can't do ****.

[White Bear 84]

Mike Forst, on 27 January 2015 - 09:56 AM, said:

In my personal opinion as a Mechwarrior fan: if the mech has to look significantly different than the original and have a different name to hide it from the license holders then it's not the original mech in any way. In that case, there's really not much point in spending all this effort on these designs when there are plenty of other ones that can be brought to life without these issues (especially if the license holder gets wise and tries to make a stink about it anyways). If a deal can be struck in the future, then great. If not, it's best to leave the HG Unseen where they are: as fond memories.

Maybe we should start an online petition to get the license holder to open up the 'Marauder' design for production.. ..no one really wins from this kind of dispute and it would benefit all parties if the design was made available for MWO...

Edited by White Bear 84, 27 January 2015 - 06:20 PM.

[EgoSlayer]

Jonny Slam, on 26 January 2015 - 06:46 PM, said:

Sure go ahead and show us your citation, of course by that I mean actual proof not the constantly recycled conspiracies that pop up in community edited "pedias" and such.

Take your time.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Unseen

Complete with other legal references to companies stopped from using the images by Harmony gold.

https://web.archive....gs-back-Unseen/
http://battletech.ca...e-want-them-to/


Your turn. Show the legal ruling that Harmony gold *can't sue* over their usage. Because it's the threat and costs of fighting a suit that are the issue, not whether anyone could win. Show us the injunction against Harmony Gold that says they can't sue.

And don't take your time. Marauder and Warhammer would be like printing money for PGI so we are all waiting with baited breath...

Edited by EgoSlayer, 27 January 2015 - 10:12 PM.

[Alex Morgaine]

Bishop Steiner, on 26 January 2015 - 07:38 PM, said:

oh, YEAH.

1 Ballistic, 2 Energy per arm
1 Missile per side torso, 1 in head
2x Energy in CT

Doesn't even need hardpoint inflation.

Have a "what if/pgi custom" 3025 "-mad01" that swaps the lb 10s with ppcs, swaps the lrm 5s with a high mounted ac5, omg we just made a marauder (some tweaking necessary, but you get my idea).
Have a hammer hands varient "-whm01"?
Lancelot -rfl01...
Thorn (lol yes I said thorn) -wsp01 and -stg01... (Edit) mirror the normal arm for the right side to make these work.
5 down, next unseen? Obviously those chassis would see a LOT of variants, but that's probably a good thing for mastery issues.

Edited by Frosty Brand, 27 January 2015 - 09:14 PM.

[Alex Morgaine]

With the up coming urban, or the spider, we can have the -vlk sub variants. Well... it'd be ugly as sin either way but have the hard points... Well might need new arms on the urban for actuator/hand builds.
The 45 ton vindicator would make an ugly but viable -phx, unless we got another humanoid 45tonner.

Edited by Frosty Brand, 27 January 2015 - 09:16 PM.

[Alex Morgaine]

Jonny Slam, on 27 January 2015 - 12:50 AM, said:

The best part about knowing the facts and not having the compulsion to constantly nurse a grudge/conspiracy fetish? I don't have to or feel compelled to fetch water.

With out even uploading any docs, or directing in comments from parties that have actually been involved with the issues for the past 3 decades. Or digging up and posting a pic of Babcock's legendary white board "event/date for all unseen flow chart" from his impromptu presentation back 2010 I will happily stand.

Seriously, I will happily stand. I will confidently stand by my statements secure in the knowledge that they are the world as it is not as some desperate wannabes fear it is, using nothing more then the uses of the mechs in previous instances of the past 28 years as empirical evidence, I will wait.

And even more happily wait for the ever bleating wing-nut crowd to come up with some actual evidence for their precious conspiracies. And as always, evidence is not the pasted entries from a community edited 'pedia' or fan built site that has built it own history to fit it's "HG is screwing us all, waaaaa" world view.

There is so much to love about geek culture, sadly the constantly repeated tales of conspiracies so player can feel like they understand all the dirt (imaginary dirt at that) is one of it's less attractive aspects.

My Google-fu sucks, can you show me man? I want to know. I'm just curious at this point, cause if they can make the unseen freely, it will happen.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

CutterWolf, on 26 January 2015 - 05:34 PM, said:

How or why is the Marauder out? Yes, PGI can't bring in a copy of the artwork/model but there is nothing stopping them from creating their own version of it. The same goes for the Rifleman........

Two words, Harmony Gold. I already asked them about this on Twitter and they said HG says no

https://twitter.com/...733744493780992

proof

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 27 January 2015 - 10:04 PM.

[BourbonFaucet]

Brody319, on 27 January 2015 - 06:15 PM, said:

If PGI makes a new design, they have to ask HG if if violates copy-right law. Harmony Gold can then just say "yes it does" and PGI is where it is now. We are lucky we got the Unseen we do now.

This is why I suggest using the Reseen designs (already used in other media) and just renaming it and claim its a new mech all together. then HG can't do ****.

So basically use synonyms and such to get away with it?

Marauder -> Raider
Warhammer -> Gavel (Justicy)
Archer -> Rogue (Aren't Rogues usually archers in games?)
Wasp/Stinger -> Dagger/Shiv
Rifleman -> Sharpshooter? Sniper? (Hard one to do)

Not sure. I'd play the 'mechs since we'd know with a wink and a smile what they're really supposed to be, but here come the diehards to tell us we're heretics who must burn.

[Brody319]

Techorse, on 27 January 2015 - 11:00 PM, said:

So basically use synonyms and such to get away with it?

Marauder -> Raider
Warhammer -> Gavel (Justicy)
Archer -> Rogue (Aren't Rogues usually archers in games?)
Wasp/Stinger -> Dagger/Shiv
Rifleman -> Sharpshooter? Sniper? (Hard one to do)

Not sure. I'd play the 'mechs since we'd know with a wink and a smile what they're really supposed to be, but here come the diehards to tell us we're heretics who must burn.

exactly. plus if they wanted too, if HG suddenly grows a soul, they could add in the original designs, with the original names, and we would just have some more giant stompy machines!

[LordKnightFandragon]

Techorse, on 27 January 2015 - 11:00 PM, said:

So basically use synonyms and such to get away with it?

Marauder -> Raider
Warhammer -> Gavel (Justicy)
Archer -> Rogue (Aren't Rogues usually archers in games?)
Wasp/Stinger -> Dagger/Shiv
Rifleman -> Sharpshooter? Sniper? (Hard one to do)

Not sure. I'd play the 'mechs since we'd know with a wink and a smile what they're really supposed to be, but here come the diehards to tell us we're heretics who must burn.

call the Rifleman by some German translation of Sniper or Sharpshooter, or Rifleman.

[Brody319]

LordKnightFandragon, on 27 January 2015 - 11:05 PM, said:

call the Rifleman by some German translation of Sniper or Sharpshooter, or Rifleman.

used google translate so its probably horribly wrong but:
Sniper - Heckenschütze
Sharpshooter - Scharfschütze

[Bounty Dogg]

Techorse, on 27 January 2015 - 11:00 PM, said:

So basically use synonyms and such to get away with it?

Marauder -> Raider
Warhammer -> Gavel (Justicy)
Archer -> Rogue (Aren't Rogues usually archers in games?)
Wasp/Stinger -> Dagger/Shiv
Rifleman -> Sharpshooter? Sniper? (Hard one to do)

Not sure. I'd play the 'mechs since we'd know with a wink and a smile what they're really supposed to be, but here come the diehards to tell us we're heretics who must burn.

Remember though, HG does not have to win the lawsuit.....Simply draw it out long enough where the financial burden of continuing the defense of the lawsuit could significantly hurt PGI.

I'd love to have some version of them in the game, but a poster earlier hit the nail on the head: between trying to dodge HG and keeping our devisive community happy, the payoff would simply not be worth the work they'd have to put into it.

[NotMyIfurita]

It just makes me wonder what the price tag would be. If we are talking a $500 Marauder mastery package, I'm out. If PGI could get the OK and make a deal like Phoenix, but say $400 for 4 mechs... Marauder, Warhammer, Stinger, Phoenix Hawk.. I'd be in.