135 replies to this topic

[paxmortis]

Lord Ikka, on 04 February 2015 - 08:06 AM, said:

I think they meant "We listen too" instead of "We listen to." That makes more sense, somewhat.

It make no sense because its a google translation. What he wants to say in german is: "Die Planeten gehören uns. Wir geben Sie nicht auf!" this would be mean "The planets are ours. We will no give them back!" or google "The planets are ours. We do not give up!"

If you use my english in goolge you getting a meaningfull translation: "Die Planeten sind unsere. Wir werden sie nicht zurück zu geben!"

So they are not german native speaker and i think no good english ones. But this are only my opinion with a grade D in both languages as a native german

[Stealth Raptor]

the other big elephant in the room about attacking the clan border is the fact that they will drop 70+ in defense of our 48. this means that because there is always a clan group in queue before we launch, we are always defending a counter attack. even if we win every game, we dont gain any points, it just stays static, effectively meaning as soon as they have more numbers we can no longer take ticks (not completely true, but a good rule of thumb is against superior numbers you can get up to as many ticks as you have 12s dropping but no more then that). at that point there is no point in dropping, because while a couple of us may lose extremely rarely. others lose often enough + pug groups as well so that every loss takes a tick away. it is super frustrating. the battle for kilmarnock (which i initiated to due the circumstances of the planet at the time) we quickly ran it up to 73%. despite 2 groups in HK TS that never lost a game that night, the ticks never went up but only down because it was a never ending queue of defending their counter attacks.

the fact of the matter is until either the mechanics of CW change OR we get the numbers to match or surpass what the clans can field against us there is no point to attacking clans at this time

[Dawnstealer]

Stealth Raptor, on 05 February 2015 - 12:24 PM, said:

the other big elephant in the room about attacking the clan border is the fact that they will drop 70+ in defense of our 48. this means that because there is always a clan group in queue before we launch, we are always defending a counter attack. even if we win every game, we dont gain any points, it just stays static, effectively meaning as soon as they have more numbers we can no longer take ticks (not completely true, but a good rule of thumb is against superior numbers you can get up to as many ticks as you have 12s dropping but no more then that). at that point there is no point in dropping, because while a couple of us may lose extremely rarely. others lose often enough + pug groups as well so that every loss takes a tick away. it is super frustrating. the battle for kilmarnock (which i initiated to due the circumstances of the planet at the time) we quickly ran it up to 73%. despite 2 groups in HK TS that never lost a game that night, the ticks never went up but only down because it was a never ending queue of defending their counter attacks.

the fact of the matter is until either the mechanics of CW change OR we get the numbers to match or surpass what the clans can field against us there is no point to attacking clans at this time

We have a similar problem on the Steiner side.

[MischiefSC]

I get the importance of numbers and the value of it and I'm game with it. Attack/counter should alternate however.

Also get the mother ******* pugs off the clan border. It's a broken mechanic and it teaches the pugs to hate cw since you are forcing them to play the worst possible experience in the game.

It would be like telling people the need to run their trial matches for cadet bonus by pugging in the group queue with an 1800 Elo. Why not just punch everyone who wants to try out cw in the face - it would be a more honest approach to the experience you are encouraging them to have.

The clan border is one of the biggest issues with getting people into cw. Horrible experience for everyone involved, save clan units being fed pug hordes.

Edited by MischiefSC, 05 February 2015 - 02:11 PM.

[Lord Ikka]

Agreed Mischief.

[BaconCouch]

Not that I think it'll happen. But if the inner sphere got its gak together and just focus on the clan border, i bet we could push them back. Because of infighting, all the IS houses are fighting on too many fronts, and it just isnt working.

[Chef Kerensky]

BaconCouch, on 06 February 2015 - 07:21 AM, said:

Not that I think it'll happen. But if the inner sphere got its gak together and just focus on the clan border, i bet we could push them back. Because of infighting, all the IS houses are fighting on too many fronts, and it just isnt working.

We've been over this. It has nothing to do with infighting. They had the numbers to halt any advance and the drop coordination to press any front.

[Gorgo7]

I think that the great house of Davion should continue to attack those rebels in Steiner Hanse Davion space.
Really, where do they get off attacking Davion anyway? Stiener has always been lazy. May as well absorb them and improve the standard of life for the poor oppressed people living there. Besides it will give you a conduit to the Clans!
You really should continue to beat on Steiner...smart guys.

[Valar13]

ChefGerstmann, on 06 February 2015 - 11:15 AM, said:

We've been over this. It has nothing to do with infighting. They had the numbers to halt any advance and the drop coordination to press any front.

And yet, the tide turned pretty immediately when "we" decided it should.

Edited by Valar13, 09 February 2015 - 09:38 PM.

[hopterque]

Yeah it has nothing to do with almost all the mercs leaving the clans for the time being *eyes roll out of head*

[Chef Kerensky]

Valar13, on 09 February 2015 - 09:37 PM, said:

And yet, the tide turned pretty immediately when "we" decided it should.

Actually it turned when HK had an influx of about 3 or 4 merc units at once following their exodus from the clans.

[Valar13]

I'm not just talking about HK. Some of the merc units you've gotten didn't come from the Clans, by the way.

[Scoops Kerensky]

We don't doubt or dismiss the value of the help BWC and Seraphim have given us in our clan front lately, but we're not interested in playing political football with their services. While we're still debating the star league proposal internally, our focus over the last few days has been working closely with Marik High Command on how to address, close, and/or manipulate the wormhole as it is right now to assist in the clan front. We regret that we haven't been able to be more active to help them the past few days, but we don't forget what they've done for us.

This continuous questioning of our commitment to fighting the clans because we haven't jumped high enough day to day is what I don't get, Valar. We're open to any help you'd like to give if you want to step into our wooden sandals for a day and see how much work we're doing each night.

[MischiefSC]

Kurita has been good at going it alone and that is a lesson every single other faction can learn from. Any faction that either counts on mercs or prays for mercs to come save them is ****** in the long run. They took almost a 2 month long regular brutal beating to get to that point. That's a lot of kicks in the teeth. I have the utmost respect for a lot of Kurita units; anyone can be a 'loyalist' when they're winning.

There's going to be a lot of bitterness over Kurita being seen as abandoning their Clan border, regardless of their attacking Davion or not. Could have been Steiner or FRR, doesn't matter. Kurita had a handful of bad choices and picked the one that tasted only slightly less like sh*t than the others. However I hear a lot of 'lets be realistic' from the Kurita diplomatic folks though. Okay, let's be realistic. Kurita has decided 'f**k this, I'm going to fight someone else' more than once. That's going to get thrown in your face and you need to accept that. Yes, you had reasons for it, doesn't matter. Everyone else is trying to go all in - but it's not really going to work without Kurita being all in. Kurita is the *only* clan border house to get completely organized on their own in the face of the clans and prior to the huge merc influx, 228 et al to CSJ they were the only one pretty much holding their own or at least giving as good as they got regardless of mercs in house or not.

However Kurita has a well earned reputation of saying 'f**k all you all, we're going to go do X'. Not that people don't get why - just that you've done it before more than once. If people are going to be queuing up on Kurita worlds to take turns getting humped by the comp teams playing there right now they want regular assurances that Kurita will actually keep showing up. Nobody wants to go into a fight and suddenly realize the guy who was supposed to have his back is off chasing a squirrel for an easy kill.

Take that as a compliment though. Everyone wants Kurita to show up because it's a significant difference. Sure you're going to get bitter and butthurt over questions of your commitment; that's the price you pay for the choices you've made though. Quit being so obtuse about it. Right now you've got all the help anyone has to offer beating down your door and you're still dragging your feet on if you want it or not.

[Liam Salem]

You know, I'd have a lot more sympathy for the groups if they actually included solo players like myself. I feel ZERO sympathy for pug groups screwing up the border. And yes, I tried to get into a few groups. Posted up a thing of 'hey! add me so we can drop together.'

Got a whole lot of nothing. Hence why i broke my contract with Davion and went clan wolf. Go pugs go! Screw following the stupid storyline. It's not like PGI is capable of making mechs true to their Lore anyways. Why waste your time following it. I used a period there to indicate the question was rhetorical btw.

[Scoops Kerensky]

MischiefSC, on 10 February 2015 - 12:18 AM, said:

However Kurita has a well earned reputation of saying 'f**k all you all, we're going to go do X'. Not that people don't get why - just that you've done it before more than once. If people are going to be queuing up on Kurita worlds to take turns getting humped by the comp teams playing there right now they want regular assurances that Kurita will actually keep showing up. Nobody wants to go into a fight and suddenly realize the guy who was supposed to have his back is off chasing a squirrel for an easy kill.

Now this I'll take issue with. What exactly has Kurita gone its own way on before? There's literally been 2 months of history here. We've honored the Kapteyn accords with our friends, pushed the clans during the last big offensive when the mercs requested it despite being eaten by both ends of the fedcom simultaneously, we even trust Marik enough to let them eat our worlds to try and form a new clan front.

Kurita's been many things, but accusing us of only looking out for ourselves doesn't match up with reality.

[MischiefSC]

Not in regards to treaties but in regards to fighting the Clans. In fact early on Kurita turned completely away from Davion when Davion was rolling the Kurita border to fight CSJ, because CSJ didn't have the people. Then did the same thing in reverse later, literally while Davion was dropping in defense on Kurita worlds.

Also, most recent events matter most. Kurita ran from the CSJ border (again, already covered why and that it doesn't matter) and when everyone else else jumps into the nSL, Kurita drags their feet the longest when they, in many ways, have the most to gain. Nobody can say that the organized Kurita front could not best take advantage of a flood of organized 12mans from other factions helping defend their borders and even a raft of new merc units from other factions joining Kurita specifically to help.

Bluntly if I were a merc and taking part in nSL I'd go Kurita - best odds of having someone to legitimately coordinate with.

Read most your fellows responses too. While there are the typical platitudes of 'well, we do thank the mercs who fight for us' largely it's 'they're just mercs' and such.

You guys ran from CSJ when it was too much already. People are going to be twitchy about that when looking at rolling up to help HK. Once again, not saying your choice was a bad one or that it didn't have reasons, etc. etc. etc.

Still, it's what happened. You want realism, this is it. You guys abandoned your Clan border once already and when people lined up to help you told them 'well.... nah, we like where we are at' to be followed by 'we'll let you know if we want everyones help. Eventually.'

I get why. I also say that Kurita poking at Davion isn't going to be the end of the world and people need to get past the fact that there absolutely will be rogue units on every side poking each other during this and it needs to not be a big deal or get anyone off mission.

You're going to catch **** over the CSJ thing for a while yet. That is what it is. You can get defensive or own it and move forward, or bitterly stow it away, nurse each slight like a poisonous little weed to be cultivated and bloomed into backstabbing retribution in its own time or however you guys deal with that stuff.

Not joining the nSL though... this shouldn't even be a debate or a discussion. There will never be a better time for Kurita to shine. This is 70% of the games population saying they want to do what you guys have done best and want to come over to your house to see how it gets done. If anyone doesn't realize that, well, let them go do whatever and miss their chance at fame and glory and raging badassness. Drop your c**ks and pick up your socks gentlemen, it's marching time and you're on the drum.

[Scoops Kerensky]

The irony is we spent our drop time tonight coordinating with Marik HC, and we finish to find an unrelated marik player questioning our commitment to working with them.

[Valar13]

Basically, I don't have any or many of you as friends on enjin or in-game, so you get my WTF Mates in public, as it's the most convenient means of getting in touch.

Believe me when I say that I've never doubted your commitment, but some of you do put off a very strong air of "we don't need **** from nobody, we da best" and it's not becoming in an ally. I'm not saying all or even most of you do this, but I think you'd be lying to yourselves as much as anyone to say it's not there, and perhaps worse, it's in public for everyone to see.

I have now been in two factions that had members who believed themselves to be "MechWarriors: The Elite of the Elite" but I'm just pointing out that I've not seen it as publicized as it is here.

Text is not my preferred medium. I don't hate you guys, I promise. We can haz friends.

Edited by Valar13, 10 February 2015 - 01:58 AM.

[hopterque]

MischiefSC, on 10 February 2015 - 01:16 AM, said:

Not joining the nSL though... this shouldn't even be a debate or a discussion. There will never be a better time for Kurita to shine. This is 70% of the games population saying they want to do what you guys have done best and want to come over to your house to see how it gets done. If anyone doesn't realize that, well, let them go do whatever and miss their chance at fame and glory and raging badassness. Drop your c**ks and pick up your socks gentlemen, it's marching time and you're on the drum.

Yeah sure we should join the star league the one thing we really need is a pile of incompetent davion and steiner units throwing matches on the clan border in addition to the pugs already losing match after match. We could lose territory to the clans even more quickly than we do already, what a no brainer that is.