87 replies to this topic

[The Choppa]

hang on, hang on... people are complaining (maybe not specifically here) about IS mechs not being equal to Clan mechs?
That is the point of clans, you all know that right? If a Stormcrow can beat aThunderbolt with both pilots of equal skill level, I'd say it's working as intended.
The main drawcard of IS mechs should be their extreme flexability, to create very personalised or niche loadouts. They should, tonfor ton, not be equal in firepower, manuverability, heat management or anything else to a clan mech. Quirks are nice, but don't go to far with them please.

On topic, it seems to me that heavy mechs are held very highly by the majority of players, and not just because of the Mad Cat. Feels like they have almost equal firepower to an assault, yet not as annoyingly slow. Plus lets be honest... the awesome is fairly ugly... and at the end of the day style > substance.

[Mcgral18]

Jaeger Gonzo, on 02 February 2015 - 11:19 PM, said:

Its not just about IS vs Clans.
Its about thunderbolts throw out meks that are supposed to be ERPPP, PPC machines.
I guess no one would whine about OP Awesome if AWS get TDR quirks.

Well just wave to wait until the Badder gets the same quirks. Then the whine will really shine through.

[Ralgas]

the 9q's quirks are enough to stand on it's own, especially if you consider the 9q has and extra 15 tons for cooling/armor. Quirking it won't bring more to cw, because it still suffers it's low hardpoints and huge hitboxes

The issue (and really the only issue) that makes the 9s a total whinefest target is it's hardpoint locations and how well it fits into a drop deck. Move those 2 shoulder hardpoints down onto the torso at the same height as the LT points and watch them dwindle in numbers

Edit: ooh and i cant wait till the 9s nerfs do roll in and ppl realize there's ac spam med and gauss sniper heavy meta waiting to pick up the slack, range won't change much, but the projecties will...............

Edited by Ralgas, 03 February 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Matthew Ace, on 03 February 2015 - 03:25 AM, said:

Besides the power creep (Heavy Rocket Launcher, Plasma Cannon, Assault Laser, stuff like that. Things that greatly increased PPFLD. Did I misuse the term?), I liked Mektek's Mekpak a lot and I was sad to know that MP4 would not come to fruition.

HRL I found to be really derpy. Kinda like a single shot SRM now, velocity that rendered it border line useless. Plasma cannons and all those special weapons, I found them all to be really derpy to use. Plasma Cannons, not worth the extra heat.

Even the Capacitor PPCs, I only used them on a few mechs like a Marauder IIC, 2 in the arms....they all ran really hot.

[Telmasa]

Zfailboat, on 02 February 2015 - 11:07 PM, said:

Oh please. The thunderbolt is maybe marginally overpowered. MAYBE.

The stormcrow has stupid hit boxes, the Timberwolf has assault load outs with medium speeds (higher dmg, armour and speed than thunderbolts). the Direwolf is still 1.5x better than a king crab. 6 x UAC5's vs 4 on the king crab as an example.

The reason the thunderbolt is overplayed currently is that its the ONLY IS mech that can regularly match up to clans. what they need to do is IMPROVE the quirks on other mechs so that they match up. IMPROVE other mechs to match the thunderbolts, Timberwolves, Stormcrows and Firestarters. (both clan and IS alike)

Stop with the stupid nurf post for 1 mech or another and figure out a clue. thunderbolts are the FIRST IS mech to bring some BALANCE to IS. are they a little to far? not really they are still 10T lighter than a Timberwolf, and slower and have a lower alpha. Timberwolves can outbrawl them easily.

Even Lords who almost exclusively play MAX Clan mechs agree that they are NOT overpowered, but are in fact about right to make them competitive against maxed Clans.

This is so not even remotely true. IS was perfectly fine before the Thunderbolt 9S, and it would be without it.

I've played both sides of the fence, the two biggest things that are broken are Streak SRM6s & Thunderbolt-9s. The way the ERPPCs are mounted on the thing is a joke, and to give it HALF HEAT on top of that is absolutely, unequivocally stupid.

I actually mastered mine and rage sold it, because I was angry at being made to feel like I was cheating at the game. That's how stupidly OP it is.

And then you have the Streak-SRM-6, which you can boat as much as you please without ghost heat penalties, reaching out to 360m (wtf? Why not just call it an MRM at that point?), able to do 80+ point alphas for minimal heat that will ALWAYS HIT unless some piece of terrain happens to get in the way.


Third and fourth things that break the game are IS max-speed light mechs (hit registration; this is the only possible thing justifying clan streaks), and terrible spawn map design (both pugs and CW, that needs major revamp on both fronts).


Otherwise the balance is just fine, and anybody saying otherwise is either fooling themselves or selling something.

[Mcgral18]

Ralgas, on 03 February 2015 - 04:23 AM, said:

the 9q's quirks are enough to stand on it's own, especially if you consider the 9q has and extra 15 tons for cooling/armor. Quirking it won't bring more to cw, because it still suffers it's low hardpoints and huge hitboxes

The issue (and really the only issue) that makes the 9s a total whinefest target is it's hardpoint locations and how well it fits into a drop deck. Move those 2 shoulder hardpoints down onto the torso at the same height as the LT points and watch them dwindle in numbers

Edit: ooh and i cant wait till the 9s nerfs do roll in and ppl realize there's ac spam med and gauss sniper heavy meta waiting to pick up the slack, range won't change much, but the projecties will...............

The 9M can simply never compare to the 9S. It cannot mount the heatsinks to compare to 25% less heat. It also has a maximum of 3 ERPPCs, while if you're feeling suicidal you can fit 4 on the 9S.


If the 9Ss quirks are fine, the Badder Prime and Nova-A should also be fine. Both are tier 4 mechs which are based around ERPPCs.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Mcgral18, on 03 February 2015 - 05:05 AM, said:

The 9M can simply never compare to the 9S. It cannot mount the heatsinks to compare to 25% less heat. It also has a maximum of 3 ERPPCs, while if you're feeling suicidal you can fit 4 on the 9S.


If the 9Ss quirks are fine, the Badder Prime and Nova-A should also be fine. Both are tier 4 mechs which are based around ERPPCs.

Exactly......there shouldnt be any issues with PGI slapping some nice PPC related quirks on the NVA, SMN, WHK and ADR. And then a nice 30% heat dissipation bonus, paired alongside 15% less energy heat generation.

[Cragger]

Deathchoppa, on 03 February 2015 - 03:44 AM, said:

hang on, hang on... people are complaining (maybe not specifically here) about IS mechs not being equal to Clan mechs?
That is the point of clans, you all know that right? If a Stormcrow can beat aThunderbolt with both pilots of equal skill level, I'd say it's working as intended.
The main drawcard of IS mechs should be their extreme flexability, to create very personalised or niche loadouts. They should, tonfor ton, not be equal in firepower, manuverability, heat management or anything else to a clan mech. Quirks are nice, but don't go to far with them please.

On topic, it seems to me that heavy mechs are held very highly by the majority of players, and not just because of the Mad Cat. Feels like they have almost equal firepower to an assault, yet not as annoyingly slow. Plus lets be honest... the awesome is fairly ugly... and at the end of the day style > substance.

*Eye roll* Yes because because unbalanced gameplay really does wonders for long term longevity of a game with player versus player as it core. Have fun with Stormcrow, Timberwolf, Direwolf Online... oh wait that's already here. Had two solo drop games today where I was the only Inner Sphere mech in the entire match...

You sound just like the people that had thrown down money trying to justify their 90% win rate when the Clan Wave I arrived. Also, stuff the lore card where the sun don't shine. It holds no significance when the better technology isn't balanced out by the lack of numbers, logistics, restricted targets, and battle code the clans held themselves to. You can't just take half the battletech lore that supports your position and dismiss the other half that weighed you down.

Balanced competitive play > Lore for MWO or MWO isn't going to last all that long and PGI knows this. MWO doesn't have the option of doing it like battletech did where for every Timberwolf a clan player brought I could bring 1.91 Orions as an IS Player with the advantage in that I was as the player controlling both those Orions as a single entity with perfect coordination.

[William Mountbank]

Ralgas, on 03 February 2015 - 04:23 AM, said:

The issue (and really the only issue) that makes the 9s a total whinefest target is it's hardpoint locations... ...Move those 2 shoulder hardpoints down onto the torso at the same height as the LT points and watch them dwindle in numbers

Exactly this. There would be practically no reason to use them without the shoulder hardpoints. They are laughable as brawlers, and the arm hardpoint is far too low for sniping. Being able to expose next to nothing and fire off two ER-PPCs are all they are good for.
Remove the quirks and It'll still be used for PPC sniping. Change the shoulder hardpoints, and it'll be a mediocre laser boat that can't brawl for toffee.

[Escef]

cryonic, on 03 February 2015 - 02:32 AM, said:

Thats nonsense - you still see plenty of Jaegers and Catapults. The only IS heavy thats seriously declined is the cataphract, and that was down to the nerfing of the poptarting meta.

In the solo queue, most non-clan heavies are T-bolts. Either ERPPC or MPLs. I was actually running my Catapults during my stream this morning, and had fun with them. But by and large, most players running Inner Sphere heavies are running T-bolts. At least in my experience.

[Slumu]

The main problem with the 9S (especially in CW) is not the quirks itself , its the fact that whole teams build their dropdecks with them. Getting shot by 3 PPCs is one thing, getting instacored by 9 or more is something completely different. So I'd say, nerfing the quirks isn't that important (though a little nerf wouldn't hurt) but making sure there is some variety in teams and dropdecks.
Even though I have heard a lot of complaining about Clans only fielding Crows and Timbers, currently I see way more variety in Clan Dropdecks then I see in IS-Decks.

[Ultimax]

[MechWarrior5152251]

OMFG is it is possible for you whiney babies to crymore? I have never seen a TDR perform great. I have never broken 1000 damage in a match with one though I have done so with 10 other mechs including a SDR5D!

If you pathetic noobs could produce a single video or sceen shot of a TDR with an impressive score I might listen to your crys. Until then your tears are delicious.

My advice LEARN TO PLAY!

[Mcgral18]

MechWarrior5152251, on 03 February 2015 - 08:17 AM, said:

OMFG is it is possible for you whiney babies to crymore? I have never seen a TDR perform great. I have never broken 1000 damage in a match with one though I have done so with 10 other mechs including a SDR5D!

If you pathetic noobs could produce a single video or sceen shot of a TDR with an impressive score I might listen to your crys. Until then your tears are delicious.

My advice LEARN TO PLAY!

You've never broken 1K with a TDR?

Are you a Bad?

[MechWarrior5152251]

Mcgral18, on 03 February 2015 - 08:35 AM, said:

You've never broken 1K with a TDR?

Are you a Bad?

You tell me, post a score board of yourself in the last week...

http://i76.photobuck...zps1b0e44dc.jpg
How often do you score more than 1000 pts? I do it daily.

Edited by MechWarrior5152251, 03 February 2015 - 08:49 AM.

[Mcgral18]

MechWarrior5152251, on 03 February 2015 - 08:42 AM, said:

You tell me, post a score board of yourself in the last week...
http://s76.photobuck...html?sort=3&o=0

How often do you score more than 1000 pts? I do it daily.

As do I. It's very easy in a TDR. If you can do it in a FS9, the 5SS should be similar.

The 9S can also do it, but not as easily because the PPCs don't waste damage. You're likely to kill everything before getting 1k damage, unless you start farming.



Not getting at least one 1k damage in a WubShee is disappointing.

[uebersoldat]

William Mountbank, on 03 February 2015 - 01:13 AM, said:

An arm PPC is wasted on a TDR because it's too low. If you're getting struck by the full 3 PPC bolts, then you can unload a full alpha into him in return anywhere on his mech, along with that of all your buddies. Only the two shoulder mounted energy slots are worthwhile as PPCs because they're so high you can hill hump like a Raven, and twin PPC is really not a problem, especially at 1100m.

Best post ITT.

[MechWarrior5152251]

Mcgral18, on 03 February 2015 - 08:46 AM, said:

As do I. It's very easy in a TDR. If you can do it in a FS9, the 5SS should be similar.

The 9S can also do it, but not as easily because the PPCs don't waste damage. You're likely to kill everything before getting 1k damage, unless you start farming.



Not getting at least one 1k damage in a WubShee is disappointing.

OK now produce a screen shot of a TDR scoring that high or you are a LIAR....

[Mcgral18]

MechWarrior5152251, on 03 February 2015 - 08:55 AM, said:

OK now produce a screen shot of a TDR scoring that high or you are a LIAR....

You'll have to wait until I'm not typing on a toaster. Not sure if there are any on the new harddrive. If not, I'll have to make you a new one.

None uploaded either; just 1400 damage WubShee matches.


Soon™.

[Manei Domini Krigg]

Thunderbolt 9S is ok. There is nothing need to fix (c) PGI

Haters gonna hate, weepie gonna cry.